Is it right that Teachers/support staff are expected to carry out testing?

[CheltenhamLady]

Just that?

Is it right or fair?

I would not expect the quick tests to be difficult to do, but I have not seen any. Has any of you done one?I think the problem is how to protect those doing the testing, and pupils from each other.I would expect them to ensure SD during the test. Be outdoors.

There isn’t much hope of ensuring social distancing in schools-they simply have too many children in them.

The quick tests are the same as the normal tests-nose and throat swabs.

It won’t be outdoors either-Am sure the guidance says it has to be indoors.

So al the potentially infected children will stand in a room all together being tested and then for half an hour plus whilst they are all developed. Then they’ll be sorted into positives and negatives and their parents phoned or sent back to class.

@lockeddownandcrazy
They can't - it comes under 'other reasonable duties' in the contract as pastoral care.

No it doesn’t, it’s a medical procedure that doesn’t come under reasonable duties. If you’re asked to carry out any medical needs, you have a right to refuse. The Unions have confirmed this as well, so staff can refuse.

I will certainly be refusing. My goodwill, like many other education staffs, has run out now, we aren’t willing to take on any more.

Ironically if they make masks compulsory the difference it could make will look like the testing is working.

The masks should have become compulsory in secondary once thing were obviously going to pot.

Better late than never

AaronPurr when DS was in Y1 I had a phone call to say DS had a “splinter” in his arm. I told them to just remove it and they said they weren’t allowed and could I come up. I stomped up there all cross muttering “bloody ridiculous “ to find an ambulance and a paramedic waiting for me so I could give permission for them to administer morphine.
Let’s just say it was a bloody big splinter - they didn’t want to panic me on the phone!
Hospital trip and 6 years later he’s still got a scar.

@ineedaholidaynow

Is that is all tiers *@CallmeAngelina*? Have you got a link to that?

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/coronavirus/4122339-Government-finally-considering-making-schools-safer-masks-in-secondary-classrooms

@Hoppinggreen

AaronPurr when DS was in Y1 I had a phone call to say DS had a “splinter” in his arm. I told them to just remove it and they said they weren’t allowed and could I come up. I stomped up there all cross muttering “bloody ridiculous “ to find an ambulance and a paramedic waiting for me so I could give permission for them to administer morphine. Let’s just say it was a bloody big splinter - they didn’t want to panic me on the phone! Hospital trip and 6 years later he’s still got a scar.

Thank you @noblegiraffe

@Hoppinggreen

AaronPurr when DS was in Y1 I had a phone call to say DS had a “splinter” in his arm. I told them to just remove it and they said they weren’t allowed and could I come up. I stomped up there all cross muttering “bloody ridiculous “ to find an ambulance and a paramedic waiting for me so I could give permission for them to administer morphine. Let’s just say it was a bloody big splinter - they didn’t want to panic me on the phone! Hospital trip and 6 years later he’s still got a scar.

Ouch.

Whole thing ridiculous. Teachers should not be doing tests and I’m dubious about where all the DBS checked school staff are to supervise volunteers.

Child A aged 15 sits next to Child B at school. child A gets a proper test and positive for Covid. In the past Child B would isolate for 10 days. Presume that now if that option taken definitely no online learning as Child B could have gone down testing route (unless there is - Child A needs to learn and may only have a mild cough.)

Am I right Child B and parents have the option of daily test so they can carry on at school. Are they told that they have to isolate at all as likely to be asymptotic even if have Covid? What about the weekend as would definitely have isolated for one weekend in the past? I was thinking particularly of children in Tier 3 where there a few more things they might do that have chance of spread.
This seems a flaw even if the tests are properly done by everyone.

I had a test done in a local centre just before Christmas, everyone there needed some kind of help to do it right. My sin ripped his bag open only to find that he was supposed to put the completed test vial in the bag he had torn to shreds to get the test out.

I cannot believe that secondary and college students will be able to do the tests with just "supervision", they are unlikely to follow the instructions of to get the swabs to the back of the throat far enough. My supervisor told me that gagging was almost essential to ensure the swab went far enough back, so I can imagine there will be vomit to clear up, frightened kids, wrongly administered tests and tests muddled up.

