Do you live in France?

[lostinsociallydistancedfrance]

I live in France and was invited over for coffee by an English friend I haven't seen in a while, who said that they have been having play dates and sleep overs for their dc as normal. We have been socially distancing because I thought that that was required here. Are you socially distancing? This isn't a judgement thing, at all, I just want to find out what most other people are doing.

We live in France.

My non-scientific observation is that many, many people in France have continued to socialise at home, especially with extended family. The govt cannot prevent meet-ups in private homes. My french colleagues are continuing to eg. have lunch with parents / in laws / cousins etc, meeting up 2-3 families to share galettes etc.

Personally, I’ve had 1 or 2 friends over for coffee every couple of weeks. I air the place thoroughly, it’s just us at home, we sit as far apart as we can, and if the weather is good we go for a walk instead.

DS âge 13 has been meeting friends outside, in parks etc 1-2 times a week. I think he’s been to a friends house once.

DS âge 9 is not having play dates. I checked with his best friends mum and she wasn’t keen, which is fine with me. We try to take them the the park instead, when the weather cooperates. But I think we are not the norm.

As @miimblemomble says, the govt cannot prevent meet-ups in private homes, but the 6pm curfew still applies which rather puts paid to late dinner parties.

When we needed the attestations then it wasn't possible to justify "popping in for a coffee" as that reason didn't exisit on the forms but now that we can travel freely (within France) then it is perfectly acceptable to make your own risk assessment and visit whoever you like.

I have been going to see friends once a week and we have had people over to the house, but we still maintain appropriate distancing etc etc

Everyone still wearing masks if we are outside - it is compulsory here, but I don't know if that is the case everywhere in France.

The lockdowns have been long and tedious so if you feel comfortable then please go and enjoy a coffee with your friend - it's amazing what a difference such a simple thing can make.

We’ve been socialising with our neighbours and also one or two friends from work. We’re teachers, our kids are at the same school - we eat together at lunchtimes anyway with no mask and no distancing.

A friend drove up to see me for lunch two Fridays ago and stayed for the early afternoon. But with a 1.5hr drive she left a 4pm to be sure she got home. This past Friday I spent the afternoon with a good friend who is the wife of a colleague. And then I stayed the night and left yesterday afternoon.

Our children are 10, 8 and 4. The two eldest are still doing sailing, but it’s a very small group - 7 max and not all on the same boat obviously, so good distancing. Handball is off, music is off, and caté is off. We haven’t done any play dates. They just see friends at school.I might invite some non-school friends of theirs during the holidays if the parents agree.
They’ve got a stage de voile in the first week of the holidays (we’re the last zone this year) and then we’re going to see their grandparents who live in the alps - if there are no travel restrictions by then. But we’ll wear masks with the grandparents I think.

I would say we’re being cautious, but we’re not staying entirely to ourselves. I’m trying to make the most of it in case we get tougher restrictions again.

Can I ask a question? Out of curiosity I checked France’s current cases on worldometer and I noticed that France has a really high cases:deaths percentage ratio (most countries seem to hover around 3-5%) Is that because testing isn’t widely available or are there other reasons?

@Cornettoninja

Can I ask a question? Out of curiosity I checked France’s current cases on worldometer and I noticed that France has a really high cases:deaths percentage ratio (most countries seem to hover around 3-5%) Is that because testing isn’t widely available or are there other reasons?

France’s death rate isn’t 25% like that link suggests. That number doesn’t take into account lots of recoveries. Each country records figures differently, and some only update recoveries every couple of months. 25% of France’s Covid cases haven’t resulted in death. It’s a similar death rate to everywhere else (around 3% like you said).

DH is French but living in UK. From what his family have said everything is mostly continuing as normal....big family meals, la bise, apéro after work. They do have a curfew and restaurants/bars shut.

Apparently a big proportion of French people won't have the vaccine because they don't believe in it 🤷‍♀️ (not DH or my view BTW).

They do seem to have high death rates/infections and presume it's because the French won't stop certain traditions such as la bise but Macron won't shut anything more down or have another lockdown.

His brother also said they have to quarantine for 7 days from start of symptoms but must have a negative test at the end of 7 days.

@EileenGC thanks for answering, that makes sense. I didn’t really comprehend how low the outcomed cases were when I first looked at it.

The UK didn’t declare any closed cases till relatively recently for whatever reason so it was a simple confirmed cases minus deaths till that point (not accounting for cases that were ongoing).

So France hasn’t locked down since Nov? They are still mixing indoors and meeting up in groups etc (good for them) why is our death rate higher do we think and why have we been in lockdown for another two months? Is is the ‘Kent’ strain?

Is their healthcare system coping?

France came out of the last lockdown mid December although schools did not close - everyone over the age of 6 wears a mask and lycées (sixth form) are in only 50% of the time.

I think most people have been limiting get togethers, although they are not illegal. The curfew at 6pm means it's tricky unless you stay over. We have seen friends for walks and occasional coffees with one or two friends. However, I think that things are definitely getting slacker and the 'British ' strain as it's called here is gathering pace. Hospitals seem to be busy but coping but they have more ICU beds than the UK for a similar population size

@Delatron whatever they’re doing they’ve managed to keep their cases controlled (looks to be around 20k daily since January) which we didn’t manage to do here. I’d be interested in how they’ve managed that and where we might want to follow in the future.

France’s death rate isn’t 25% like that link suggests. That number doesn’t take into account lots of recoveries.

As EileenGC points out the number in that link are a bit "odd". to say the least..

FWIW from the santepublique website - last night's figures :

3,448,617 confirmed cases so far in France.
81,647 deaths.

