After restrictions for a year do you feel more sympathy towards prisoners now?

[Gobacktothe90s]

After having restrictions on our lives for a year like when we can go out and see people, whether we can work or go to school etc I'm wondering had this changed anyone's views on prisoners and that they maybe don't have it that easy in prison being locked up 23 hours a day and only allowed out for meals and sometimes exercise?

I have to admit going through this past year I have thought without being able to do what I wanted in my own house like reading, Netflix, gaming etc after being restricted outside I would have found very hard and couldn't imagine being in prison with having nothing to do and can understand the high mental health problems in prisons.

Do you feel more sympathetic towards prisoners now?
Yes I know they have committed crimes but through this pandemic I read that they haven't even been allowed to mix at all and have meals in their cell to avoid the spread. I cannot imagine being in a cell eating,drinking and sleeping and that's it.

I've had exactly the same thought OP, and find it a shame that a lot of people here are just going for the 'they deserve it'.

First lockdown I was absolutely fine - working part time, sitting in the sun in the garden with a drink. This lockdown I have really really struggled to the point of regularly breaking down and crying. It has made me think that I'm struggling this much despite the fact I live with my wonderful DH, can choose to go outside for a walk any time I like, order takeaway if I want, FaceTime or call anyone I want any time I want, go to the supermarket every day if I wanted.

So it has made me think about those in prison and how tough it would be with all those choices taken away as well, plus the longest lockdown we've done about 3 months, so how it would feel knowing you had 5 years or more of it.

It also made me think about the newspaper headlines when I was a child: the outrage that "prisoners get Sky TV". And now I think how ridiculous it is to think of a tv as a huge privilege when you're imprisoned for years.

I'm not sitting here feeling sorry for murders and rapists one bit, but I think that the difference between those who've answered a knee-jerk 'hell no' to your post, and those who see where you're coming from is a difference to how we view criminals and prisons. They are full of people who haven't committed hideous crimes (and yes, lots that have who I feel zero sympathy for), of people let down over and over again in childhood and adulthood, of people with existing mental health conditions who are then locked away. I'm not going to go on about it any more because I'm sure I won't change the minds of the 'they deserve it' people, but female prisons are so full of women who have experienced abuse and have not committed violent crimes.

So to answer your question - no i don't feel sympathy for the violent people stuck in prison, or those who've chosen a criminal life such as the top runners in drug dealing. But yes, it has made me think about what it actually means to lock people away in prison. It has made me realise how low I feel with this lockdown and how much worse prison much be. It's made me feel realise how much of an impact on mental health prison must have for those already struggling - what would the feeling of 'what is the point' do to someone who already feels on the edge of society. And how no one is going to be rehabilitated from their time in prison- they just either get angrier at society or even more apathetic.

@KeepWashingThoseHands

There is a big difference between empathy and sympathy.

Can I empathise more what it’s like to have civil liberties removed - yes.

Am I sympathetic - no.

Point taken, I perhaps should have used empathise in my post instead of sympathy.

It’s a bit like being The Prisoner, rather than being in prison

@Teamox

I've had exactly the same thought OP, and find it a shame that a lot of people here are just going for the 'they deserve it'.

First lockdown I was absolutely fine - working part time, sitting in the sun in the garden with a drink. This lockdown I have really really struggled to the point of regularly breaking down and crying. It has made me think that I'm struggling this much despite the fact I live with my wonderful DH, can choose to go outside for a walk any time I like, order takeaway if I want, FaceTime or call anyone I want any time I want, go to the supermarket every day if I wanted.

So it has made me think about those in prison and how tough it would be with all those choices taken away as well, plus the longest lockdown we've done about 3 months, so how it would feel knowing you had 5 years or more of it.

It also made me think about the newspaper headlines when I was a child: the outrage that "prisoners get Sky TV". And now I think how ridiculous it is to think of a tv as a huge privilege when you're imprisoned for years.

I'm not sitting here feeling sorry for murders and rapists one bit, but I think that the difference between those who've answered a knee-jerk 'hell no' to your post, and those who see where you're coming from is a difference to how we view criminals and prisons. They are full of people who haven't committed hideous crimes (and yes, lots that have who I feel zero sympathy for), of people let down over and over again in childhood and adulthood, of people with existing mental health conditions who are then locked away. I'm not going to go on about it any more because I'm sure I won't change the minds of the 'they deserve it' people, but female prisons are so full of women who have experienced abuse and have not committed violent crimes.

