People don’t really understand the purpose of the restrictions, do they?

[Notcontent]

My DC has already had Covid and I am not in any vulnerable category (and probably been exposed already). On a personal level, the restrictions have had a very negative effect on my life and I also feel that the way the Government has handled everything has been very erratic and inconsistent.

BUT, “we are where we are” and I fully understand the purpose of the restrictions - they are there not necessarily to protect me personally or my DC but to halt the spread of the virus and therefore reduce the number of people who will get really sick with it.

But it seems that a lot of people still don’t get it and say things like “well, it should be a personal decision” or “we are having a party because none of us are vulnerable”.

People don’t really understand the purpose of the restrictions, do they?

Correct. And until the rules make sense and are explained in an open handed way, people will continue to be confused and do/believe in what they want.

Maybe people do understand but don't agree that trump's everything else? Some posters are being offensive about people because they hold a different view. Why not try to understand others? If we all did maybe we would learn things. It would certainly be better than name calling.

Thing is, @Zxyzoey31 people who don't agree with or "believe" in the regulations & restrictions are putting everyone around them at risk.

It's not an argument where there's "right on both sides."

@Jinglingmod

Utterly clueless and utterly selfish is, unfortunately, how I'd describe the vast majority of the British population right now.

You sound ridiculous, the vast majority have been following the rules as well you know, people have lost everything, jobs, income, businesses, education, mental health, sick of people like you spouting stupid comments like that when so many people have lost so much, yeah they are really selfish, have a word with yourself.

@QueenoftheAir

People were never going to buy into long term restrictions that make little sense. I understand the point of the restrictions completely, I still think they make no sense when schools are open.

But @NailsNeedDoing you don’t understand.

In order to keep schools pen, which is really essential for so many reasons, and to keep people in jobs (again obviously a good thing) we ALL need to exercise extra restrictions elsewhere to ensure we contain the virus transmission as much as possible.

It’s a balance between a very restrictive lockdown (Paris, China, Melbourne etc) or a free for all (USA).

I wish people would understand this..

Really, I do understand.

But you need to understand that it’s a bloody big thing to ask of people who have no direct interest in schools being open, so there is an alternative viewpoint.

I have no children, no skin in the game. But I manage to see, think, and understand beyond my own nose. I understand how important schools are, how important education is, and how children are suffering.

I have empathy and imagination.

@AllWashedOut

People don’t really understand the purpose of the restrictions, do they?

Correct. And until the rules make sense and are explained in an open handed way, people will continue to be confused and do/believe in what they want.

The rules have been explained perfectly clearly, people choose not to understand, or claim confusion because they don’t like them or they don’t suit their specific circumstances. It’s not hard. There is a finite amount of mixing which can happen if exponential transmission is to be avoided. Hard decisions are necessary in balancing the interests of public health, education and the economy. Whatever decision is made one group of people or another will be screaming blue murder. The situation is shit, everyone is affected. I can honestly say that I have not at any point been ‘confused’ by the measures, the communication of the measures, or the reasons for them. At times I may have preferred a different decision had been made, but I am aware that my preferences reflect my specific circumstances. People need to stop being dicks.

@MyPersona

The rules have been explained perfectly clearly, people choose not to understand, or claim confusion because they don’t like them or they don’t suit their specific circumstances

^This

I would argue the economic fall out of two entire sectors - hospitality and the arts - being shut down - oh and retail now - far out weighs the disadvantages of schools being closed unless you have kids and have a vested interest in education.

The closures impact people who work in the sector, everyone else who are paying taxes to foot furlough for those who qualify and also people who like to enjoy hospitality and the arts

I haven’t even touched on tourism

A Great proportion of what is taught in schools is nice to have and could be paired down to make up for lost time in the essentials. History and geography can be combined to humanities as the skills taught overlap to a large extent (ability to read source information and use resources) - just one example.

I’m not sure the overall economic damage is less than the damage of having to rejig the curriculum for a couple of years .

