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Michael Gove has said schools will stay open in Jan, as planned.

57 replies

Imsosorryalan75 · 28/12/2020 18:01

www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.com/news/amp/education-55466147

I can't believe he's so confident. Are the government hell bent on keeping schools open, even with hospitals in the state they're currently in!

OP posts:
herecomesthsun · 28/12/2020 18:36

Reading the government guidance will give us information that will predictably change, possibly to the opposite of what is being said, probably the night before children are due back Smile

ThatDamnKrampus · 28/12/2020 18:37

The schools (primaries at least, so age 4/5 to 10/11) will stay open. They are hell bent on not shutting them even if a short sharp shut/lockdown will ease pressure on the NHS ability to perform, the mantra is schools must not shut.

FiveFootTwoEyesOfBlue · 28/12/2020 18:41

@noblegiraffe

it’s not mass testing of all secondary kids, it's testing of close contacts of those who've tested positive

It’s both. Close contacts was announced Tuesday, mass testing Thursday, of the last week of term.

OK apologies, it changed since the last time I checked.
Pastanred · 28/12/2020 18:41

Mass testing figures presume all with consent

In our school which signed into ons study of monthly testing, over 20% refused

I expect many won’t consent incase they have to arrange childcare for asymptomatic cases

cantkeepawayforever · 28/12/2020 18:41

@herecomesthsun

Reading the government guidance will give us information that will predictably change, possibly to the opposite of what is being said, probably the night before children are due back Smile
But the new version will COMPLETELY over-write the old, giving them complete deniability and lack of accountability.....
noblegiraffe · 28/12/2020 18:44

No worries, fivefoot, it really is hard to keep track of everything the govt panic-releases about schools. A lot of the time it’s stuff that’s leaked to the press and then never happens as well.

It’s mad.

PandemicPavolova · 28/12/2020 18:47

Wondeful head from tollworth girls schools on sky, she said on line learning worked so well for them and any students who needed to go in did, ie couldn't access on line learning.

She said it's much better to be definite and have them on line.

cantkeepawayforever · 28/12/2020 18:48

it's testing of close contacts of those who've tested positive

Even this is a nonsense - on practical grounds, let alone whether it is advisable for a test that only identifies 48% of positive cases to be used instead of self isolation....

700-800,000 children were out of school self-isolating as contacts of positive cases every day over the last couple of weeks of term. It is easy to imagine this will reach c./ 1 million per day fairly early on next term given the new strain.

Each has to be tested every day for 5 days [let's ignore the weekend issue for a minute, and assume this can happen]

1 person can run tests for about 12 people per hour (again, for simplicity, I will ignore the other 6 roles within testing and just deal with testers). So each day, between 800,000 and 1 million tests need to be run, meaning 67-over 80,000 person hours of testing. there are no extra staff - this will have to be school staff. It would obviously not be sensible to allow students into class until they have been tested, but even a bubble of 30 primary children would take 3 person hours to test, while a year group of secondary pupils could easily be 24 person hours....

Pastanred · 28/12/2020 18:51

No year groups on secondary should need testing

Contacts only

My ds hasn’t spoken to half his year 8!

Pastanred · 28/12/2020 18:52

If they do the tests that the ons study run in school it’s a simple sponge held in the mouth - kids do it themselves

TokyoSushi · 28/12/2020 18:53

Have you ever heard Michael Gove speak before? He is exceptionally confident, about everything. Whether what he says has any relation whatsoever to the truth is a completely different matter. Take anything he says with a large pinch of salt!

cantkeepawayforever · 28/12/2020 18:58

@Pastanred

No year groups on secondary should need testing

Contacts only

My ds hasn’t spoken to half his year 8!

In older year groups, due to options subjects etc, the numbers of contacts are much larger.

My Y13 daughter's year group isolated as a whole due to 2 positive cases with no obvious connection between them - once the school added up all the students in every class both were in (3-4 subjects x 20 students in each, very little overlap), plus time in the study centre, at lunchtime, at break times, in school buses etc, there were so few remaining students with no contact route with either of the symptomatic and detected cases (remembering the much higher number of cases that will be asymptomatic) that they deemed it safer and simpler to close the year group and move to fully online teaching.

