If you're keeping primary kids home - how and why?

[Indecisivelurcher]

What I mean is, those parents choosing to keep primary aged children at home for a couple more weeks. Why? As in, do you think something will change in a couple more weeks? Options being schools will shut totally. Or the new variant will be shown to be no higher risk to children? I suppose I mean, what good is a couple more weeks? And how, I mean how are you managing around work, are you using leave? Are you working around the kids? In the first lockdown I was luckily able to reduce my hours, and then later on dh was furloughed. But neither option is available now as it would be personal choice.

Heck! Well that sort of thing does sway the decision making process. Which is the point I guess.

The Local Authority could decide to prosecute parents for non attendance in which case the fine could be up to £2500 and a criminal record. In practice that's unlikely to happen. The usual sanction would be a £60 fine rising to £120 if not paid in 21 days.
Whether councils want to be seen to be fining parents, particularly where there's a vulnerable household member, is another question.

@AlbertaAlberta

How are people squaring it with the school? That is my only concern. We are all low risk afaik and dc really wants to go back, but I'd honestly rather she wasn't!

We are in a Tier 4 area near London which has somehow escaped the closures. Our council and MP are a bunch of absolute raving mad Tories who seem to think all restrictions should be lifted to save the economy. So they won't be putting pressure on government to close schools in the area.

If we did keep dc off, I thought we risked thousands of £ in fines and a criminal record?

I suspect some people will use "having symptoms" to buy 10 days at home and they will be hoping that the government closes face to face school in those 10 days.

There is no evidence that the new strain is more dangerous but 70% more transmissable means more likely to catch it and bring it home. Many kids live with CEV family members and kids don't necessarily escape long Covid.

I live in an original Tier 4 area where it's remote learning so no skin in the game and I suspect that closing some T4 schools but not others is adding to the confusion and fears. If the government had said that closed areas had rates for 700+/100000 then it would make things clearer. At the moment it looks like T4 kids in the south are being kept safe while kids in other T4 regions are not.

I'm keeping mine at home because I am pretty certain schools will be closing soon anyway and I don't see the point in exposing them for the sake of a few days. I am an a&e nurse and we have seen an absolute explosion in cases in the last week or so, and we aren't even seeing the ones who caught it at xmas yet.

I will tell the school we are self isolating. DH was all for being honest but I pointed out that the school probably won't thank you for that- unauthorised absences probably involve paperwork and further checks for them.

It must be, why not just give vague illnesses why say covid related? I

I think a lot of people are having problems with the Xmas restrictions too. It's not safe to see family who've self isolated for 2 weeks (remember masks and social distancing were advised when not eating and drinking) bit sitting shoulder to shoulder with others is ok?

I think a decent majority have been mixing and socialising freely and nobody wants to risk catching Covid that way too.

I suspect a lot of people will use self isolation as an excuse not to send their kids in on Monday

Wank puffins as far as I am aware they aren't legally obliged to see that info.

I'm surprised at people mentioning covid symptoms, just say d and v or something...

It's 48 hours after last episode isn't it?

Ewo has been kindly giving advice, she would prefer people to be honest, it's them that contact the family and organise the fines and she said they are being sympathetic at the moment.

I suspect some people will use "having symptoms" to buy 10 days at home and they will be hoping that the government closes face to face school in those 10 days.

Yes, that's exactly what I'm considering for 7yo DD.
12yo DS will be home doing remote learning anyway.

We're in a tier 4 area with around 500 cases per 100,000 and rising and right next to an area where the schools are shut.

I know several people with covid right now. I didn't in March.

I feel it's irresponsible to send the kids back to school with the new variant rising, and given the government's repeated fuck ups, they'll send us all back to school then in a week or two go "oh, sorry we have to shut schools now because the science tells us to, things have changed" when actually if they acted sooner and if T&T was fit for purpose we might not be in this situation in the first place.

I'm not sure exactly what we're going to say - I've got till Monday morning to work it out, but I'll lie so I can keep DD at home without getting fined. I need to find a lie I can convincingly tell her too, though as I don't want to put her in the position of having to lie to her friends and teachers.

I'm doing it to buy time and because I really don't want to catch it - I'm in a high risk group and DP's health isn't great either. Hopefully covid cases will go down and they'll be back in school soon. But I strongly suspect they'll continue to rise and we'll have a much clearer picture in a week or so.

