The government wants YOU to volunteer as a school covid tester

[noelgiraffe]

The govt have proudly announced that there will be mass testing in secondary schools, colleges and special schools from January.

What the headlines don’t quite convey is that schools will be expected to set up and man their own testing centres and that this make-shift testing of close contacts of positives will replace close contacts having to isolate. The tests pick up about 50% of positive cases so I’m sure this will be fine.

Covidy kids will be getting the bus to school to queue up and be tested by people who have watched a video and a couple of online worksheets.

Even better, they want those people to be YOU!

“The document says that reasonable costs for additional workforce will be reimbursed.

It adds that a school may want to hire temporary staff, such as agency and contract workers, or draw on volunteers such as parents, retired teachers, Red Cross, St John Ambulance and community organisations.”

If you can’t help in person, perhaps you can support by talking positively about this effort on social media and parenting forums?

“Under a section labelled “social media guidance”, the document reads that “consistent, accurate and positive communication about testing activity is essential”.

They want to see “proactive public social media using agreed materials” and schools are encouraged to “monitor your existing social media channels, parents forums etc. and provide any feedback”.”

Come on folks, do your bit!

schoolsweek.co.uk/7-staff-roles-2-hour-training-and-dhsc-sign-off-on-press-schools-given-mass-testing-instructions/

@RoseAndRose

Aren't the tests only allowed to be interpreted by someone with training? Not sure which tests are being sent to schools but I'm sure I read that the general public isn't allowed to judge the result, that's why they do them at rapid test centres instead of posting them to people's houses I think

They are no more complex to read that a home pregnancy test.

The reason results are eyeballed by someone else is to remove the opportunity to cheat. This kind of test produces enough false negatives without giving easy opportunity for people to bury their inconvenient result

Ah that makes sense. I suppose there would be a fair bit of cheating at home.

@PicsInRed

I'm happy for my child to be tested if necessary, but I'm not having some total rando stabbing up right up at his sinuses for the sake of statistical success at mass screening. Ridiculous.

I think you've summed it up nicely here.

I've had several emails from The Royal volunteer force asking for similarly unqualified need-training volunteers to do testing in lots of community situations (not schools). Schools aren't being treated differently in terms of recruited workforce to get testing done. Is why they brought in military Oop North - no special background required.

I was looking at testing jobs back in summer... about June? there was a job advertised here to go test people in their homes for covid; no special qualifications required to apply. I would have applied but they wanted at least 4 days/week commitment on zero hours contract.

I am really skeptical about the original Liverpool trial as they I believe only tested handful schools not all schools.
Many gps were saying that it wasn't getting the least affluent community to tests and think that be case in school.
A family just about keeping their head above water won't want a child tested incase they come back postives and whole house has self isolate causing loss of income.

Also newsnight said last night it may not been tier 3 or mass testing for reason Liverpool rates dropped as they implemented both when the city passed its peak.

Excellent post by @SchrodingersUnicorn at 9:59

Indeed.

So.

I am a parent. Also a HCP. Also CEV.

I haven't had the vaccine yet.

I am very interested in being helpful.

However, they need to be doing mass testing with the lateral testing kits and not using them instead of isolation.

And I would be a wrong choice to go and help with the testing myself at this time especially, as CEV and haven't had the vaccine.

I think that the public needs to be informed of what the plans are and what they mean and then be vocal about them, especially HCPs and parents.

Dr Angela Raffle (a proper expert on testing and screening) on lateral flow testing in Liverpool.

twitter.com/angelaraffle?lang=en

She was utterly scathing a couple of weeks ago on the Today programme, saying the PM and Health Sec had made false claims about these tests. Her main point in the interview was they needed to be administered by properly trained people (so not Kevin’s Mum, but a health professional) to be of any real use.
And that was in the light of using them as screening in local areas, not as, in effect, diagnostic tools in schools.

*swabbing

Why thankyou @W00t
Do feel free to use my scenario to send to MPs/plaster over social media/twitter. My own MP is less useful than a chocolate teapot and doesn't even respond with a template letter.
I'm an ECV teacher (and one who can't be vaccinated with the Pfizer jab at that) so this terrifies me. It feels like a death sentence going to work in January.

