Schools in England should go back at Easter

[GinAndTonicOnIt]

I'm terrified that full return will result in increased transmissions. This will increase the chance of more mutations. Which increases the chance of a mutant that is resistant to the current vaccines.

Or just back with full wards, and yet another lockdown.

I loathe lockdown. I would give anything to wake up tomorrow and life be back to normal. But it's for this reason I think we should wait that extra bit longer. Get those rates right down and vaccines out, then have a return to school that won't result in another lockdown.....!

AIBU for thinking this? Am I wrong?

Totally agree. Allow the case numbers and hospital cases to drop more, roll out more vaccines and include school staff and the bus drivers so that they have some protection and the less likelihood of having more disruption after Easter.

If we open up too early and too fast we end up back at the start again and it all begins again and we have more illness and worse,

[quote BustopherPonsonbyJones]@Fembot123
Yep, key worker/vulnerable on a rota which has been made a lot easier by my kind younger colleagues. We are lucky because our parents have only taken places if there is a real, genuine need. Schools are still not safe though. The significant reason case numbers have dropped are because they closed. If they open fully, staff will be at more risk.

I promise I’m genuine. I promise I don’t want schools to stay closed forever. I just want to do my job in conditions which are regulated the same as other occupations or be vaccinated if this isn’t possible![/quote]
So are you teaching in school or not? I work at a senior school and it’s only us support staff in and it’s not about being younger in the slightest it’s more being less important.

@katieloves have to say I agree. I fully supported teaching staff but this is getting a bit tiring now .

[quote Ilovegreentomatoes]@katieloves have to say I agree. I fully supported teaching staff but this is getting a bit tiring now .[/quote]
As a member of support staff I’ve never been off in any of the lockdowns. Schools should re open if the science supports it, constantly moving the goal posts isn’t helping anyone.

Children of all age groups need to be back in school. All age ranges are suffering for different reasons and nearly a year into this if we start playing Top Trumps over different year groups, a lot will miss out for the second year in a row (esprcially KS2 & 3). All education matters, from young children learning basic skills in a social group, to A-level students bouncing ideas off each other and all children in between.

"Only missing a few more weeks of school" turns it into an even longer more isolating experience. It turns the Easter holiday into even more lockdown.

Cases FELL in the November lockdown DESPITE continuing education. Schools had varying degrees of disruption, but a massive number had none at all or slight disruption. Bubbles in and out by the week was not a universal truth for all schools.
The data shows that cases are down significantly from where they were in Autumn 2, and we're certainly not at the point in cases where we were in January.
We're past the worst of winter. The respiritory illness season is ending. So unless the UK is about to magically defy the global seasonal trends seen in the northern and southern hemispheres in the past year, we're not about to suddenly surge in cases in 3 weeks before Easter. The rates of decrease will probably level out a bit. The age structure of cases will shift, particularly with the bias of the vaccination programme now reaching 50+ in many areas.

A mild illness isn't a problem in itself. Lockdown is sold as cutting deaths and hospiralisations, but school children are not the demographic feeding that. Children always have been and always will be exposed to illnesses in school, but the social and educational benefits dominate by a considerable margin.

Children need to be allowed to learn with their peers again ASAP.
They need to restore their routines ASAP.
They need to rebuild their friendships ASAP.

Too much damage is being done by delaying for very little benefit.
And we know that schools won't magically be given the resources that they need to repair the damage done since March 2020 and they struggled with resourcing staff/ time/ space/ materials anyway, so we need to limit that damage.

@WhenSheWasBad

mummy

^Then another poster replied to me saying then they would say all secondary children, then all primary school children, then for boosters. I then replied agreeing.
Sorry if it's been hard for you to follow^

So once again. Has any poster actually seriously suggested that schools should be closed to most pupils until after all pupils have been vaccinated?
If I missed this genuine suggestion I apologise.

Most posters who don’t want schools to reopen as normal on 8th just want a little more time or extra precautions. Just seems a little disingenuous to suggest anyone is saying “no pupils back till they are all vaccinated”

It is just a little grating.