I am keeping Y4 DS off. I do not believe it is safe for him or his teachers.

I am hoping the schools will close and there will be online provision which I will have to try and support around WFH (3 / 4 days a week) and DH WFH (all week)

If not then I guess his education will be on hold. He's bright and I am not overly concerned assuming it is short term. If it goes on longer I may look at taking leave and trying to home school etc.

I think they'll close soon anyway. This article is from about an hour ago:

Primary schools reopening: Call for remote learning as Covid cases rise

Pressure is growing on the government to keep all schools in England closed for two weeks after the Christmas break amid a surge in coronavirus cases.

Teaching unions have told primary school staff it is unsafe to return to work, and called for remote learning.

Head teachers have begun legal action to force ministers to reveal data behind the decision for some schools to reopen on Monday.

Labour has accused the government of "creating chaos" for parents.

Most primary schools in England are expected to open on Monday while secondary schools will reopen on a staggered basis, with exam year pupils returning on 11 January and others returning a week later.

On Friday, Education Secretary Gavin Williamson announced that all of London's primaries would remain shut on Monday - reversing a decision to keep only schools in certain boroughs closed.

He said the closures were a last resort in the face of a fast-moving situation.

But unions said extending this across the nation was "the only sensible and credible option".

Meanwhile, president of the Royal College of Physicians, Prof Andrew Goddard, told the BBC the new highly infectious strain of coronavirus was spreading across the country, adding: "All hospitals that haven't had the big pressures that they've had in the South East, London and south Wales should expect that it's going to come their way."

The UK's largest education union, the National Education Union (NEU), said all primary and secondary schools should remain closed for a further two weeks after the school holiday, adding it was advising members against working in school.

The National Association of Head Teachers (NAHT) called for all schools to move to home learning for a "brief and determined period for most children", and said it would issue guidance to head teachers recommending they take no action against staff who refused to return to work if they felt unsafe.

In a letter to the education secretary, the NASUWT called for an "immediate nationwide move to remote education" as the "only sensible and credible option" to minimise risk, while the GMB, which represents support staff, called on Mr Williamson to apply "common sense".

Geoff Barton, general secretary of the Association of School and College Leaders (ASCL), said the government had "made an utter shambles" of the school return plans.

The ASCL and the NAHT have started legal action to get the Department for Education to share any information showing "why they think it is safe to reopen schools on Monday, given the higher transmissibility of the new Covid-19 variant".

From this article: www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-55511662

@fastwigglylines yeah, I'm trying to come up with something that Dd won't have to collude with - not fair on her.

I was going to say we had to look after my nephew in an emergency on Friday with Dd there and he came down with symptoms sat and tested positive so we will SI for ten days as procaution?

I am undecided. I have four children, two of which have ALNs including autism. Since half term (23rd Oct) my children attended 7 days of school due to constant isolations. The changes are very very difficult for my children with ASC, it's been a really difficult time for them. They coped beautifully during the Spring/summer lockdown but it's been very difficult since with all the disruptions. A lot of children have had it here and while not hospitalised they have been very poorly.

Staying home and home educating means consistency and that's important for us, one of my children gets so anxious at school and the changes he is losing weight and now underweight, he's eaten beautifully for Christmas and his weight is back up to the 9 percentile, if it drops again they will likely stop medication which will create further problems for us.

The other child sucks his thumbs and cuddles everyone, has no concept of social distancing etc. At home I have to support him and use social story cards to support him to use the bathroom (and other things) and so he's more at risk to picking it up and transmitting it.

Although, for us it's less about the actual virus and more about the situation and disruption it causes. I'm in Wales where cases are extremely high especially in my area.

From what I have seen from other parents is that they want to keep the children off as it's suspected that the first few weeks would be particularly disruptive and potentially higher rates of infection and so they want to give it a few weeks for things to settle down.

Honestly. I don't know what the answer is. My business died because of COVID, so I'm home now which makes the situation much easier if they close for me. I don't quite understand the logic in why they call it lockdown yet schools are in. Also the new mutation is considered to be more transmittable to children.

I really feel for school staff though and think they should be offered more security from this virus.

“At the moment it looks like T4 kids in the south are being kept safe while kids in other T4 regions are not.”

Not true. I’m in the South. Over two hours south of London. We are tier 4 and at the moment our primary schools are reopening next week. The South is not just London and the Home Counties!

