Looks like if you're under 50 with 'moderate' asthma, you're not getting the vaccine

[denfit]

Since March, if you take a daily steroid inhaler (e.g. Symbicort), but you don't take steroid tablets (e.g. Montelukast), then you have been in the 'moderate' risk group and are clinically vulnerable instead of clinically extremely vulnerable.

So far so good, right?

Well the latest vaccine priority groups have chucked moderate asthmatics completely off the list for vaccination!

Link here. You only get a vaccine in priority group 6 if you take systemic steroids. Which a daily steroid inhaler isn't.

Unbelievable.

@Lurkingforawhile

I’m very confused now - aren’t those in table 3 CEVs anyway who would get the vaccine as part of priority group four?

No - the list of 'extremely vulnerable' is higher than the list of 'at risk'.

Extremely vulnerable list here: www.gov.uk/government/publications/guidance-on-shielding-and-protecting-extremely-vulnerable-persons-from-covid-19/guidance-on-shielding-and-protecting-extremely-vulnerable-persons-from-covid-19#cev

I think they are changing their views on how the virus affects people and what kind of virus it is. Originally they thought it was mainly a respiratory one - which explains why asthmatics were made out to be more vulnerable- but as time has gone on it’s become more apparent that it’s actually attacking people’s circulatory systems and blood clotting abilities more. So they are changing their views on the most vulnerable. I assume that’s what’s going on.

I say that as someone who is in the extremely clinically vulnerable group due to asthma, Addison’s, lupus and a pituitary tumour.

We have discussed this a lot on the various forums I’m on and it does seem that it’s people with issues like heart problems, diabetes and blood pressure problems that seem to be having the most serious issues with Covid.

I have moderate asthma, wasn't in the shielding group etc.

My GP friend told me in around May that the evidence seemed to show that mild and moderate asthmatics were doing better than a lot of groups. Some thought that out T Cells were on alert, because we get so many colds and upper respiratory infections. We react in a similar way to young children who also get a lot of colds.

My nurse, and my pharmacist had heard similar.

I wasn't expecting to be getting the vaccine earlier than anyone else tbh (unlike the flu jab which we do need because we do struggle with flu).

They're not in group six, the extremely clinically vulnerable not mopped up in the older age group are in group six. This can include asthmatics, I'm in because I take tiotropium to control it but taking inhaled steroids isn't enough to classify.

Well the latest vaccine priority groups have chucked moderate asthmatics completely off the list for vaccination!

Not exactly. You’re in with the under-50s, who are not off the list.

I do wonder sometimes if people have been hiding under a rock for months!

So I took the time to read your post. I wanted to understand more about the problem. And this is your response? No I haven’t been under a rock. I have had my own issues. I wouldn’t necessarily expect you to understand the nuances of my issues if they were not things you were familiar with. If I started a post on here about them I would expect to elaborate if needed.

Im asthmatic on steroids but also a carer and mobidly obese (lots of reasons why). I dont think my dr officially knows Im m.obese though. I suppose I'll have to somehow tell them.

We've been acting as if we're v high risk even though weren't told to shield.

On oral steroids - long term or regularly taken pineapple?

1. It is provisional. Literally stamped across every page.

1. It says directly underneath the table that the list is not exhaustive and clinical judgment should be exercised about individual patients.

Sorry I typed too quickly. Steroid inhaler, occasionally on prednisone with a flare up but not enough to get into shielding for that reason. As time went on I realised it was my size that was more of a risk.

Oh contrare OP

@Bramblespoint

I thought data had shown that only those with severe asthma were at increased risk?

Most asthmatics seem to have similar outcomes with COVID as non asthmatics so there is no need for us to be priority for the vaccine

I think the jury is still out on this one. I’ve seen different studies showing slightly different things and some suggestion that type of asthma might be relevant. So those with allergic asthma are at a similar risk to non-asthmatics but those with other types might have a higher risk of hospitalisation or developing long covid.

I think, as others have said, as we live longer with this virus evidence has shown that some of the initial groups of people they thought were at risk were not correct. Just because you were told you were cv at the beginning doesn’t mean that you are now. They were guessing at the beginning and now they can make more informed judgements. You should look at it as a good thing you aren’t on the list to get a vaccine as they feel you are not at risk. My son was told to shield in the first wave but as knowledge has increased he is now not even cv which I am pleased about. I know it’s hard to change a mindset once you have been told one thing, and I know parents who are unfortunately still shielding their children because they can’t shake the ‘best guess’ advice they were given at the beginning. But knowledge about covid has increased so much and it is important to follow the latest advice, not the historical.

@WouldstrokeTomHardy

Oh contrare OP

Is that a joke?

Under 50s will get a jab. All over 18s will

Why a joke? I'm asthmatic? It says moderate under 65. What have I missed?

DS is 7 and has remained on the shielding list. He is on prednisolone, fostair, montelukast and salbutamol daily, plus extras and has had three hospital admissions during lockdown and now off school. He's not going to be vaccinated with any of the current vaccines as far as I can see.

DH is NHS frontline and so has had to move back out. I teach in an inner city secondary and DD goes to a very large secondary.

I don't know how our lives are going to go back to normal with this vaccine plan. It frightens me.

What's the provenance of that document?

The priority list is different to that published by JCVI, who don't seem to have updated

It's good that this moves the CEV (including those with the most severe asthma) up to priority 4 (it was always a nonsense to me that those whose lives were turned upside down by shielding were below otherwise healthy people who were still in the workforce, having not yet reached state pension age

Oh yeah, that'll teach me for not following the link. Category 4 (possibly) now - happy days.

@WouldstrokeTomHardy

Oh contrare OP

Keep reading...

Although asthma was put into the vulnerable group at the start studies have gone on to show those with moderate or mild asthma aren’t strong greater risk than those without. I have asthma and do not class myself as vulnerable and wouldn’t expect the vaccine ahead of others my age, even though I’m eligible for the free flu jab every year. The vaccine will be primarily for those most at risk, which the table in your link reflects.

It's good news that those with moderate asthma aren't as high risk as first thought. Even better that the ECV have been brought forward in priority for the vaccine. If true.
Where did this document come from?

OP, congratulations on not being at serious risk from Covid. That must be a huge relief for you.
You say that people 50+ with moderate asthma won't get the vaccine. Did you mean to say that they won't get it immediately? Do you really believe you'll never get a Covid vaccine? With three successful ones already?

Not relevant to your case OP, but the assessment of risk to children has been reduced greatly. If an 18yr old was on the exact same drugs and dose as my 11 year old, they would be shielding. But a child on the same drugs is not at risk, purely because of age being greatly in their favour. So far, because all the evidence points to most children not being severely effected, guidance has massively changed for children.

OP I am sure you will get it, you just mightn't be first on the list (or 2nd or 3rd). Myself and quite a few colleagues have had cv, without a doubt, those of us with even mild asthma have fared worse. I totally understand that is anecdotal but I won't be convinced at this stage that asthma isn't a risk factor.

I personally would strongly advise any asthmatic to do their best to get the vaccine if and when the opportunity comes up. I will be (NHS staff)!