Looks like about 2.4% if my maths is correct.

www.santepubliquefrance.fr/dossiers/coronavirus-covid-19/coronavirus-chiffres-cles-et-evolution-de-la-covid-19-en-france-et-dans-le-monde#block-266151

I think yes we should be looking at other countries and work out what is working and what isn’t.

I live in a popular tourist place and there are very large goups hiking here - like 20 or more - with no social distancing taking place.

However, we haven’t been able to go skiing at all.

Seems like the worst of both worlds to me, but hey ho.

@graywall

However, I think that things are definitely getting slacker and the 'British ' strain as it's called here is gathering pace.

I've also got that impression..It's going to be interesting to see if we're going to have case numbers ramp up post the spring holidays (which are already in progress for two out of the three school zones in France)

@notimagain

Yes, I'm sure we will as I have friends who have all been relatively cautious for the last couple of months or so, and now suddenly there are dinner invites and get togethers during the holidays

@notimagain the link is worldometer ( www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/#countries ) it’s pretty good but doesn’t take into account anything that isn’t declared by a country through certain channels. For France it looks like they pull their figures from here dashboard.covid19.data.gouv.fr/vue-d-ensemble?location=FRA

Aside from the covid info, their main page is actually really interesting for world stats if you’re after a bit of a time waster.

To answer other PP questions, no, France hasn't locked down this autumn/winter, neither have Spain or Italy and similar countries, despite a sharp increase in cases.

I think in general they have less rules, but extremely harsh consequences if you break the few rules that do exist. Curfew is strictly enforced. After months and months of only leaving their house with documents showing where they were going/for how long, and being fined if they failed to produce the required paperwork, everyone is taking it seriously.

Where I'm from in Spain, there is a Fri 3pm-Mon 6am local lockdown every week. You cannot leave your town during those 3 days. Every single Friday evening, without fail, my dad is stopped on the main road coming into town on his way back from work, and questioned. He needs to show several documents as proof of address, the police stop and question every. single. car. Every weekend.

My mum told me the other day about her friend who wasn't allowed to leave the supermarket for 3 hours because the police were called to do a check on a person whose neighbour was convinced they were Covid-positive. They called the local health authorities who gave them a list of all current positive cases in the town. The police then checked every single person's identity cards. This whole thing took hours and happens very often - the police have the right to check, and they do. Turns out there were 22 positive people in the shop (this is not normal there btw). They were all issued huge fines. I have absolutely NO doubt this is also happening in the UK, and in other places. But it's easier to not get caught. Selfish idiots think they can double mask and just pop down to the shop, they won't infect anyone. That's how Covid spreads.

I have a few close French friends and what they report is similar to what my family in Spain have been telling me. Their economies can't afford another lockdown. People are still socialising indoors (it's allowed, there would be no point in even banning it). There are strict measures in place regarding social distancing in schools, workplaces etc, but most things are still open. Schools never closed - but they socially distance properly and masks are compulsory from age 6, no exceptions.

They've played the balancing act and the hospitals are not empty by any means, but they keep going on. The country can't stop. Socialising with family is seen as essential and therefore, not restricted (not encouraged either). Our local hospital has cancelled non-urgent surgeries and cancer treatment for 1-2 weeks max at a time. They keep going, there's no another option.

Well I think their way is better than ours quite frankly.

Like a PP said, it'll be interesting to compare strategies in 5-10 years, and see how differently each country reacted throughout this. It's almost hard to believe but countries such as France and Spain have controlled their numbers with little restrictions. In a very similar way to other countries with much harsher restrictions, and even higher numbers...

Re. Testing. It is incredibly easy to get tested here, that’s one of the key tools of the govt. free rapid tests are available at pharmacies for anyone who wants one, no need to have any specific symptoms. Lab tests take a little longer, but are well organised and fast. The idea is that the earlier people know, the quicker they can isolate. Isolation is 7 rather than ten days, and sick notes for positive results can’t be downloaded from our personal health accounts without needing to go to a dr.

I’d be interested in how they’ve managed that and where we might want to follow in the future.

France has done many things different to the U.K. and atm we don’t know which has made the difference. But we are all holding our breath here to see if the variant anglais kicks off over the holidays, which because they are staggered, still have another two weeks to run - including Paris. There are no restrictions on travel within France, and I have no doubt plenty of kids are being shipped off to their grandparents as per usual, plus people going on holiday to the snow even if the lifts are shut.

I think people have got complacent because the numbers are steady tbh, too high but steady, and the hospitals are coping fine AFAIK.

@EileenGC, depends on your general stance about police/state interference but I think that supermarket example is pretty impressive.

Dd3 has only missed 2 days of school since September. She meets up with friends at weekends and has sleepovers. I meet my friends every Sunday for a walk followed by coffee, but we wear masks whenever we are close together (we sit down more than 1m apart before removing masks to drink). Curfew has stopped dinner parties but we have met some friends for luch. Other friends are more at risk so we haven't seen them. No-one my age is doing la bise. DD2 is at uni. Classes have started again and she has been to at least 3 parties this week. Curfew means that parties last 12 hours 6pm to 6 am.

Well the testing and the symptoms thing is something we could adopt over here. So many don’t have the ‘three’ typical symptoms so they don’t test.

I guess the vaccination program could be an issue in France due to speed and uptake?

We are seeing people too.

Having said that, With the curfew at 6pm and school ending at 4:30 there is no time to do anything in the week and so we usually see one family at a weekend.

We are in the south west and with the rain we have had over the last 2 months (the most for 40 years) and most indoor activities being closed, we haven't been out much as there is nowhere to go really.