I am keeping ds off for the first week, I have got type 1 diabetes and it is more about me catching it from him, we haven’t mixed with anyone over Xmas and I just want to wait and see what happens after school goes back

It’s only in London (and Milton Keynes) in the South that schools are being shut. We’re in Bucks with very high rates per 100,000 and kids going in next week. Plus we have the mutant variant down here!

[quote WankPuffins]@fastwigglylines yeah, I'm trying to come up with something that Dd won't have to collude with - not fair on her.

I was going to say we had to look after my nephew in an emergency on Friday with Dd there and he came down with symptoms sat and tested positive so we will SI for ten days as procaution?[/quote]
Just looking at the government guidelines; they say you need to isolate if someone in your support bubble has symptoms or has tested positive. So I think I'll say that.

We're in a bubble with DD's best friend and her mum who may have it and we saw them before Christmas, I'll tell DD it's because we saw her (hopefully she won't think too hard about how long ago it was!)

www.nhs.uk/conditions/coronavirus-covid-19/self-isolation-and-treatment/when-to-self-isolate-and-what-to-do/

gosh, my local FBk community group is like a mini-rehash of everything said on MN. I don't trust you lot (anon) to speak a word of truth about your real lives, but FBk posters are real names. Sobering.

I can tolerate risk so would like to send DC but the option doesn't exist for us. I hope that lots of teens don't disengage from education completely for many years to come, and that future creation of "enough" nurses, social workers (etc) doesn't get horrendously delayed.

Looks like schools are taking it into their own hands. Some of them, anyway.

We've got just under 30 primary schools in our town (SE England, Tier 4). Four primaries have said they're staying shut on Monday, so far. (Except for keyworker and vulnerable DC).

I don't forsee them closing now. Boris is on Andrew Marr tomorrow, presumably to tell everyone how safe schools are. I'm going to have to lie about symptoms and buy time. Ffs. Surely they know what will happen if schools reopen?

Becayse in order to be abke to work duribg the dat, i meed sone childcare assistance from my parents, who are vulnerable. If dc are at school, parents cant have them. If dc are not at school, we can essentially isolate outselves from the world and my parents can help with childcare.

@NotSoHappyNewTier

I'm sending my kids in because I'm a key worker.

My point is - I understand why people would keep their kids off to reduce transmission to more vulnerable people.

I don't understand why people worry about their children's health. It's in the face of every piece of evidence there is.

@NotSoHappyNewTier

I’ll post it again, *@oohmamama* from Dr Zoe today:

I don't understand why you've reposted this?

She's saying schools should shut to stop transmission from schools to the vulnerable because community transmission is high. I agree with that.

She's not saying that there's any perceived increase in risk to children's health.

I think attendance fines still being in place is completely horrendous. I don't understand how they can legally be enforced now, when all parents have heard in the news this last week is how out of control things are and now even the teachers unions saying how unsafe it is, how can we be fined for not wanting to send our children into this situation? We trust these teachers with our kids every day and they are saying it isn't safe!

I think i might do. Im a stay at home parent anyway. I have a 2yo and a 5yo. I think I might keep the 5yo home for another week maybe. I took him out of school a week before the government closed schools in the first lockdown. I went by what private schools and the rest of Europe was doing rather than what the government said. I dont trust them, they only care about money.
I'm not too afraid of covid myself but I dont want my child to spread it and someone ends up dying. I personally think if I can keep my child at home maybe I should? I just ring him in sick everyday... I dodnt declare I was doing it because of covid... they didn't question it at all I think because they were glad. As far as I can see the less children in the class the easier it is for the staff to keep a good distance and follow good covid safe cleaning... so I think I will be keeping my son off for a while.
My husband doesn't agree with me at all... he's a nurse. He rightly says that my son loves school... but personal I dont think its worth peoples lives. My son will get to go back to school eventually and he's got over a decade of school to do... I dont think missing a few months this year will really do him any harm at his age. He's not behind or anything and he works well at home.. it is sad that he doesn't get to see his friends but he will see them again eventually.

DH is vulnerable (blood cancer & respiratory disease) so I will be keeping my DC at home a bit longer until I feel the Covid numbers are at a lower level and the risk to DH is less.
My D.C. was happy being home schooled during the original lockdown so I don’t feel their educational experience will suffer at all.