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Covid

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Vaccine scheduled but not in highest risk group?

50 replies

VaccineQuestion · 08/01/2021 23:21

Someone I know (not over 80 and no health conditions) has been put on the list to receive a Covid vaccine because they know someone who works at their local who has arranged this. Does this sound right to you? I thought you had to be contacted and were only eligible now if you were over 80, in a care home etc.

OP posts:
Rachellow · 09/01/2021 00:49

My dad is a surgeon and managed to get his vaccine just before new year because he was walking past the area of the hospital they were vaccinating in at the end of the day. His nurse friend was doing them and called him in to get it. Like he probably would have got it in January but it was just luck he got it earlier.
Everyone needs to get it at some point and you don’t know what the health conditions of this woman are so I wouldn’t get too het up about it.

DrFoxtrot · 09/01/2021 00:51

We have arranged vaccinations for some volunteers that will be helping with our own vaccine campaign. To an outsider it might look like they are randomly getting it.

Truelymadlydeeplysomeonesmum · 09/01/2021 00:54

Not true unless she in Poland. They have been doing their politicians and famous people first. So this wouldn't surprise me.

ineedaholidaynow · 09/01/2021 00:56

For the ones who get it randomly at the end of the day due to no shows, how do they arrange the second dose? Do they then take place of the no show for their second dose? Does the no show go to the back of the queue?

Kapalika · 09/01/2021 00:58

It’s absolutely true. I had my first today, as the vaccine would have gone to waste. They had until 2pm to use all the vaccines.
Due to people not turning up. It is basically a vaccinate as many as possible situation.

Kapalika · 09/01/2021 01:00

@ineedaholidaynow

For the ones who get it randomly at the end of the day due to no shows, how do they arrange the second dose? Do they then take place of the no show for their second dose? Does the no show go to the back of the queue?
It was logged on the system with my own gp surgery. I will have to either go back to the original surgery or my own one. They will contact me
Busygoingblah · 09/01/2021 01:31

Being put on a list to be vaccinated and actually receiving the vaccination are too very different things.

Staff not yet eligible have been able to book a jab through a link that was forwarded by eligible staff. They have been turned away on the day as the hospital are being very careful as they have to prove they are following the priority list.

ProudAuntie76 · 09/01/2021 01:39

I know someone in their early 70s who is retired who received it very early on in the roll out, by mid December. She used to be a social worker, so I’m imagining it was through her connections.

Someone at work was due to be done and didn’t show up. Turns out they’d got their husband who works in a care home to ask if the care home would vaccinate her too...even though she doesn’t work there. I had requests for spouses and partners to get vaccinated with our staff.

CatVsChristmasTree · 09/01/2021 01:51

I can understand the rationale of giving them to people who don't qualify, if the alternative is wastage. But thst is poor organisation of resources, there should be a reserve list of actual, eligible people.
One of our GPs (I'm a practice nurse) was ranting about a GP in another local practice getting her husband a vaccine. Understandably, as we won't be getting ours for another week (apart from a handful of staff who have got it through the main hub an hour away that started weeks ago), when we start vaccinating our over priority group 2 patients. Even then, we are only getting enough to do about a third of them as we are doing it at a shared site and getting one box (975 doses) for all the surgeries in the town and surrounding area.

It's already become another NHS postcode lottery, with some areas already moving to priority group 3.

LemonadeFromLemons · 09/01/2021 09:04

@Butterfly44
I thought that too. I thought surely it would all be managed on emis/hospital equivalent with a code added to those who qualify and then a follow up code once they’ve had it. So I was surprised but I was told that a new IT system had been put in place specifically. Maybe my friend was bullshitting.

@Busygoingblah
This matches what I heard, interesting.

Mindymomo · 09/01/2021 09:28

Hopefully we are all on a list somewhere. I have heard from someone local that he in his 80’s turned up for vaccine with wife in her 70’s and they gave both vaccine. They said they were getting more doses out of the vials and otherwise it would have gone to waste. I have absolutely no problem with anyone getting it, so long as it’s not wasted.

KarmaNoMore · 09/01/2021 10:04

The Pfizer vaccine once prepared cannot be saved for the next day if it has not been used. I have heard of people being pulled from the street outside the vaccination point to get the vaccine rather than waste it.

If she know someone in one of those vaccination points it is no surprise she has been given one.

LemonadeFromLemons · 20/01/2021 16:50

Looks like it’s true! Why design a system that can be easily circumvented?? Sad

news.sky.com/story/covid-19-vaccine-booking-website-criticised-after-queue-jumping-claims-12193544

TheAnswerIsCake · 20/01/2021 17:21

As it says in that Sky News article, what really needs to happen is to prevent people who aren't eligible from booking in the first place. Once they have booked - potentially taking the slot from someone who is higher priority, it seems fairly pointless turning them away, as that slot can't then be used by someone who is higher priority - the ship has sailed.