@herecomestheSon

So.

I am a parent. Also a HCP. Also CEV.

I haven't had the vaccine yet.

I am very interested in being helpful.

However, they need to be doing mass testing with the lateral testing kits and not using them instead of isolation.

And I would be a wrong choice to go and help with the testing myself at this time especially, as CEV and haven't had the vaccine.

I think that the public needs to be informed of what the plans are and what they mean and then be vocal about them, especially HCPs and parents.

Will you get offered the vaccine soon? My trust started with CEV and BAME staff, then vaccinators and have moved on to those in the highest risk areas. I hope you get offered it soon!

Agree that's an excellent post SchrodingersUnicorn

I'll repost it

Hahaha! So, DfE, if you're hanging out on this thread, lateral flow testing to catch random asymptomatic cases in schools = great idea
Lateral flow testing instead of isolating close contacts = absolute shitshow.
Let's imagine
Day 1: Alice tests positive for covid. Normally Bob, Charlie, Danielle, Ella and Fergus would isolate. However, they (along with the other 40 pupils who have actually had contact with Alice but don't count as close contacts in corridors, toilets, break etc because it wasn't on the seating plan) come to school INSTEAD of isolating.
Day 1: Bob comes to school on the bus with Greg. Bob tests positive and goes home. Greg has now been put at risk. Shame Greg lives with his Gran. He also doesn't have to isolate
Day 2: Noone tests positive, but that's because the lateral flow tests are only 50% accurate. Charlie actually has it but stays in school. Midday, Charlie feels rough and projectile vomits over Hannah. He goes home but doesn't test (because he's been tested, right? And vomiting isn't a symptom) Shame Hannah has type 1 diabetes
Day 3: Danielle and Ella both test positive. This is concerning because only 50% of positives are picked up, and also Danielle was snogging her boyfriend Idris yesterday (since she doesn't have to isolate under this system). Shame Idris lives with a shielding parent
Day 4: Fergus tests positive. Yesterday (when he would under the old system have been isolating) he had a 1:1 learning support lesson with a vulnerable teacher. Of course, they were 2 metres apart but since it's an airborne virus and the windows don't open
Day 5: Charlie is back in school, still an undetected positive
By the next week, as a result of not isolating, the entire school are now 'close contacts' needing these tests. Half of infected people are missed by the tests, and people who go on to become infected are in school and on buses in thecontagious part of the incubation period
Just from our initial few close contacts, we have Greg's Gran dying, Hannah with type 1 diabetes in hospital, Idris' shielding parent in ICU and a vulnerable teacher off with long covid for 3 months
Now multiply that by 100 (since the school of 700 are now close contacts).
This is a FANTASTIC idea, government.
Just checking, what were you aiming for again? Was it a population cull?

That's supposed to all be in bold

@3asAbird

I am really skeptical about the original Liverpool trial as they I believe only tested handful schools not all schools. Many gps were saying that it wasn't getting the least affluent community to tests and think that be case in school. A family just about keeping their head above water won't want a child tested incase they come back postives and whole house has self isolate causing loss of income.

Also newsnight said last night it may not been tier 3 or mass testing for reason Liverpool rates dropped as they implemented both when the city passed its peak.

It wasn't the 'original' trial...

There were two previous trials which didn't produce a result that the government was happy with.

www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/news/greater-manchester-news/rhetoric-reality-operation-moonshot-19368722
The rhetoric and the reality of Operation Moonshot

SPECIAL REPORT: Mass testing is the government’s roadmap out of tier three restrictions. But the view from the ground differs to that from the despatch box. Jen Williams reports.

The rates in Liverpool went down. But so did the rates in neighbouring St Helens, Knowsley and Warrington at more or less similar rates over a similar time scale. The testing started when restrictions came in so we can't rule out the restrictions as being more effective in reducing cases than testing.

