Sunday Times just reported that all schools in England will be back on 8 March

[LimitIsUp]

This quote from the article:
"All schoolchildren will return to the classroom on March 8 under plans to start lifting the lockdown, Boris Johnson will announce in a national address next week.

Under the government’s blueprint to reopen society, adults will initially have only small new freedoms so as to prioritise the return of schools — a move ministers know will raise the coronavirus R number for infections.

Adults will be allowed to sit down outdoors for a coffee or on a park bench with one friend, or with members of their own family — a slight relaxation of the current rule, which permits outdoor meetings only while standing up.

The decision to reopen both primary and secondary schools goes against the advice of some government scientists. But the prime minister was swayed by faster than expected reductions in hospital admissions and infections."

I can link to the article but for those of you without a subscription, there is a pay wall

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/back-to-school-on-march-8-as-johnson-starts-lifting-lockdown-0v5zbz5bt

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• Title edited by MNHQ (it said October, we've changed it to March as reported) *

@DenisetheMenace

Lillith111

There is absolutely no way that wearing masks in the classroom is feasible. How would one communicate? The point is a return to face the face teaching with staff. There is no way there can be communication and learning when wearing a mask for 6 hours a day in the classrom“

Our son has asthma. He has been wfh for a year now, barr 6 weeks of P/T face to face in Sept./Oct.
He wore a mask (as did half a dozen classmates), his Korean 5 layer fabric mask with inbuilt medical filter, each day every day.
Sorry, but you are talking absolute rot. It’s perfectly do-able. He felt no discomfort at all. He wears it now when he goes for a walk.

I also have asthma and attend school. My point isn't about comfort it's that's with every occupant wearing a mask including the teacher productive learning cannot be done because there's no kind of communication which would be the whole point of returning to teaching. Teachers can stay 2m away with ventilation but productive learning can't be done with everyone in a mask. Zoom might almost be better. Just because it's feasible for one or two doesn't mean it's effective for thousands.

@WouldBeGood

Teachers should not be vaccinated first.

There is no need.

Vaccination is by clinical need. It’s a medical decision.

Those at most risk clinically are already being vaccinated You can see the priority lists that are available on line.

We are talking about the next priority groups after the over 50s/CEV obviously - the government set out their vaccine schedule last August and it includes everyone over 50 (plus CEV) in order of risk.

Why not vaccinate those most likely to be exposed?
Why not vaccinate those on who many people depend?

They should vaccinate police, prison officers, teachers as next priority groups after the current list is completed.

@Dustyboots

I think there’s some other thing going on with schools. Something BJ tried, paused because of public opinion and is now going back to.

There’s a reason they won’t make schools safe/ ban mask wearing/ won’t consider blended learning/ won’t vaccinate teachers etc

I don’t know what it is. Could be some idea of herd immunity amongst children? Eugenics? I have no idea. But it’s not just incompetence. I’m sure of that.

This is something I've been mulling as well. There must be. Why else must absolutely everything be a battle?

And teachers can't stay 2m away with ventilation. Have you ever taught 5 year olds? How do I do up their coats?

I also have asthma and attend school. My point isn't about comfort it's that's with every occupant wearing a mask including the teacher productive learning cannot be done because there's no kind of communication which would be the whole point of returning to teaching. Teachers can stay 2m away with ventilation but productive learning can't be done with everyone in a mask. Zoom might almost be better. Just because it's feasible for one or two doesn't mean it's effective for thousands.”

The tutor was not wearing a mask, it was not College policy. I don’t believe it is policy in most (English) schools.
Communication was perfectly effective.

I think it would be better to wait til after Easter. That will give another 5 weeks of vaccine roll out (3 weeks term time, 2 weeks for Easter holidays) - they can get all the clinically vulnerable, all the over 50s and all school staff vaccinated in that time.

I know Tony Blair isn't everyone's favourite politician, however in this article he's saying it would take 2 days to get all teachers vaccinated - which doesn't seem to take too much time out of the schedule. I would be happy to wait 2 more days for mine for teachers to get theirs. www.tes.com/news/coronavirus-schools-reopen-teacher-vaccinations-covid-safety-tony-blair

However, vaccinating school staff doesn't protect kids or their families - I think we also need rotas initially, masks encouraged (DS wears one happily), more testing (eg they could do regular testing - or if there's a case, isolate the close contacts and test the rest of the bubble). There's got to be better and safer ways to do it than what we did last term.

I was really pleased to hear Boris Johnson finally recognising the risks of new mutations if we let it spread freely amongst the unvaccinated today. Obviously classrooms if they have no masks and no distancing are prime breeding grounds for new mutations, so I really hope he considers that seriously when looking at school re-openings.

“They should vaccinate police, prison officers, teachers as next priority groups after the current list is completed.“

I can see the sense in both arguments. My daughters best friend is a teacher, 26, fit, healthy, no underlying conditions. I’m 56, reasonably fit, reasonably healthy, veinous insufficiency and arthritis here and there. I still have a dependent. She would much rather I was vaccinated first 🤷‍♀️ Tbh, so would I.