And no, I don’t have any sympathy for parents who want school for child care. Frankly a crunch could happen at any time if you have kids. Maybe they are long term ill - how would you cope? It should be a factor in any decision to have children and if you haven’t considered it then you are partly at fault. I don’t believe in accidental pregnancy - the pregnancy may be accidental - the birth was a choice as long as you knew before 22 weeks

The rules have been explained perfectly clearly, people choose not to understand, or claim confusion because they don’t like them or they don’t suit their specific circumstances. It’s not hard. There is a finite amount of mixing which can happen if exponential transmission is to be avoided. Hard decisions are necessary in balancing the interests of public health, education and the economy. Whatever decision is made one group of people or another will be screaming blue murder. The situation is shit, everyone is affected. I can honestly say that I have not at any point been ‘confused’ by the measures, the communication of the measures, or the reasons for them. At times I may have preferred a different decision had been made, but I am aware that my preferences reflect my specific circumstances. People need to stop being dicks.

Totally agree @MyPersona

I do wonder if some short sharp Government messages would help. I am staggered by

People shopping with the family in tow

People with the mask under their nose (sorry but it seems to be elderly men)

People having their family round even if they don’t live together. It’s as though they think Aunt Maud will be fine with me around. It’s those stupid idiots in the supermarkets that will spread it.

Younger people thinking it will bypass them and after all you are only young once so let’s get a small party together

Parents (and I am looking at a relative) who doesn’t stop the play dates even in lockdown because she doesn’t want to upset her DD

It’s horrible for all of us for both big and small reasons. I don’t trust the clunky NHS to manage the vaccine roll out. After all of this we do need to look at the NHS. Why is it the 5th largest employer in the world yet it behaves like it does.

Every winter it struggles and I don’t think it’s now about money. There is a reason we are the only country who runs our health service like this and it certainly isn’t the envy of the world because of it’s efficiency. It’s because it is free...

@Bathroom12345

I agree. I believe most people are behaving responsibly, but some behaviours you see are shocking

No they don’t op

But then once the vaccine is rolled out to vulnerable messaging will change

Completely disagree with pp talking down importance of education

Children shouldn’t be lowest priority but top

@MarshaBradyo

Children shouldn’t be lowest priority but top

Children should be on par with everyone else (neither lowest or top priority)

Well said @MarshaBradyo. These kids will have to live with the effects of this mess for the rest of their lives. IME they aren't as resilient as we like to think they are.

From reading other replies on MN the inequalities across the country are crystal clear.

Inept govt and its string of disastrous decisions has resulted in a failure to assure even basic Maths and English qualifications for the class of 2003-5. It's an educational postcode lottery and a total embarrassment. A supposedly advanced nation that can't even organise its own education system.

Meanwhile other countries across the world have closed ALL schools and concentrated on how to deliver effective online teaching, despite the problems that poses.

The problems will come out for all to see in due course.

Off to find some more online petitions to get these muppets out of office ASAP.

@Quarantino

On average children who have missed education because of Covid and lockdowns are 22-50 months behind

4 years behind? How have you calculated that?

It was on radio 2 yesterday discussing school closures and the effect of them.

50% of the population have an IQ below average.

However saying this is somehow a controversial statement.

I rest my case there.

@Noellodee

There is not a health service in the world that can cope with unchecked exponential spread. You could have 4 times the capacity, and if cases are doubling every week, that extra capacity would last a whole fortnight. The only way to prevent any health service from being overrun is to prevent the exponential demands that are being placed on it.

People who say that our NHS is not fit for purpose forget that public satisfaction with our NHS peaked during the Blair years, at which point we were said to have the best value for money health service in the world. I'm sure there was plenty of money being wasted, but waiting lists were down and outcomes were improving across the board.

Great point about the Blair years regarding the NHS. He did use PFI for those fancy new hospital buildings, but the care in those years was far better. My brother had top-notch cancer treatment at that time.

We spent the second lowest level of GDP on healthcare out of the G7 countries - just 9.6%. It’s not enough. But I completely agree that even a better health system would have been overwhelmed as in Italy; at the peaks, no country in the world has ever had enough beds.

@QueenoftheAir

The rules have been explained perfectly clearly, people choose not to understand, or claim confusion because they don’t like them or they don’t suit their specific circumstances. It’s not hard. There is a finite amount of mixing which can happen if exponential transmission is to be avoided. Hard decisions are necessary in balancing the interests of public health, education and the economy. Whatever decision is made one group of people or another will be screaming blue murder. The situation is shit, everyone is affected. I can honestly say that I have not at any point been ‘confused’ by the measures, the communication of the measures, or the reasons for them. At times I may have preferred a different decision had been made, but I am aware that my preferences reflect my specific circumstances. People need to stop being dicks.

