Can I be refused temp furlough?

[frenchtoast88]

This is hypothetical right now but expect it may be the way things pan out at work and would like to be prepared.

The company I work for have been claiming furlough for every member of staff, including me, since it began. All have been working throughout. New lockdown (in Scotland) from Boxing Day means I'm without childcare for at least 2 weeks. I'm 6 months pregnant with a 15mo at home and a key worker husband who may have to go to the office a few days a week. Can I ask to be on temporary furlough? And can they refuse? Work wise I'm confident they could get by without me. If the rules of temp furlough allow it (I think they do?) then I'd be happy to work reduced hours. They have offered that we can use holidays if we're not able to work but since the whole point of the furlough scheme is when people are not able to work I'm reluctant to use holidays up, especially as I'll be on mat leave from March and had been counting on having the holidays as full pay to top up the meagre statutory mat pay.

In case it matters, I work from home and have done since the summer.

@Cyclingwidow15
Companies can refuse to furlough anybody for any reason, and not every employer is even eligible (and some that are have chosen to not take part for genuine reasons). In general if there is work available and which needs to be done it isn't an appropriate use of furlough.

This is disgusting.

Blimey - sounds like you work for a very dodgy company OP. They’ll probably get reported by someone at some point - I’d run for the hills now.

I'm on furlough, and have had it spelled out to me that under no circumstances should I log into the work VPN, my emails, Teams etc.

Thanks guys. His employer has been furloughing other staff members who have wanted to come in because they don’t want to be on 80% pay. Yet they refuse to furlough those that request it because they can’t come in when children’s re forced to isolate. I know it’s the companies decision and they can still refuse it’s just good to know that it is allowed to be used for what he had requested.
Yes hopefully it won’t happen again regarding the children isolating. My husband has already been told he is being furloughed in January for a week so far, some people have been put on it for the whole of January.

If you are all actually on furlough but have been working, rather than you have been given a small reduction in your wages and you misunderstood this to mean furlough, then you are actually in a very, very strong position.

One word from you and your company is in appalling shit. So yes, request that you stay at home and do no further work or you will tell HMGov. I don't see how they could possibly refuse.

However I suspect that you are misunderstanding. There are companies breaking furlough rules, but it is unlikely in one with 50 employees - far too much opportunity for a disgruntled employee or employee's jealous friend or partner to spill the beans. If you have been put on furlough then you will have received a letter from your company telling you that you are on furlough and explaining exactly what this means for you.

@Haffiana

If you are all actually on furlough but have been working, rather than you have been given a small reduction in your wages and you misunderstood this to mean furlough, then you are actually in a very, very strong position.

One word from you and your company is in appalling shit. So yes, request that you stay at home and do no further work or you will tell HMGov. I don't see how they could possibly refuse.

However I suspect that you are misunderstanding. There are companies breaking furlough rules, but it is unlikely in one with 50 employees - far too much opportunity for a disgruntled employee or employee's jealous friend or partner to spill the beans. If you have been put on furlough then you will have received a letter from your company telling you that you are on furlough and explaining exactly what this means for you.

Would love to believe that I've been misunderstanding but I know for definite that we are on furlough and money is being claimed from HMRC every month. No one received letters telling us we were on furlough and it isn't mentioned on payslips. My husband was furloughed briefly and got all the official documentation and a line on his payslip. I tried to run for the hills but then fell pregnant again so staying put for now to qualify for stat mat pay but will be looking for something new at the end of this maternity leave.

If it makes you that sick then report them.
Furlough isn't for childcare, parents are.

As someone who has spent hours sorting furlough claims for the company I work for and keeping meticulous records this makes me really cross.

They can refuse, but if they do I hope they get caught.

For claims from December onwards HMRC will be publishing details of employers using the scheme - they will also be advising employees a claim has been made for them through their personal tax account so all these dodgy employers furloughing staff & not bothering to tell them because staff are still working are going to end up getting caught out

@NatashaAlianovaRomanova

For claims from December onwards HMRC will be publishing details of employers using the scheme - they will also be advising employees a claim has been made for them through their personal tax account so all these dodgy employers furloughing staff & not bothering to tell them because staff are still working are going to end up getting caught out

That's good to know but the OP has said it she won't report and obviously none of her co-workers have so it will be interesting to see how many reports their are.

It doesn't need to be mentioned on payslips - that will depend on the payroll software and whether a company uses that 'line' to help them calculate furlough claims. A company can have some staff on furlough, some on partial ('flexi') furlough and some not on furlough. You would not know who else in the company is on furlough unless you are HR or do the payroll.

In cases I personally know of where fraud is being committed, it has always been explained to staff that the company is going to illegally claim furlough for them or the company will have to let them go. It can only work where the staff are onside - albeit reluctantly. It is a huge risk for the company.

I seriously suspect that you have got the wrong end of the stick.

This is going to be a nightmare in January if schools are shut.

My workplace, for instance, have a lot of staff using up annual leave as its our "quiet time". If we suddenly end up with loads of people needing time off due to childcare it will cause massive problems. I can't imagine we'd be alone in this.

@HasaDigaEebowai

Furlough is not there for people with childcare problems. It's for businesses who might otherwise have to make people redundant.

One of the key reasons for furlough when it first started was childcare issues and this is stated in all guidance for furlough. You can absolutely ask to be furloughed for childcare reasons.

So your company is claiming furlough and making you all working full time but you're not even getting your full salaries?

Have you agreed to the change in your pay? How long have you worked there for? If they’re committing this level of fraud then I’d be surprised if you had a job there for very long anyway, I’d try and get some legal advice and see what they owe you in terms of back pay. Also if they’re doing fraud on this why do you believe they’ll pay your maternity pay fairly / accurately?

@Haffiana

It doesn't need to be mentioned on payslips - that will depend on the payroll software and whether a company uses that 'line' to help them calculate furlough claims. A company can have some staff on furlough, some on partial ('flexi') furlough and some not on furlough. You would not know who else in the company is on furlough unless you are HR or do the payroll.

In cases I personally know of where fraud is being committed, it has always been explained to staff that the company is going to illegally claim furlough for them or the company will have to let them go. It can only work where the staff are onside - albeit reluctantly. It is a huge risk for the company.

I seriously suspect that you have got the wrong end of the stick.

Thanks @Haffiana, it was explained to us at the beginning that we'd be going on furlough but asked to work. I think most people had forgotten about it by now. I know with absolute certainty that claims are being made each month and money received from HMRC and also that not one single person in the company is working anything other than their originally contracted hours.

@TheDinosaurTrain

Have you agreed to the change in your pay? How long have you worked there for? If they’re committing this level of fraud then I’d be surprised if you had a job there for very long anyway, I’d try and get some legal advice and see what they owe you in terms of back pay. Also if they’re doing fraud on this why do you believe they’ll pay your maternity pay fairly / accurately?

No option but to agree to it. There were some redundancies but not linked to people objecting to furlough. The maternity pay is just statutory so appreciate that the only difference between that and maternity allowance is the 6 weeks at 90% but little as that is it seems worth hanging on for, plus knowing that if I really needed it I'd have a job to return to (assuming they don't go bust by then). Who knows what the job market will look like in a year's time.

You are in a very strong position - you're talking about 100's of thousands of pounds with 50 plus employees

Just don't put your blackmail in writing