Mandatory hotel quarantine in the UK

[Circumlocutious]

There was the New Zealand thread which touched on this, but I thought it’s helpful to have a more targeted discussion. Mandatory hotel quarantine for all UK arrivals, likely to be signed off on tomorrow.

Twitter thread from FT journalist discussing some of the complex aspects involved:

mobile.twitter.com/SebastianEPayne/status/1353657496716660737

Do you think it’ll ‘work’? (presumably its main purpose is to stop new covid variants from coming in). Why / why not?

I think people shouting to shut the borders probably have everyone they love around them or at least in the same country and have no idea how hard it is

Not true. We should have closed our borders in March 2020. And I have family in mainland Europe, and Australia. My mother is in her mid-80s and increasingly demented. My father is almost 90. I may never see my parents alive again.

But we should close our borders.

I can't see it working very well here, there will be too many people too 'special' for quarantine hotels and I don't include hauliers in this

I live and work overseas. What happens if my Mum dies or is seriously ill? Do I have to quarantine for two weeks before I can see her? When my Dad was ill, I got “the call” in the morning, was on an afternoon flight and he died an hour after I got home. My Mum is 87 and not in the best of health, snd this is on my mind a lot.

@QueenoftheAir then you are a better person than me ( genuinely . Not being snippy )

I’m getting to the point I’m utterly done in with all this . Never felt so lonely and hopeless

Dubai had a fantastic system - you actually had to wear a tag so they could see if you stayed in!

Alright, so if tests before departure is a potential leak point...

...Isn’t a hotel one too, from a human factors perspective? Hotels aren’t prisons, there are always multiple ways in and out. Even with security guards on doors you couldn’t stop someone who really wanted to leave.

There’s no such thing as a 100% perfect system. If tests aren’t foolproof, neither is hotel quarantine.

And there’s also the transmission risk from interaction with the staff. Even with contact minimised, there’s still a transmission risk placed onto some really low-paid people who did not sign up for this shit.

Besides, certainly with London you’d run out of hotel rooms in under a week. Probably similar in Edinburgh, Manchester, Birmingham etc. And I’m unconvinced that you could reduce travel here in the way that Australia was able to do — we’re too interconnected with other countries.

I still think it’s a cheap seats crowd-pleaser idea rather than anything actually sensible or workable.

@Changemaname1 I’ve cried a lot recently too

It’s hard to want to be a better person when you’re separated from the people who matter most isn’t it? I don’t even know that my relationship will survive and I’m so lonely. Life is pointless to me, and I doubt very much if others walked in our shoes they’d still hold the same opinion 🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️ look after yourself as best you can 💐💐

Given that people quarantined in hotels would need hotel services — food, laundry, housekeeping — how does the plan protect the workers who will be interacting with the ‘guests’?

The way I and others have seen it done (outside the UK) is that there's pretty much zero interaction.

Exact details vary from place to place but the basics are you go to your room and you only come out if there is an emergency (fire alarm/evacuation).

There's no housekeeping or laundry service.

Food is brought to your room door and the staff member then either taps on the door and runs to a safe distance before you can open it, or retreats to a safe distance and then telephones the room..that's about the only occasion you can open the door.

...and on the wider point there will have to be some exemptions, not because some people are "special", whatever that means, but simply because of the nature of some people's work.

I don't see why we should have to bear the expense of this as a PP suggests. Airlines have to check passports etc before people are allowed to board a flight here - surely we can ask them to check that people have a paid for quarantine hotel booking before they get on the flight too? I'm sure that a huge number of business meetings could suddenly be done online if they had to factor in the cost of quarantine.

If it is mandatory then I hope it is free or at least very heavily subsidised. Seems odd if you are in the UK anyway and meet the criteria for self isolation, you get £500... yet here you have to pay over £1k to do the same with the absolute minimum of comforts.

I could cry for the people who have loved ones abroad. My ex lives in Finland and his dad is in the UK. Everytime he tries to come here to visit, flights get cancelled.... and now there is this. His dad is late 80s, alone and can't Zoom or anything. Some people rub their hands together in glee at holiday makers having to pay out extra etc.... when the people really getting stung by this are those like my ex and his dad.

@LovingBob

I can't see it working very well here, there will be too many people too 'special' for quarantine hotels and I don't include hauliers in this

Sadly I agree with you.

How does it work in other countries though? Do they not have as many special people?

In China there are cameras outside the hotel rooms. If you step outside into the corridor they add another week onto your quarantine.

I really hope this is a hoax. People have to pay for this to be trapped in a room? This seems crazy. I do know a few people who haven't isolated after trips, but at least those that did were at home. I understand why people don't too.