Totally agree @MyPersona

^this.

Bellend friend of dh has said that friends of ours who have had serious complications have had them because they made poor life style choices previously. He's literally made up a story that they took drugs in their youth without any foundation.

Why?

So that he - a supposedly educated man - can continue to act like a bellend and think that the restrictions don't apply to him.

He's been holier than thou, delivering food to vulnerable people whilst also having having friends around in his house during the first lockdown "because the kids needed someone to play with". Social distancing? No idea.

He's obese and in his 50s.

He's also spent the last 3 days in bed with a mystery illness which his wife keeps changing the subject about... She's in work today and the kids having been playing with lots of other kids all week in massive gangs both inside and outside their neighbours houses.

He's perfectly capable of understanding. He managed the finer detail of brexit. He works in health and safety.

He just choses to bullshit and not believe because he doesn't like it.

[quote trulydelicious]@MyPersona

The rules have been explained perfectly clearly, people choose not to understand, or claim confusion because they don’t like them or they don’t suit their specific circumstances

^This[/quote]
I agree - the “oh I don’t understand, nothing is clear, it’s all so complicated” brigade fully understand - they just want an excuse to do as the please - utterly selfish.

If you aren’t sure check your local council website - it’s all there and written very clearly.

The rules have been explained perfectly clearly, people choose not to understand, or claim confusion because they don’t like them or they don’t suit their specific circumstances. It’s not hard. There is a finite amount of mixing which can happen if exponential transmission is to be avoided. Hard decisions are necessary in balancing the interests of public health, education and the economy. Whatever decision is made one group of people or another will be screaming blue murder. The situation is shit, everyone is affected. I can honestly say that I have not at any point been ‘confused’ by the measures, the communication of the measures, or the reasons for them. At times I may have preferred a different decision had been made, but I am aware that my preferences reflect my specific circumstances. People need to stop being dicks.

This is a perfect summary of the situation. The restrictions have also had to change periodically to reflect an evolving situation, this does not mean they are inconsistent.

The restrictions have also had to change periodically to reflect an evolving situation, this does not mean they are inconsistent.

Indeed.

I don’t think the means justify the ends

I understand the intentions, but I don’t think the rules achieve either saving the NHS or saving lives, as is evident right now

And I don’t think this is because people aren’t complying.

What we aren’t being told clearly is where the deaths are occurring, and how. So I think, but can’t get official data right now, approx. 25%+ of deaths are still occurring in care homes. My question is how that can still be? What has the strategy been to protect care homes? Apart from the same rules as everyone else, it seems not much. Personally I’d have preferred some of the £170bn spent on furlough going into absolute barricade of the care homes, throw everything at it so residents are protected. That is where a lot of the deaths are still occurring, yet we don’t seem to talk about it.

Also hospitals, it also seems a lot of ‘hospital admissions’ are not coming from being admitted ‘with coronavirus’ symptoms, they are coming in with other ailments and either catching it or being tested positive in hospital. Again all gets sketchy because information is scarce, but if a lot of this is hospital acquired, what is the strategy to stop this? I’ve not heard of much.

I think the disagreements from me come from this area...we still haven’t got the basics right, where we could make the most progress. Yet people seem incandescent with rage if you meet your friend in a garden. It’s seems topsyturvy to me 🤷‍♀️

“He just choses to bullshit and not believe because he doesn't like it.”

@RedToothBrush

You’ve hit the nail on the head- I know of quite a few similar. So frustrating.

@majesticallyawkward

I understand the point of the restrictions completely, I still think they make no sense when schools are open

On average children who have missed education because of Covid and lockdowns are 22-50 months behind, any further loss and we've essentially destroyed an entire generation. Thats a little more important than having pubs open or seeing mates.

I understand the reasons behind the restrictions, and have complied for the most part. I don't expect anything to change long term around the nhs and its funding, if anything it may now be easier to privatise it.

I disagree that it's a 'vast majority' not complying, it's just that instances of non-compliance makes for a better headline to stir up some hysterics (a la mumsnet).

I would seriously like to see proof of that statistic. If 22-50 months is the average amount that children are behind it would suggest that many are even more behind and I doubt this is true.

As an ex teacher with many teacher friends most of the children have been caught up by now. The ones who are still behind are the ones who were behind anyway so that’s not surprising. Many excelled in lockdown with one to one parent support.