So to answer your question - no i don't feel sympathy for the violent people stuck in prison, or those who've chosen a criminal life such as the top runners in drug dealing. But yes, it has made me think about what it actually means to lock people away in prison. It has made me realise how low I feel with this lockdown and how much worse prison much be. It's made me feel realise how much of an impact on mental health prison must have for those already struggling - what would the feeling of 'what is the point' do to someone who already feels on the edge of society. And how no one is going to be rehabilitated from their time in prison- they just either get angrier at society or even more apathetic.

Thanks for your reply you have worded your post what I basically meant to say! I do find it sad people can't discuss things without the standard 'What a batshit notion' Why don't you feel sympathy for this etc?. just because they disagree or don't see past the title and read the comments.

I have to be honest it sounds like my DD's experience of uni last term, no mixing outside flat, stuck in a cold dark room (as no lounge), no tv. Very heavy handed in her area initially and students were worried about going to supermarket, walking around the block on their own. The one positive is she had a focus to fill out some of her time. She hasn't done anything wrong, but trying to gain a degree in the hope that the future job she wants can make a different and benefit the world.

I remember being in halls in my slither of a room hearing the firedoors slamming around the building and thinking I'd hate prison. I was generally happy there, but there wasn't a total escape from other people although I did have my own room to retreat to.

Generally prison is the outcome of choices. The nature of those choices can fill a whole thread in their own right (people's life circimstances, abuse, the justice system) but on the whole people are in prison because they made a choice and have been proven beyond reasonable doubt to be breaking the law. (Simplistic, flawed statement)

Our prison system is woefully underinvested in and mainly used as a holding point to keep people out of society for a while. It is worthy of massive investment to address the root causes of people not coping in society. Education, diagnose SENs that were missed in school, therapy for those with traumatic backgrounds. Rehabilitation is more productive to society than pure punishment.

Since parkruns have been launched in prisons, people have benefited from that continuity in being able to continue seamlessly in the community and being able to volunteer. It's helped them to be purposeful and a part of the community and not be kept on the periphery.

My opinion hasn't changed, but it wasn't a simplistic ",they have it easy" opinion anyway.

No. I have never been able to muster up any fucks to give, when it comes to criminals.

This is hilarious!

Let me think for a second - errrrr, NO!

NO

Mind you, most Mumsnetters are incredibly sheltered and middle class so often don't realise how easy it is to commit crimes when you are desperate and have no other prospects
I agree with you but prison is a last resort punishment for the kind of crimes that I think you are talking about (eg. theft)

Yes i do. When you lookat the number of prisionors with some kind of SEN you realise how some could have been sent on a different path with earlier support. I also cant look at things like BLM and conclude there are some men in prison who wouldnt be there if they were white.

I'm noy ant prison but our justice system is imperfect.

Lol, no.

@sleepyhead1980

I have more sympathy for animals in zoos and factory farms. Prisoners no.

This ^

No

Yes, quite a lot more. I hadnt really appreciated the importance of personal agency vs creature comforts and how critical it is to mental health. I don’t really see how anyone will come out of prison a better member of society.

I don't think it's given me more sympathy, as I've always felt that prison is a shameful and abject failure of our society. It's unbelievable to me that when a person shows, by their actions, that things have gone very very wrong with them, our response is to put them in extremely expensive storage for a period of time, where their physical and mental health deteriorates, only to put them back out on the street with the same problems as they went in with plus a huge stack more.

The chances that people going through such an idiotic system will become useful, capable members of society are very very low. Some research has shown that in the UK an absolutely astronomical percentage of prisoners - 75% - reoffend within nine years of release. Prison is doing absolutely nothing for those people or for society, it just costs an enormous amount of money and people go in and out, in and out. It's such a waste.

A huge amount of prisoners, particularly women, come from extraordinarily difficult backgrounds, where they suffered neglect and abuse. Many have learning difficulties and mental health issues. Prison is the pinnacle of those people being entirely let down by their community and their government.