Pastanred · 28/12/2020 19:07

But all students in the class wouldn’t have been in 2m radius so that’s bad management

Schools here record seats and as such those in the radius go home and the others don’t

It’s lazy and schools are at fault here

2 cases sending entire year home is crazy

Ds has 10 GCSEs and moves around all day with diff kids and teachers

Many times he’s had cases in his class but never been sent home

Why parents aren’t complaining to the heads I don’t know as here no school does it and phe are involved

Phe act on school tracking so if tracking is poor they have no choice to send all home

But don’t blame anyone other than school for that as they can do it

Pastanred · 28/12/2020 19:07

School should consider direct contact of paotive case only

It’s not their job to look at asymptomatic a etc

noblegiraffe · 28/12/2020 19:17

Many times he’s had cases in his class but never been sent home

Do you think that there’s a possible connection between there having been lots of cases in his class and not very many contacts being sent home to isolate?

And maybe proper isolation at the start might have prevented this outbreak spreading?

sherrystrull · 28/12/2020 19:17

@Pastanred

But all students in the class wouldn’t have been in 2m radius so that’s bad management

Schools here record seats and as such those in the radius go home and the others don’t

It’s lazy and schools are at fault here

2 cases sending entire year home is crazy

Ds has 10 GCSEs and moves around all day with diff kids and teachers

Many times he’s had cases in his class but never been sent home

Why parents aren’t complaining to the heads I don’t know as here no school does it and phe are involved

Phe act on school tracking so if tracking is poor they have no choice to send all home

But don’t blame anyone other than school for that as they can do it

It's hardly lazy. It's cautious. Children don't enter the classroom in their exact order 2m apart. They share toilets, touch the same door handles and often share buses.
Imsosorryalan75 · 28/12/2020 19:27

Anyone who thinks there is any type of social distancing going on in schools is a fool Grin

OP posts:
cantkeepawayforever · 28/12/2020 19:30

It's hardly lazy. It's cautious. Children don't enter the classroom in their exact order 2m apart. They share toilets, touch the same door handles and often share buses.

Exactly.

DD's school has had 3 year groups isolate, each 1x, in no further outbreaks or cases in those year groups after the isolations - in other words, outbreaks nipped in the bud by timely complete isolation of the year group.

I would MUCH rather that then a constant series of 20 kids here, 40 there, then another 15 including 5 of the original 20, then another 18...

It also follows the science of an airborne virus - anyone spending an hour's lesson with a positive case is at risk of infection, especially once airflow is taken into account - see the very useful modelling of early outbreaks in a restaurant, office and bus.

Just because the DfE helpline is under political instruction not to send home larger numbers doesn't mean that the isolation of the larger number isn't a MUCH better plan to actually get infection under control.... in fact, when public health manned the helpline (early in September), large groups WERE going home. It was only when it swapped to untrained call handlers run by the DfE that the advice changed....

Pastanred · 28/12/2020 19:32

But that is not your schools decision to make

They can’t go making up their own rules and sending kids home

No where does the guidance say about sharing toilets etc

That’s not on as they should be following phe

herecomesthsun · 28/12/2020 19:32

@Pastanred

But all students in the class wouldn’t have been in 2m radius so that’s bad management

Schools here record seats and as such those in the radius go home and the others don’t

It’s lazy and schools are at fault here

2 cases sending entire year home is crazy

Ds has 10 GCSEs and moves around all day with diff kids and teachers

Many times he’s had cases in his class but never been sent home

Why parents aren’t complaining to the heads I don’t know as here no school does it and phe are involved

Phe act on school tracking so if tracking is poor they have no choice to send all home

But don’t blame anyone other than school for that as they can do it

2 cases sending entire year home is crazy

No, it is scientific. It is infection control.

Strewth.

It is an airborne virus. It does not know to keep to 2 m. The new variant is "even more infectious*

Poor heads having to deal with ignorant parents.

Pastanred · 28/12/2020 19:34

Guidance says 2m only

Nowhere does it give heads the choice to decide they know science more than the rules

Is that how it is now - schools making up their own rules and widening the gap between kids?

Sorry but what if your head is full of crap or has health anxiety?

RememberSelfCompassion · 28/12/2020 19:35

Gosh these people that the the virus doesnt travel in a classroom!!!!

Pastanred · 28/12/2020 19:35

I’m not saying it’s right either way but you absolutely cannot have heads making their own rules up

RememberSelfCompassion · 28/12/2020 19:36

Pasta try reading?"a bar a room and a classroom" or whichever orser those 3 go in!

noblegiraffe · 28/12/2020 19:36

Extraordinary that a poster is trumpeting the fact that due to inadequate infection control, there have been multiple cases of covid in their DS’s GCSE class as a positive thing.

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