I work in a college and anticipate being drafted in to "supervise", having experienced my own testing I would not feel confident to supervise testing young students through this process even with a zoom training session.

The Unions seem very quiet on this at the moment. I've just looked for some kind of union response and can't see anything issued since the announcements last week.

It's a recipe for disaster and I would be withholding consent to testing unless it was properly medically supervised.

It's a recipe for disaster and I would be withholding consent to testing unless it was properly medically supervised.

I will be refusing consent because the tests are inaccurate and I think close contacts should be home, self-isolating!

those saying they are unreliable, they have been extremely effective in my team and every positive lateral flow had been confirmed by positive full swab. Those saying they will not do as not medically qualified.... that is like saying you would not do a pregnancy test yourself. You literally swizzle a long cotton bud type thing up each nostril( most kids could do) and then it gets stuck in a little plastic tube with 6 drops of liquid in it and you squeeze the end of the tube to get the liquid mixed with nose sample and drop 2 drops into what looks like a pregnancy test. Simples

Nope. Throat, too.

What is your 'team'? Healthcare or teenage children?

Two studies of university students found extremely low reliability.

It's not about the positives either : it's about false negatives!

Mush, in principal a good idea in practise..

The tests are not compulsory, which students will put themselves through it!
Students getting nervous waiting, gagging, being sick, don't doing it properly.

I would urge caution to anyone thinking they may volunteer to do this to young children.
I believe a whole host of laws and legal protection have been ignored, gdp etc.

I certainly won't be allowing anyone near my dc unless they are properly medical trained and understood the dangers of damaging their throats etc.

The mental reliance on the tests will make it so much harder to manage the usual mask, window issues and no one, should be telling the children they are definitely negative!.. Or safe.

It's a nightmare.

I don't know how they can iron out the logistics issues I see but this I would have thought is something to give out to dc at home before they return eg at home take 1/2 before school... Don't come in if your positive and something to use at the tail end when numbers are way down and we are Trying to root out last few.

@vdbfamily

those saying they are unreliable, they have been extremely effective in my team and every positive lateral flow had been confirmed by positive full swab. Those saying they will not do as not medically qualified.... that is like saying you would not do a pregnancy test yourself. You literally swizzle a long cotton bud type thing up each nostril( most kids could do) and then it gets stuck in a little plastic tube with 6 drops of liquid in it and you squeeze the end of the tube to get the liquid mixed with nose sample and drop 2 drops into what looks like a pregnancy test. Simples

Well, this is throat and nose.

The test seems like it’s accurate in that if you test positive on them, you probably are. Unfortunately it seems to miss large percentages of positives so people are testing negative when they aren’t.

It's crazy. Lots of children will be very upset anxious about having to do this by themselves at school.

What I heard on the news this morning, but can't believe is true:
a pupil will need 2 negative tests 3-5 days apart to be able to return to school in January.

Does anyone else remember those poor teenagers stuck in Italy for 3 months because they kept giving positive test results after having coronavirus, but no longer being infectious after a couple of weeks.

Are we going to have tens of thousands of secondary school aged children stuck at home for months because they keep giving positive results weeks/months after an infection, despite being long past being infectious.

Vdb

When you said '' that's like saying you won't do a pregnancy test on yourself ''

What sort of pregnancy tests are you talking about?. The ones I did, you have to pee on a stick.

That's not invasive is it?

Putting something into someone else is attempting an invasive bodily procedure.

Yes, mine are to go in to do the test next week then whatever the result come straight home
If negative they are to go back to school 3 days later and on arrival test again. If still negative they can stay at school or of positive they must leave straight away and aren’t allowed back for 14 days or an NHS negative test.

We did it in our school before Christmas. No hitches except for one fainter. Pupils swabbed themselves with instructions from SLT. We had help from school nurse and team from the local NHS. We are on Wales and was in the highest rate county. All the secondary schools did it.

Schools in England will have no NHS support.

We had help from school nurse and team from the local NHS

So, nothing like the way it’s being done in England then?

every positive lateral flow had been confirmed by positive full swab.

And were the negative ones confirmed negative by gold-standard testing?

Because that's where the issues really lie.

Do these tests for schools need a throat swab or is it a cheek and nostril swab? I had a lateral flow test and had to swab inside my cheeks which was certainly better than the throat swab!