On one level I think it's good, totally don't understand why we didn't do this last year. On another level I'm devastated, my Mum ((76) lives in France and as it is I haven't seen her for over a year - what happens if she gets ill or worse? If I went to see her I'd then have to take an extra 2 weeks off normal life to stay in a hotel when I come back. I can't leave my family, work, dogs etc for that long. And that's if I could even go, as the chances are there would be no flights. The journey here for her to visit is is arduous enough without 10 days on her own in a hotel room, and of course the flight thing will still be an issue. For months now we've been saying "hope to see you soon" but I just feel it's hopeless now.

I think it’s a great idea and we should have done it ages ago, although I have close family abroad (who visited when it was allowed and quarantined for a fortnight to do so). Breaking the existing rules means a fine which is peanuts when flights and holidays are cheap.

I just hope it’s applied to all the special people on private jets www.theguardian.com/business/2021/jan/21/wealthy-uk-flyers-opt-for-private-jets-to-evade-covid-and-lockdowns

@Londonmummy66

I don't see why we should have to bear the expense of this as a PP suggests. Airlines have to check passports etc before people are allowed to board a flight here - surely we can ask them to check that people have a paid for quarantine hotel booking before they get on the flight too? I'm sure that a huge number of business meetings could suddenly be done online if they had to factor in the cost of quarantine.

This is how NZ do it - you must have a confirmed quarantine booking or you are declined at checkin - no booking, no fly.

People like me have been apart from family for a year and probably have at least another year to go.

Those with family in Europe can surely do a few months or choose the quarantine (my birth country is repatriation only).

@notimagain

Given that people quarantined in hotels would need hotel services — food, laundry, housekeeping — how does the plan protect the workers who will be interacting with the ‘guests’?

The way I and others have seen it done (outside the UK) is that there's pretty much zero interaction.

Exact details vary from place to place but the basics are you go to your room and you only come out if there is an emergency (fire alarm/evacuation).

There's no housekeeping or laundry service.

Food is brought to your room door and the staff member then either taps on the door and runs to a safe distance before you can open it, or retreats to a safe distance and then telephones the room..that's about the only occasion you can open the door.

...and on the wider point there will have to be some exemptions, not because some people are "special", whatever that means, but simply because of the nature of some people's work.

My dh did two weeks in China in hotel quarantine: No housekeeping No laundry Certain floors are designated quarantine areas No interaction with staff as meals left outside room and you leave your empty dishes outside the room Communication with hotel staff through phone app Temp checked once per day by quarantine officials who come to your room Tested for covid on day one and day before release

I believe that this is the only way forward for the forcible future. The life will get back to normal in the U.K.

If this is to be done, it's going to be so costly and logistically challenging that it has to be done properly, with a view to fully and permanently reopening schools, the leisure and hospitality industry, and the UK domestic economy as a whole. Christmas would be normal this year. That's the only way in which it'll be justified.

Unfortunately there will be casualties - our world is far too globally interconnected for something like this to be straightforward. Families will be kept apart and not being able to see loved ones, which is horrible. But our current situation also has terrible casualties, not least when it affects the future of children who are entitled to a full education, to a social life, and all of us the ability to interact meaningfully with our loved ones, to form relationships. If this genuinely means no more lockdowns again, then it'll be worth it.

But until when? And will other countries follow suit? What will the EU do? Interesting to see Belgium today committing to a higher control of its borders, much to the anguish of the European Commission...

I still think it’s a cheap seats crowd-pleaser idea rather than anything actually sensible or workable

Nothing new there then ... as PPs have identified, the fault line is that it would have to continue for years until the entire world's been vaccinated, and they're hardly going to do that

@beingmoreme

I really hope this is a hoax. People have to pay for this to be trapped in a room? This seems crazy. I do know a few people who haven't isolated after trips, but at least those that did were at home. I understand why people don't too.

But this is part of the problem, people who did not isolate after trips.

I'm supportive of this. I don't think it's realistic for the UK to pursue a zero covid policy but tightening the borders is necessary while we continue to roll out our vaccination programme and with the concern surrounding new variants.

We also need to reopen schools and businesses as soon as possible. We can't continue to have school kids locked down at home and people losing their livelihoods while holidaymakers swan in and out of the airports,making a nonsense of those personal sacrifices.

How can this work so long as the Irish border remains open? Wouldn't Britain and Ireland have to adopt a similar policy simultaneously?

I am just wondering:

What happens to the airline industry
Travel businesses
Hotels in this country that are reliant on overseas travellers
Airports
Eurostar
Ferry services

Do we actually accept this might be the beginning of the end of international travel. I am not okay with that. Even if this arrangement is temporary it will be so damaging to the industries above they probably won't survive. So as long as we all know that we may never be able to go overseas again then go ahead.

I personally feel a five day hotel quarantine (if we must have one) would be enough test on arrival, test on day five - if both negative you can go home/onwards with your journey. Even that will kill the travel industry, but it might mean something is left.