To think Joan Bakewell needs to stick to talking on the radio

[lovelemoncurd]

Surely it's common sense to vaccinate more people at the moment rather than give 2 doses to less people initially and if people are confused then they just need to read more.

The Chief medical officer has stated that it necessary what more proof does she need?

I understand the complaint that people who had one injection consented on the basis that they’d be given two. I think they should have had their second immunisation and the policy changed for new people coming through the system.

Because the manufacturers of the vaccines haven't endorsed the approach and it's entirely untested.

Surely people should be allowed to challenge government policy? I presume that she is personally affected and has received one dose on the basis that the second dose would follow 3 weeks later.

Or would you prefer that the government wasn’t held to account?

She’s entitled to her opinion, as we all are.

I think we are all trying to respond to a changing set of circumstances though and she needs to appreciate that. The decision to vaccinate 21 days apart was based upon the previous strain.

Also, she a member of the House of Lords, a legislative body whose role it is to scrutinise government policy.

The WHO don't recommend doing this

She's right to bring it up so we can listen to the responses and get clarity.

Maybe they shouldn't have kept saying how important it was to have the second dose at 3 weeks and not to miss it, it made it sound like 3 weeks was the critical time for second dose

@lovelemoncurd

I think we are all trying to respond to a changing set of circumstances though and she needs to appreciate that. The decision to vaccinate 21 days apart was based upon the previous strain.

No, it was based upon the trial data.

There is a valid reason to change it but this isn’t absolutely universally endorsed amongst the scientific community.

There's been concern the delay could give rise to mutations that are resistant to the vaccine healthpolicy-watch.news/80792-2/

@Silvergreen

Because the manufacturers of the vaccines haven't endorsed the approach and it's entirely untested.

The Oxford AstraZenneca one definitely has. They were talking to one of the scientists who helped develop it on our local news last night. He also said that having looked at the data for Pfizer he could see no reason why the delay should make any difference and in fact the signs are it could actually increase efficacy.

She makes a valid point. The vaccine has not been tested with such a long gap.

If it turns out fine then twice as many people have had protection quicker. That would be a fantastic outcome.

But if it turns out the protection the vaccine gives when administered this way decreases and the people vaccinated get seriously ill with covid, then of course it would be a terrible outcome and a wasted effort to vaccinate them without doing it properly.

Most scientists and medics luckily seem to think it is likely to be fine and the 12 week gap won't decrease the overall protection the vaccine offers.

It's an emergency.
But she's free to express her opinion.

No, don't cancel Joan Bakewell FGS. She's entitled to her opinion.

Is it a sign of being out of touch with the times to say someone is entitled to their own opinion?😂

Giving 100 people one dose of an vaccine hoping it will work. Or 50 people people knowing it will work. Tricky.

I'd go for the latter and work on my production and logistics so everyone could have it as the manufacturer outlines.

Giving 100 people one dose of an vaccine hoping it will work. Or 50 people people knowing it will work. Tricky.

It’s not all or nothing. Both vaccines give you a good degree of protection which is topped up with the second dose. The Oxford vaccine appears to give better immunity with the longer gap.

I'd go for the latter and work on my production and logistics so everyone could have it as the manufacturer outlines.

This is wishful thinking.

I tend to agree with her to be honest. The manufacturers recommended a certain gap between the doses. The government and maybe some of their scientific advisers (but not all) tinkered and extended that gap.

I understand the reasons, but I think it is a risk. I would personally be happier going with the manufacturers' recommendations, whichever vaccine I am to be given eventually. I am not completely happy with the tinkering, although I know I will not have much choice.

They should follow the manufactures instructions.
If your doctor tells you ''take 2 pills a day'' you are stupid/mad to think taking only one pill a day will be just fine.

I'm more than happy to follow manufacturers recommendations.

Andrew Pollard, the head of the Oxford Vaccine Group and chief investigator into the trial of this vaccine, said that extending the gap between vaccines made biological sense. “Generally, a longer gap between vaccine doses leads to a better immune response, with the second dose causing a better boost. (With HPV vaccine for girls, for example, the gap is a year and gives better responses than a one month gap.) From the Oxford vaccine trials, there is 70% protection after the first dose up to the second dose, and the immune response was about three times greater after the second dose when the second dose was delayed, comparing second dose after four weeks versus second dose after 2-3 months,” he told The BMJ, referring to the MHRA’s summary of product characteristics.

Regardless of her views on vaccine gaps, she annoyed me intensely by implying that everyone over 80 was confused. Simply not so.

At least she didn't use "baffled" I suppose.

My family over 80s are all still waiting for first jab. So they aren't confused at all!

@tara66

They should follow the manufactures instructions. If your doctor tells you ''take 2 pills a day'' you are stupid/mad to think taking only one pill a day will be just fine.

And you would be very foolish to share your two pills a day with a friend hoping it would cure you both!

The Pfizer was initially given on the solemn assurance that it would be followed by the second dose in 21 days. That is what the first tranche of people were told and that is what should be honoured. If the government has now changed its mind then fair enough, the people currently being innoculated understand that, though they might not like it. But if this government wants to hang on to the slightest bit of credibility they might have left they need to stick to their promises for the tiny number of people this issue concerns.