When I went for mine, two people (one on front of me, and the one behind) were both sent away as they weren't actually health care workers. They had obtained the link to book from elsewhere. However, they had obviously lied during the booking procedure, since we were required to provide a lot of detail about where we worked during that. This was followed up with ID checks at the door - hence people being turned away. I think the system in other areas is different though - if no questions are asked during the booking and you don't have to lie in order to book a slot, then that really is a failing of the booking system. It's hard to blame people for doing it.

The problem is also that preventing ineligible people from booking whilst also allowing the system to run quickly is difficult. There is no central database of "front line heath care workers" and it is not something that is attached to NHS numbers for quick identification. Preventing those who are not in the age related priority groups should be easier, as this can be identified from NHS number alone. But the system cannot simply run on age, because the criteria do not run on age alone. I'm sure a more secure and robust system would be possible, but it would waste precious time setting it up.

I tend to agree that getting the vaccine in to as many people as possible is the aim, but I suppose there needs to be collective social responsibility to avoid too much of the elbows-out, survival-of-the-fittest that inevitably occurs when large groups of people all want the same thing.

IrmaFayLear · 20/01/2021 17:54

Actually I’m not as cross about this as I thought I would be!

It strikes me that the sort of person who would lie to get a vaccination is also the type to be a rule-breaker in general and therefore more likely to spread covid... so if they jump the queue then it’s not 100% a lose.

I actually have a family member who has had the vaccine (40s, no health conditions). Their best friend is a GP and they vaccinated all their friends and family! Dh was all for calling the Press (for about five minutes) but what’s done is done.

LemonadeFromLemons · 20/01/2021 19:53

It could easily be solved by making the link usable only one time (by having an changing number on the end of each link sent out) like they do with surveys. It wouldn’t need to identify the individual specifically and is incredibly easy to do IT wise.

movingonup20 · 20/01/2021 19:56

My gp has vaccinated people at the end of the day when there was vaccine left due to no shows. She with a smile said I should book my appointment a smear if you are interested) at 5.45 and I might get lucky despite being younger (my new job is public facing with the elderly just not in healthcare

TheYearOfSmallThings · 20/01/2021 20:03

I am sure there are ways to jump the queue, especially if you have friends who will bend the rules.

However, unless you are assuming somebody else's identity (which would definitely be possible) there will be a record that you received X vaccine on Y date. This is necessary in case of adverse effects, but would also serve to show fraud.

JM10 · 20/01/2021 20:16

@TheYearOfSmallThings

I am sure there are ways to jump the queue, especially if you have friends who will bend the rules.

However, unless you are assuming somebody else's identity (which would definitely be possible) there will be a record that you received X vaccine on Y date. This is necessary in case of adverse effects, but would also serve to show fraud.

Of course your record will show you had it, but do you think someone is going through all the records of people who have had it outside of a risk group to pursue a fraud charge? The hospital might get in trouble, the person almost certainly won't.

You'd need to prove they shouldn't have had it too, so not given it due to working/volunteering there or passing by when there were spares.

I totally agree it's wrong, I just don't think individuals who get it when they should t will face any consequences. Those who forward links or book them on when they shouldn't - I hope they do.

middleager · 20/01/2021 20:23

My Dad, 76 and stepmother, 60, had the vaccination a couple of weeks ago because her daughter is a GP's receptionist and there were two no shows at the end of the day.

AllThatFancyPaintsAsFair · 20/01/2021 20:28

@movingonup20

My gp has vaccinated people at the end of the day when there was vaccine left due to no shows. She with a smile said I should book my appointment a smear if you are interested) at 5.45 and I might get lucky despite being younger (my new job is public facing with the elderly just not in healthcare
That's a totally valid thing to reduce any wastage, the issue here is with fraudulent advance booking which takes slots away from those in greater need.

There was a thread about this the other day that got deleted and lots of posters refused to believe the OP that it was happening.

A simple one use only link would seem to be the obvious way to stop the abuse

TheYearOfSmallThings · 20/01/2021 20:55

do you think someone is going through all the records of people who have had it outside of a risk group to pursue a fraud charge?

No! But if someone reports to the CEO of an NHS body that a named member of staff has been fraudulently giving access to the vaccine, the organisation will investigate. It is the staff member rather than the recipient who would be sanctioned.

DinosaurDiana · 20/01/2021 20:56

@StatisticalSense

This should not be happening and if you are aware of the identity of the member of NHS staff who is abusing the system they should be reported.
This 😡
JM10 · 20/01/2021 21:28

It is the staff member rather than the recipient who would be sanctioned

And I hope this does happen. I've heard on here of people sharing links to book with loads of people, if I did that and was caught I would expect to get a disciplinary.

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