How the fuck did they get through the war??

[ssd]

If it was 6 years...

This hasn't been a year yet and were all losing the will.....

I think the only benefits people in 1939 had were no 24/7 telly and no social media

But 6 years....OMG

A today lol, I meant a goady twat

@NotmyfirstRodeomyfriend

They are, of course, entirely different situations that you can't compare.

History PhD here saying a bit fat yes to this. The threat the UK faced then was literally a hundred times greater than a virus where the average age of death is 82. WWII comparisons are bizarre

The war ebbed and flowed in terms of threat etc. It wasn't constant threat all of the time.

Secondly, the risk was very real etc.

Unlike now, when the response has been hysterical and not justified. Completely disproportionate. Hence why, for me, it's so shit and ill continue to complain and moan.

It would have been very hard no doubt but different.

I’m reading a Nevil Shute book atm and he is an excellent writer for the every day detail of war time. He describes so very well the emotions of people who were caught up in the huge war effort.

Not so much the frontline but back home or trying to get home. It’s made me muse on this and I think this is still hard. Taking things away that we need or enjoy and not replacing it with anything is the odd kind of suppression that is very difficult. We are so very lucky there is a vaccine as without it I think it could have got very bad indeed.

On the frontline that was just worse than all of it of course. Now and then.

They sent their children off to live with strangers. Can. You. Imagine???? I get overwhelmed thinking about evacuees.

In the war, everyone thought they were "in the right". They joined together and believed they were fighting for the good of others. Many also supported the then Prime Minister.

In COVID there is no 'right', a disease is faceless. People don't trust the government and we're not together in this, neither literally nor metaphorically.

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Irene seems to be overlooking the fact that people were killed everyday, either in fighting, bombings, torpedoed ships, in PoW camps. Not to mention terrifying nights in air raid shelters (not just in London, many ports and other areas were bombed).

But I expect the bad food and lack of holidays was their main source of anxiety...not. hmm"

Of course people went through dreadful and terrifying experiences! I'm just saying that they also moaned a lot too about everyday inconveniences and anxieties. Anyone who thinks they didn't hasn't actually read any contemporaneous novels/diaries/letters/Mass Observation reports.

I think sometimes im a bit more positive about the human spirit

As loads of people have said this pandemic is in no way comparable with WW2, so I don’t understand why people compare people’s reactions to this to those reactions of people during the war

Yes people are complaining and breaking rules exactly as they did in the war but also people are selflessly offering their time and sticking to the rules as they did in the war

We may well be a bit whiney now, but it doesn’t mean that most of us couldn’t cope during a war...we’d have to

I think a more relevant comparison would be the average age at death due to WW2 and the average age at death due to Covid.
Yes, every death is tragic, but I think young deaths are far more tragic than older (and I say that as a 61yo myself).

This seems a good place to mention the Stockdale paradox. James Stockdale was an American Naval Admiral who was famously a Stoic philosopher, captured during the Vietnam war he was held prisoner by the VietCong in inhumane conditions and tortured. He credited his Stoic philosophy for getting him through the ordeal. Afterwards he wrote a book about his experiences and psychologists looked into what could be learned from them. On being asked how mindset helped survive he said:

“I never lost faith in the end of the story. I never doubted not only that I would get out, but also that I would prevail in the end and turn the experience into the defining event of my life, which in retrospect, I would not trade.”

He was asked ‘Who didn’t survive?’

“Oh, that’s easy,” he said. “The optimists.”

The interviewer pressed Stockdale for more details.

“The optimists. Oh, they were the ones who said, ‘We’re going to be out by Christmas.’ And Christmas would come, and Christmas would go. Then they’d say, ‘We’re going to be out by Easter.’ And Easter would come, and Easter would go. And then Thanksgiving, and then it would be Christmas again. And they died of a broken heart.”

So this is what they call The Stockdale Paradox. It seems very applicable at the moment, when I do remember being told this will be over by Christmas, now people are saying it will be over by Easter! Just like in Stockdale's story. I'm not saying our circumstances are like being held in a prisoner of war camp but there is a parallel there and his resilient mindset can clearly be helpful.

? Completely different situations and I never understand why people need to endlessly refer to the war with rose tinted glasses in this country...

The news was censored, how many of you have heard about strikes during WW2?

People were not happy, but they were busy.

All 4 of my grandparents went through the war, my mum's dad was in a reserved occupation so not called up, my mum was jealous of the kids who got things sent from fathers overseas.

My dad's dad was called up at the start of the war, my dad was 2 and to all intents and purposes his mother became a single parent for 5 years.

Things like housework took longer, making sure your house was blacked out every night took time. Cooking took longer, other than fish and chips, take away food was rare.