Actually it was another poster that suggested that people would call for all school children to be vaccinated, I just agreed with it. If you have another read through you will see.

@katieloves have to say I agree. I fully supported teaching staff but this is getting a bit tiring now

It is tiring for everyone and hard on everyone. Unfortunately things being hard doesn’t stop Covid spreading in schools.

Honestly no one is suggesting we shouldn’t open schools up to all pupils till September.

If we open after Easter, that only means 3 more weeks of home learning. But we gain,

5 more weeks of lockdown, so we should see further reductions in community infections.

5 more weeks of of the community being vaccinated. Plus time for the vaccines to take effect.

Better weather in 5 weeks time, allowing for improved ventilation and possibly more time outside for pupils.

Actually it was another poster that suggested that people would call for all school children to be vaccinated

So we are in agreement, no one has actually seriously suggested waiting until all children are vaccinated before schools are fully opened. Glad that’s cleared up.

I agree to an extent. Personally I think schools should start going back 8th March if cases are low enough,but on a very staggered basis. So perhaps one year per week, and careful monitoring. Cases start going up then they stop the going back

If schools are fully open on 8th March, I wonder if GPs are going back to seeing people face-to-face? They mis-diagnosed DD because they wouldn't see her, and relied on photos.

Honestly no one is suggesting we shouldn’t open schools up to all pupils till September.

They may not be suggesting that now, but we can all see how this plays out.

Easter comes ‘oh, just x to go before we’ve vaccinated all adults over 40. Hold on. Just another few weeks’

May mid term ‘we really should wait until all adults are vaxxed, but they’ll be in before summer starts, promise’

June ‘well what’s a few weeks and 14 year and up should really be vaxxed, that’ll be September, sorry’

We can all write the script now. Enough.

@WhenSheWasBad

Actually it was another poster that suggested that people would call for all school children to be vaccinated

So we are in agreement, no one has actually seriously suggested waiting until all children are vaccinated before schools are fully opened. Glad that’s cleared up.

We'll see

@TheKeatingFive

Honestly no one is suggesting we shouldn’t open schools up to all pupils till September.

They may not be suggesting that now, but we can all see how this plays out.

Easter comes ‘oh, just x to go before we’ve vaccinated all adults over 40. Hold on. Just another few weeks’

May mid term ‘we really should wait until all adults are vaxxed, but they’ll be in before summer starts, promise’

June ‘well what’s a few weeks and 14 year and up should really be vaxxed, that’ll be September, sorry’

We can all write the script now. Enough.

Really wish there was a like button on here as I agree 100%.

I am in favour of a staggered return, with all groups having at least some time in school before Easter.

The rationale for locking down was not to overwhelm the NHS. Numbers are dropping in hospitals, plus if you look at the data, a huge 40% of infections are happening IN hospitals, certainly in the first wave. There needs to be much more attention on vaccinating absolutely everyone within hospital settings quickly (I'd do two vaccines, Pfizer) and making hospitals safe- they are a lottery for anyone over 60 going in for even minor procedures.

Schools, there's a lot to learn from other countries, mask wearing, rotation (one half of the week off, one half in) and I don't mind if priority groups go back in for a week, followed by everyone at least some of the time.

My family who work in schools report a lot of children in anyway, so it's clear some children can be in school and the R rate come down, so I don't see the rationale for keeping everyone off. I don't know why people are talking about closed/opening schools, they are open, they are teaching pupils, my relative is in with 30 kids every day from 3 classes in primary!

Those that feel that is unsafe for their particular family can keep them off. I feel the danger to my teens is now quite acute, both have been offered anti-depressants and I don't feel like another 8 weeks of this stay at home life (especially if socializing is not relaxed) is feasible for them.

People are starting to break the rules anyway (I haven't), so it would be better for teh government to recognize that lockdown is straining and put in some sensible relaxation measures, by allowing outdoor socializing which is very low risk, and by allowing return to school for at least some age groups/all children for a week before Easter which is riskier but doable given we already have a lot of children in.