The whole scheme has been criticised as been an unethical trial because it lulls people into a false sense of security and makes them believe they are safe to socialise (perhaps more), which isn't true especially when the false negative rate for the quick tests is significantly higher than the other lab tests.

It is a useful tool under certain situations but unless done properly (particularly where kids are concerned) it cause unintended problems.

But its sold like a miracle solution. Which its not.

[quote MrsMigginsMate]@OpheliasCrayon that has nothing to do with the objections that I'm parodying. And presumably the people suggesting a parent workforce are also suggesting those restrictions be waived for the sake of getting the job done.

I'm happy to volunteer if needed. I'm not happy for teacher's to roll their eyes at any efforts we make. They either accept help or stop complaining about the lack of it, simple.[/quote]
But will other parents want someone like you manhandling their child?

I'm not sure I would.

'manhandling'? Seriously?

I don't want anyone who says 'simple' about things this important and complex anywhere near my kids tbh.

www.bmj.com/content/371/bmj.m4848

The rapid test kits most widely used in UK universities, schools, and care homes detect just 48.89% of covid-19 infections in asymptomatic people when compared with a polymerase chain reaction (PCR) test, real world data from the Liverpool pilot have shown.

The Innova Lateral Flow SARS-CoV-2 antigen test failed to detect three in 10 cases with the highest viral loads, in preliminary data released from the field evaluation of testing in asymptomatic people.1

I guess this is another reason why mass testing in schools wouldn't work anyway. No way would I volunteer my times to be accused of 'manhandling'. Not that I am supportive of it anyway, but I thought some people were.

@MarshaBradyo

Those talking about throat swabs LF is only nose

The handbook provided to schools says throat and nose.

I watched a video on it there and it says throat OR nose. Clearly a very accurate handbook haha!

The thing is that a fair number of parents actually are HCPs (coughs).

So it might be that some schools at least would have a pool of potential people who could help, as long as it was clear that the testing involved the right sort of test and was going to be used in the right sort of way.

I also note that a lot of HCPs are themselves exhausted and over worked and stressed right now and wouldn't need an extra workload.

I presume that any remuneration for this (if there is any) would be risible.

@PrivateD00r

I guess this is another reason why mass testing in schools wouldn't work anyway. No way would I volunteer my times to be accused of 'manhandling'. Not that I am supportive of it anyway, but I thought some people were.

Precisely. I wouldn't want some random doing it.

I take my child to doctor, nurse, dentist, hygienist because I trust them.

I don't trust Mr or Mrs X who have zero qualifications, experience etc. It is normal to want professional medical oversight of medical procedures. Especially for your children.

I assume if I don't consent to tests, my child isolates normally. Which I prefer actually as it avoids this amateur testing and hopefully avoids the main spread, if any, from the original positive case.

@herecomestheSon

The thing is that a fair number of parents actually are HCPs (coughs).

So it might be that some schools at least would have a pool of potential people who could help, as long as it was clear that the testing involved the right sort of test and was going to be used in the right sort of way.

I also note that a lot of HCPs are themselves exhausted and over worked and stressed right now and wouldn't need an extra workload.

I presume that any remuneration for this (if there is any) would be risible.

Yeah lots of us are already doing extra shifts in our own jobs and also to help with vaccinations. As I said though, I would still be willing to help if it was actually going to be of any benefit to the school and the parents. But I am not convinced it actually will!

inquiet, of course you can decline that your DC participates, like everything in life. Though I urge you to read up because your comments make it clear that you don't actually understand what is involved. Declining because you disagree with this approach is fine (and sensible perhaps) however declining because you don't want 'some random manhandling your dc' is a little hyperbolic You have no idea yet if your dc will be offered, who would be doing it etc. As previously posted by others, it may well be HCPs volunteering their time. Anyway I will leave it there, but as I said it gives me food for thought as to whether I would offer my time when I can see the attitudes around it.

If these tests are less than 50% accurate, their own valid use is mass testing in an area with high cases so you can identify some asymptomatic people and take them out of circulation. But they shouldn’t be used for close contacts in school or for travel purposes.