Dustyboots - seriously, eugenics? Don't be daft

There is absolutely no way that wearing masks in the classroom is feasible. How would one communicate? The point is a return to face the face teaching with staff. There is no way there can be communication and learning when wearing a mask for 6 hours a day in the classrom

They manage perfectly fine in other countries. Why do people in the U.K. always think we are so fucking special and different?!

I was really pleased to hear Boris Johnson finally recognising the risks of new mutations if we let it spread freely amongst the unvaccinated today. Obviously classrooms if they have no masks and no distancing are prime breeding grounds for new mutations, so I really hope he considers that seriously when looking at school re-openings.

This is one of my biggest fears too. If they let it run riot in schools again, there is a seriously increased risk of vaccine escape. Imagine that whole vaccination programme having been for nothing and having to lock down and do it all over again in 6 months?

How are children in care homes more vulnerable than those in schools?

Care homes are for old people. Care home workers were given priority to protect aged residents.

Ahmnotacat yes you're spot on

Ahmnotacat

This is one of my biggest fears too. If they let it run riot in schools again, there is a seriously increased risk of vaccine escape. Imagine that whole vaccination programme having been for nothing and having to lock down and do it all over again in 6 months”

It’s really alarming that so many people just don’t seem to understand that this is still a very real prospect, until all adults at least are vaccinated.
The idea that for the sake of a couple of months we could be throwing away a year ifvsacrifices - when some of our children have been isolated for the entirety - because some aren’t willing to go the final mile is devastating.

But but what if the virus mutates after everyone is vaccinated and kills us all?! What if? What if?

Or an asteroid takes out the earth and the only safe place is Greenland?

Today 22:13 WouldBeGood

But but what if the virus mutates after everyone is vaccinated and kills us all?! What if? What if?

Sorry, doesn’t work that way. It’s very difficult for a virus to mutate when the.number of hosts is severely limited, eg in an almost fully vaccinated population.
Nice try, though

WouldBeGood

Or an asteroid takes out the earth and the only safe place is Greenland?

Huh? Is Greenland not on “the earth”?

Hope it's staggered and blended to start with

But but what if the virus mutates after everyone is vaccinated and kills us all?! What if? What if?

Obviously you're taking the piss. But actually if the virus mutates to become vaccine resistant, we're back to square one (or possibly worse). Who wants to do a year like 2020 again? Not me. If we can reduce or prevent transmission, we can also prevent mutations from taking hold. Lots of scientists much cleverer than me are pointing this out, and (encouragingly and surprisingly!) also Boris Johnson. It's a real risk and taking the piss and laughing at people who are worried about it won't make it go away sadly. What it means is we need to be cautious with the opening up.

@DenisetheMenace

WouldBeGood

Or an asteroid takes out the earth and the only safe place is Greenland?

Huh? Is Greenland not on “the earth”?

It’s a Gerard Butler film 🤷🏻‍♀️

catsarecute

But but what if the virus mutates after everyone is vaccinated and kills us all?! What if? What if?

Obviously you're taking the piss. But actually if the virus mutates to become vaccine resistant, we're back to square one (or possibly worse). Who wants to do a year like 2020 again? Not me. If we can reduce or prevent transmission, we can also prevent mutations from taking hold. Lots of scientists much cleverer than me are pointing this out, and (encouragingly and surprisingly!) also Boris Johnson. It's a real risk and taking the piss and laughing at people who are worried about it won't make it go away sadly. What it means is we need to be cautious with the opening up.“

Unfortunately, people who make these kind of comments have no understanding whatsoever of the behaviour of viruses or why it’s vital to get as many people vaccinated as possible before we start to lift restrictions. An informed reply like yours is wasted on them.

WouldBeGood

Huh? Is Greenland not on “the earth”?

It’s a Gerard Butler film 🤷🏻‍♀️

If you say so. Relevant, then.

The virus is mutating. There are already four variants of concern in the UK.

@catsarecute

I think it would be better to wait til after Easter. That will give another 5 weeks of vaccine roll out (3 weeks term time, 2 weeks for Easter holidays) - they can get all the clinically vulnerable, all the over 50s and all school staff vaccinated in that time.

I know Tony Blair isn't everyone's favourite politician, however in this article he's saying it would take 2 days to get all teachers vaccinated - which doesn't seem to take too much time out of the schedule. I would be happy to wait 2 more days for mine for teachers to get theirs. www.tes.com/news/coronavirus-schools-reopen-teacher-vaccinations-covid-safety-tony-blair

However, vaccinating school staff doesn't protect kids or their families - I think we also need rotas initially, masks encouraged (DS wears one happily), more testing (eg they could do regular testing - or if there's a case, isolate the close contacts and test the rest of the bubble). There's got to be better and safer ways to do it than what we did last term.

I was really pleased to hear Boris Johnson finally recognising the risks of new mutations if we let it spread freely amongst the unvaccinated today. Obviously classrooms if they have no masks and no distancing are prime breeding grounds for new mutations, so I really hope he considers that seriously when looking at school re-openings.

Great post.

The new strains are a worry and indoor gatherings with no distancing surely provides the opportunity for them to spread and change. I really hope he follows the science and keeps children, staff and communities safe until the majority are vaccinated. ICU has a huge percentage currently of current non vaccine age I read earlier so we need to be very careful with regards to relaxing the rules.