How have they tested the long term effects?

[BecomeStronger]

I trust that the vaccine is safe. I won't be in any priority group but I'll have it as soon as it's available to me.

I am happy that we wouldn't be offered it if there's any prospect of long term damage. I'm told "they" know it's safe, but how?

How do they know it's safe from long term side effects without long term trials? Is it all because they know similar vaccines are safe?

Have any other vaccines had long term effects?

I think it has a lot to do with similar vaccines.

Amazingly, covid hasn’t been around much longer than the vaccine - there seems to be a lot of long term stuff coming out about covid.

So I’m sat here waiting with my arm out! I wish!

I do understand people’s concerns but as you say I think the existence of similar vaccines and long term effects of covid tip the balance way in favour of the jab. Not to mention getting our lives back and protecting the vulnerable and nhs 🙏🙏🙏

Most issues with vaccines happen in the very short term, so immediately after the injection.

Hopefully if Margaret is still ok by bedtime it's all good.

I am assured by those who do know (I don't) that it would be incredibly rare for vaccines to give delayed side effects. But the honest answer is we won't have proved that for this vaccine until enough years have past and enough recipients observed that we know for sure. There's nothing about the side effects that people have had (sore arm, fever or feeling limp for a few hours...) which would suggest long-term side effects are likely. But it is an unknowable.

On the other hand, we know Covid causes long term side effects because we can see the scarring in the lungs of some people months after infection. Even young people, who had relatively minor initial disease. We don't know how much recovery they can expect, but we can see the damage there.

It is - as most things are - a balance of risks. But everything suggests that the hypothetical risks of the vaccine are much lower than the real risks of covid. Even if you're in a low-risk group.

I don't think they can ‘know’ - but they can be pretty sure based on experience from other vaccines.

What @Delatron said.

There is the possibility of extremely rare side effects - so rare they did not occur at all during the trials. Obviously we can’t know what that might be.

If, for the sake of argument, it turned out that 1 person in a million developed a serious neurological issue, that would be tragic for them. But it would be 67 people on the whole country, in comparison to the tens, possibly hundreds of thousands who will either die or get long Covid without vaccination. So it is worth it - it is safer to vaccinate than not.

I am not from the scientific community, have no training in science, so even if I tried to understand in detail how the vaccine works I don't think I'd understand. I read overviews, where I trust that people have gone through the data in detail and explained it in terms that I can understand. And I do trust that the absolute top scientific brains in many different countries, with lots of funding, lots of joint research, accelerated round the clock working their legs off, have come off with different amazing vaccines that will no doubt save hundreds of thousands of lives.

But what I do understand is that the Internet, social media and sites like Mumsnet have had posts every single day questioning the 'long term safety' of the vaccine. This - some say coordinated - effort to destabilise credibility of the scientific community has created an atmosphere of fear and doubts which, when you think about it, may cost lives of tens of thousands of people.

WHo do I trust? Strangers behind the anonymity of social media, or the creme de la creme of the international scientific community? Well, I do trust the scientists.

So my last point - if you REALLY want an answer to your question, look to reputable sources. NOT Mumsnet.

When people use "long term" in this context, they tend to mean "late to appear". I.e. the question is really, "How do they know that the people in the trials won't go on to develop other side effects?". (Correct me if this isn't what you meant)

If that is indeed the question, the answer is - because that doesn't tend to happen with vaccines. There can (rarely) be long lasting effects - but they appear fairly quickly; not months or years later.

We have no idea what delayed effects covid itself has though. There are people suffering with long covid whose lungs look fine on all conventional scans, but a few weeks ago somebody developed a new kind of CT scan which has revealed their extensive lung damage. There are also illnesses like SSPE, which is where somebody appears to have recovered from measles, but has unknowing developed brain inflammation which will kill them a few years later.

There are also statements on social media, including Mumsnet, with references to the vaccine modifying your DNA, to the absolute disaster that was thalidomide, and to the vaccine causing infertility. 'We're all doomed the vaccine will destroy humanity'. Even Facebook now is coming with a Warning when such posts appear.

I think we are generally underestimating the impact and spread of such devastating rumors, and if this is what you are referring to OP, I suggest that you read this website: fullfact.org/ that interprets of lot of the data about the vaccine, and also demystifies some of the rumors circulating online.

Thalidomide isn’t a vaccine.