If you work a long shift in a factory, then have to go queue at the grocer's then go home and cook from scratch. They you write a letter to your dh who you know is out of the country but not where he is, then write to your evacuated child(ren) and listen to the wireless you will not have much energy to complain.

And you might think, "sod it, I'm having a boiled egg and soldiers" because you are knackered you can't, you get one egg a week, your butter ration has gone and the bread is known as 'Hitler's secret weapon'.

Then you may have been in bed for 3 hours when the sirens go and you have to get to a shelter which probably isn't in your back garden, has no heating and you don't know how long you will be there and if you will get any more sleep.

Oh and lots of people 'cheated' my dad's mother was the most honest, upright, law abiding woman you could meet.

She asked her neighbours for a handful of fruit cake ingredients to send my grandfather a home made Xmas cake - it was labelled 'soap' and did actually get to my grandad.

I know there are very different things, but one thing that is the same is that people will not be having everyone they want sitting round the table on Xmas day.

@MrsLebowski how very true, what an interesting story, that’s why you have to make the most of the situation you are in as this could go on 3,4,5 years we don’t know, live for today as who knows what tomorrow may bring.

My grandad was in WW2 his ship was blown up and he suffered awful injuries, his mental health never recovered and he was an alcoholic for the rest of his life dying of liver disease when I was very young. The war was awful I personally wouldn't ever want to go through that though this pandemic is horrendous and can't wait for it to end.

1914-1918 war; huge amounts of mental health, none of which was recognised because 'it's not stiff upper lip'. Men shot for cowardice when they were suffering severe ptsd aka 'shell-shock' barbaric treatments which left greater trauma, but never officially recognised.
Union action rife particularly in the factories with terrible working conditions. My great grandmother kept a journal of the Great War. I can assure you it makes for gut wrenching reading after the initial 6months of 'for king and country' mantra. I'm sure her views were mirrored throughout society.
It's thought one of the reasons for the Spanish flu taking such a severe toll was due, in part, to the depleted resources (both physical and mental) of the population at the time, particularly the very traumatised young men returning from the front (who were hardest hit by the disease).
1939-1945 war again huge toll both physical and mental, don't be fooled by the propaganda of the 'blitz-spirit'. Yes people did help each other out (just as many are now). But both wars took their toll.
I'd rather be 'fighting' a virus than my follow human beings. Obviously I'd prefer not to be fighting anything at all

Just to reiterate, incase anyone thinks I dont know how bad the war was, my FIL was the first British troops in to liberate belsen concentration camp ages 22 and my dad was operated at sea with no anaesthetic and recuperated in the African jungle same age, so I dobt need telling or wee faces thank you.
I'm in awe of older people who lived through the war.

And of those who didn't of course

I should add out of both wars came good things. The Great War enabled women to work (of course they weren't paid as much as the men for doing the same jobs) but it was the start of breaking down society's rigid rules. It was also the beginning of the upstairs-downstairs divid crumbling too.
WW2 added further to this divide making way for a more liberal and 'generous' society and pushing forward with the idea of the NHS.
I'm sure good things will come out of this Covid situation which will benefit society for the better, but when living through something horrible it's hard to see any benefits.

Many people suffered life long mental health issues as a result of their experiences in the war. My grandfather tried to commit suicide but his 11 yo sone found him. The experience affected him deeply and he became an alcoholic. It wasn't all Very Lynn and stiff upper lip.

How did they get through the war?

There was a certain amount of getting together and pulling together. We are very isolated in this particular situation.

The 1918 flu epidemic was not fully reported upon, I understand. So, on the one hand, mitigation & medical treatment was more limited, but on the other hand, anxiety may have been less.

Personally I think modern telecoms have been a massive boon.

In the war, everyone thought they were "in the right". They joined together and believed they were fighting for the good of others. Many also supported the then Prime Minister.

My parents lived through the war. They had me quite old. My df never recovered. He was forced to shoot someone. It broke his life. He tried to commit suicide when l was 4.

Dm remembered the Blitz and human remains everywhere.

They both hated Churchill. Dk used to go on about her hatred of him all the time.

Completely agree with previous posters that the biggest struggle this year has been being banned from seeing friends and loved ones, particularly within homes.

And even when you do see them, there is so much guilt and worry surrounding it.

I wonder what life was like once the threat of invasion was over and the Blitz was less intense. 1943 to 1944. The war in the Atlantic had a massive effect on food supply. But people could see we were fighting back and could see the preparations being made.

The mainstream media have a big influence. In the 40s it seems like they supported government, now they don't.

People lap up the hysteria from the irresponsible msm and then the negativity spirals. We need scrutiny and facts but we need unbiased, balanced facts. The war generation of course struggled and had mh problems but listening to older relatives there was a sense of getting on with it and being stoic.