There are murderers in prison of course, but a large percentage of prisoners are there for other crimes, crimes that reflect the difficulties they've faced in life. Again, this is especially true of women. I'm not sure of the stats but I remember reading somewhere that a significant proportion of female prisoners are there directly due to the manipulation and abuse of men - they've been forced in selling drugs, they've attacked an abuser, they've robbed on behalf a gang that they're afraid of. Punishing those women just heaps misery onto misery, not just onto them but onto their children, some of whom will go on to be the next generation of exploited, hopeless people.

There are reasons why people turn to crime. Some people are violent and psychopathic by nature, yes, and there's a big question about what you can do about those. But many many others would choose a better life if they could, they just don't have that choice and that's a huge societal failure. Prison is a lazy, unproductive way to get undesirable people out of sight for a while.

No

No. Stupid question.

You must be mental to expect mumsnetters to have any kind of empathy or nuance. Lots of them will be jumping for joy if the planned restrictions on those who can't/won't get the vaccine actually happen. I'm not sure if this place has always been so conformist and idiotic, seriously though its a cesspool of doublethink.

I'm sure it never used to be like this, I could be wrong though.

I have more sympathy for animals in zoos and factory farms. Prisoners no!

This. Prisoners are meant to be punished.

Mumsnet isn't the right place for this question. It's far to stuck up and closed minded to even imagine that not everyone is in prison for rape and murder.

Being locked in one room for 23 hours a day because your parents fucked up your childhood and you turned to drugs and crime to make yourself feel something is just a form of torture. Most prisoners have mental health conditions. They don't get help for their mental health and then they are released from prison and are supposed to just fit straight back in again. It dosent work that's why the re conviction rates are so high.

Prison as a punishment doesn't work. I think it's an arachic way to punish humans.
There isn't much reform or rehabilitation. Just straight up punishment. It's cruel.

More needs to be done for people before they go to prison.

So yes, I feel sorry for prisoners who are forced into isolation for 23 hours a day.

Having worked at a cat B prison 20 yrs ago I had a huge amount of sympathy for most of them tbh. Most of them never had a chance of a decent life and that was compounded by piss poor mh provision.

I know what you mean OP. I was musing on this the other day. We've all found it very difficult to have our liberties curtailed, and it's usually the DM reading crowd making the most noise about it. Ironically they're more likely to make the most noise about how easy prisoners have it. I hope they'll perhaps be a little more introspective in future, but personally I doubt it.

One poster above puts it very elegantly - it's possible to have more empathy for someone without having sympathy for them.

Sadly you'll just get lots of idiots who won't read beyond the title (how like DM readers!) and will think you believe all prisoners should be released and recompensed or some such nonsense.

Prisoners are meant to be punished.

But they’re also supposed to be rehabilitated. I guess what lockdown has made me appreciate is that the MH impact of imprisonment makes rehabilitation very hard.

It's really sad to see so many ignorant comments on here. It's not as simple to say they made a choice, they deserve to be there. Their upbringing and background count for an awful lot, some people just don't stand a chance from the start.

I worked with prisoners facing release, helping them find housing and jobs, let me tell you about some of the prisoners I encountered.

A 25yo who was in prison for murder after killing the man who has sexually abused her from the age of 3, she stabbed him when she was 15.

A 25yo who was in prison for joint enterprise murder, because she was present when one of the boys in the group killed someone. (She has no part in it) she was 15 and I met her when she was 25.

A 75yo woman whose husband defrauded their company, he had full control of all their finances but because her name was on the paperwork despite her knowing nothing and him forging her signature, she was still sentenced to 8 years.
(There were a few cases very similar to this)

Tens of young addicts who due to parental addictions, and poverty didn't stand a chance and followed the same route as their parents or carers.

A 19yo who got caught up in county lines when she was 12.

A woman who was in for murder after she killed her abusive husband after 35 years of being physically beaten by him, jury didn't give a crap about the multiple police reports proving this.

The women in for prostitution.

A pregnant woman who killed her partner when he tried to 'beat the baby out of her'

I could go on and one. Life isn't always so clear cut. Some of you on your moral high horse need a serious reality check, although I doubt many of you actually give a shit, you just presume because they are in prison they aren't worth the time of day. Really sad reflection of society.