I know it's not a vaccine, but a few weeks ago, black and white photos of children with no arms and legs were posted on Twitter with a statement saying like 'this is what happens if you don't tests drugs properly'. Believe it or not, some people on Mumsnet also repeated the claim, inferring that we risked going through the same thing with the vaccine. Shocking. www.irishnews.com/news/northernirelandnews/2020/12/02/news/covid-19-vaccine-myths-debunked-as-thalidomide-and-bill-gates-trend-on-twitter-2148960/

The actual physical content of the vaccine solution is broken down by the body and dissipated within 48 hours.
All vaccines, both old and new, for the last 70 or so years work using similar principles and long term side effects are very rare, almost negligible.
The majority of side effects happen in the short term. The most common being redness or pain at injection site. Occasionally an allergy has been noted, for example those that are allergic to egg shouldn't take a vaccine containing albumen. The most common reactions are those to the adjuvant that is added to the vaccine, rather than the vaccine itself. All side effects appear to disappear very quickly within days.
Another common side effect, particularly with vaccines based on denatured live vaccines are very mild flu like symptoms, that are not tranmissable and again disappear quickly.
In the history of vaccines, long term side effects aren't a thing at all.
Obviously the COVID vaccines are newer and still being monitored. The trial candidates who had the jag three or four months ago are being followed up continuously ( so far so good). The scientists will be able to collect more data as time goes on, but they are confident, based on the research and extensive knowledge of immunology that the vaccines will work and are safe.
I have an appointment tomorrow for my first one and can't wait

Also thalidomide is not a vaccine.
However it was as a result of this crisis that drug testing and licensing was changed to become the thoroughly rigid and serious and stringent process it is now.
A bit like after the Titanic disaster they changed the rules to ensure enough lifeboats. Drug testing and trials changed as a result

From what I've heard, as in doctors discussing the testing and research.. they haven't noticed any severe effects after about 2-3mths and from previous vaccines they know that if any bad effects happen, they usually become apparent during this time. Obviously it doesn't mean something 'couldn't' happen later, but they think the chances of that are extremely unlikely. No drug or vaccine is 100% safe if it has an effect but you have to weigh up the risks.

Just a bit of reality. I'm not stating that something will go wrong with these vaccines, but there are a lot of inaccuracies on this and other threads (and lots of burying of heads in the sand)

@Calmandmeasured1

Have any other vaccines had long term effects

Yes, example: Pandremix - swine flu vaccine

@wondersun
@PowerslidePanda

I think it has a lot to do with similar vaccines
because that doesn't tend to happen with vaccines

There are no similar vaccines mRNA vaccines and to an extent the Oxford one use new technology not used before. So we cannot extrapolate in that way

@trulydelicious

Wasn't the narcolepsy connection with Pandremix apparent within a 1 - 2 month timescale of the vaccine?

Nobody actually knows. However I am involved in the novavax trial as a volunteer and can tell you what we've been told about that.
The actual way the vaccine is made is similar to other established vaccines, including the HPV which is now routinely given to teenagers and one of the Hepatitis ones which is widely given out. Hundreds of millions of people have had those and there are no proven long term side effects, but some short term mild ones.

That might not be necessarily the case with the Pfizer vaccine but speaking extremely generally there in an awful lot of expertise around vaccines globally and it is exceedingly rare/unheard of for any side effects to be long term or pop up after a long time.

A genuine concern is how long immunity will last for and we really don't know that either. But there is every chance that for every individual it will last at least several months which will be enough to bring infection levels down while development and manufacturing continues. The doctors running my vaccine trial think it is very likely that we will end up with a yearly jab, similar to the flu vaccine programme. Although it is hopefully unlikely that everyone would need to be vaccinated every year, perhaps just those in vulnerable groups once transmission is down significantly.

Scientists did come to the conclusion that in the case of the Swine flu vaccine, the risks were of 500,000 people vaccinated against swine flu, there would be approximately one additional case of Guillain-Barré syndrome. The conclusion though is that the benefits of the vaccine would far outweigh the risks.

Covid has killed what, 70 000 people in the UK alone? How many affected by long Covid, severe and long term lung disease, blood clots, even infertility in men?

I think it's important to look at this objectively here.

I think that people who burry their heads in the sand are those who are opposing the vaccine, trying to convince others to do the same using social media platforms, they will have blood on their hands for sure.

Lots of vaccines have long term side effects - Pfizer has been fined over 5bln in the past few decades alone for 'effects'. And that is only one of hundreds of drug companies.

Amazingly, covid hasn’t been around much longer than the vaccine - and yet, on a trailer for a TV show about Covid, the voiceover said that 'long covid' effects could last for 'up to 2 years'. How the hell do they now that - when the disease has only been about for 1 year?

I certainly won't have my arm out for a vaccine for a disease which has a death rate of 1%, and which most people don't even know they've had.

And if 'they' try to make me, there will be a rebellion.

@Sparklingbrook

Hopefully if Margaret is still ok by bedtime it's all good.

Haha

@Sparklingbrook

Hopefully if Margaret is still ok by bedtime it's all good.

And if 'they' try to make me, there will be a rebellion.

Oh no, not 'they' again - some vague and unknowable other to rail against in the absence of any evidence that this is on the cards. If you have to invent phantom enemies to feel rebellious then knock yourself out - stick it to the man.

@GoodKingWindowshopping

Guillain-Barré syndrome

I'm referring to Pandremix vaccine specifically and narcolepsy as the side effect

Again, I'm not an anti-vaxxer or trying to discourage anyone from taking these vaccines, just cautious.

I also hope these vaccines end up being effective and those receiving them do not get any short or long term side effects

But I think inaccuracies being repeated over and over on threads are not helpful for anyone