If you don't listen to what is happening, then people do secret stupid things, like socialize indoors, which is worse than allowing fairly low risk and/or socially high priority activities like returning to school. Also, if you don't allow some mixing prior to Easter, Easter will be one large rule-breaking holiday fest which is a worse outcome than a controlled and risk-relative path out of lockdown.

Not where I live!!

Cases are so low and half the children are in school anyway. It’s crazy to keep the other half off longer.

I do think it depends on where you live though.

Being realistic we know that barring a massive disaster there is absolutely no way all schools will be off until September - none. No one In government has that agenda. Nothing can open until schools are open.

Realistically 2 options he's doing are

1. all in On 8th March
2. staggered in a way - likely primary first until Easter

The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result. Cases are about back to September levels, when we last opened the schools fully. What could possibly go wrong this time. Only 1/3 of people are vaccinated, lots of CV and over 50s have not been. Gentle opening, staggered and we might avoid another lockdown. Big Bang opening and we will be back here again in June, having the same old discussion.

@TheKeatingFive

Honestly no one is suggesting we shouldn’t open schools up to all pupils till September.

They may not be suggesting that now, but we can all see how this plays out.

Easter comes ‘oh, just x to go before we’ve vaccinated all adults over 40. Hold on. Just another few weeks’

May mid term ‘we really should wait until all adults are vaxxed, but they’ll be in before summer starts, promise’

June ‘well what’s a few weeks and 14 year and up should really be vaxxed, that’ll be September, sorry’

We can all write the script now. Enough.

We may well get some people arguing for this.

I’m not buying the argument that we should do a stupid and reckless thing now, because of what a few people might say in the future.

Agree with you.

@YouKnowItsTrue

Not where I live!!

Cases are so low and half the children are in school anyway. It’s crazy to keep the other half off longer.

I do think it depends on where you live though.

But when it is something so fundamentally important as school do you think it’s ok for kids in certain areas- usually the most deprived ones- to miss out? Places like Leicester and Bolton have never managed to get their rates properly down. Is it ok for kids in those areas to be kept off indefinitely?

You can argue about other restrictions and the ages of kids to go back but I think it’s a slippery path if kids from certain areas only can go to school.

@mumsneedwine

The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result. Cases are about back to September levels, when we last opened the schools fully. What could possibly go wrong this time. Only 1/3 of people are vaccinated, lots of CV and over 50s have not been. Gentle opening, staggered and we might avoid another lockdown. Big Bang opening and we will be back here again in June, having the same old discussion.

We aren't in September we are in a completely new situation.

We won't be here in June having the same old discussion, this is a seasonal illness, rates are dropping in Europe anyway, even though they have vaccinated almost no-one.

I won't be having this debate in June because I won't be living a locked down life in June, I'm happy to go along with lockdown in the middle of winter to protect the NHS (and Boris's reputation as they mismanaged care homes and hospitals so badly they will probably be prosecuted) but fundamentally not at any other time, and definitely not in June!

‘The rationale for locking down was not to overwhelm the NHS. Numbers are dropping in hospitals, plus if you look at the data, a huge 40% of infections are happening IN hospitals, certainly in the first wave. There needs to be much more attention on vaccinating absolutely everyone within hospital settings quickly (I'd do two vaccines, Pfizer) and making hospitals safe- they are a lottery for anyone over 60 going in for even minor procedures.’

I think that is an excellent point and something that needs to be looked at when making decisions for how do do phase 2 of vaccines.

Not convinced that making comparisons with the November lockdowns helps due to the variant that came in later, not comparing like with like - or are we?

Places like Leicester and Bolton have never managed to get their rates properly down. Is it ok for kids in those areas to be kept off indefinitely?

So we should all sit in full lockdown with children not in school for another few months for social justice reasons and in solidarity with these places? I feel terrible for these children, the fact they live in a socially disadvantaged place and can't be properly schooled is a disaster, but not one solved by the rest of us sitting home too.

@HauntedPencil how ? We have a new variant of virus that is more transmissible, most people are not vaccinated and no changes are being proposed to how schools operate. What has changed ? Some people have had one vaccine, we are getting there, but not out of the woods yet.