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Original poster

Tier 2 to tier 2 travel to visit elderly father (91) who is completely isolated & unsupported?

34 replies

LimitIsUp · 26/11/2020 14:44

Opinions wanted re whether I am interpreting the rules appropriately

91 year old dad lives 260 miles away in a different tier 2 area.

He is not in a bubble with anyone where he lives and is completely alone (and completely, unbearably lonely). Mum is in a nursing home but he hasn't been permitted to visit. Nursing home is not one of those celebrated on their news for their creative solutions to visiting - no portacabin with a perspex floor to ceiling screen at this particular nursing home Hmm

I booked accommodation some time ago (dad has only a 2 bed bungalow) in a holiday apartment in his town - for the period 27/12 - 29/12 inclusive) - which doesn't fit with the Governments newly announced 5 day Christmas 'relaxed rules'.

I am assuming that we (dh and I and our two teens) can travel (a rather long way ) and stay in this accommodation where Dad lives - also a tier two area.

Presumably we can bubble with him (at the time he won't be in any such arrangement with anyone else - although he has been in a bubble with my brother who lives 100 miles from him and vists monthly - but on 27 December he won't have been face to face with brother for >3 weeks, so a temporary stay on that bubble and a new bubble with us?)

Don't want to fall foul of any over zealous police on the long journey down (in a hypothetical scenario where we may be stopped)

OP posts:
Original poster
LimitIsUp · 26/11/2020 14:46

"I am assuming that we (dh and I and our two teens) can travel (a rather long way ) and stay in this accommodation where Dad lives - also a tier two area."

Misleading, for clarity I meant to say

I am assuming that we (dh and I and our two teens) can travel (a rather long way ) and stay in this accommodation in the town where Dad lives - also a tier two area.

OP posts:
Original poster
LimitIsUp · 26/11/2020 14:57

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OP posts:
Original poster
LimitIsUp · 26/11/2020 15:07

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OP posts:
Calmandmeasured1 · 26/11/2020 15:07

Your dad is already in a bubble with your brother and, unfortunately, once formed you cannot change support bubbles. You cannot therefore bubble with your dad.

sleepwouldbenice · 26/11/2020 15:16

Ok...
The travel and accomodation are all fine as all tier 2 so doesnt matter is Xmas or not
The bubble I think is only fine during the Xmas bubble period
Can you meet outside in any way after that?
But to me, to be honest I would be more concerned about teenagers and the elderly mixing which in turn might be influenced by clear knowledge of local infection rates and teens activities before the meet up.

PickleASturgeon · 26/11/2020 15:34

He's 91 and on his own, if it was my Dad, I couldn't leave him in this situation.

I can't believe that this is what we've come to, asking if it's ok to visit our own parents. (That's not a dig at you OP).

Sorry, don't know what the 'rules' are and am beyond caring now.

Lougle · 26/11/2020 15:40

The rules are that you can only have one support bubble. Tier 2 means no mixing inside, other than support bubbles. So you can go to the town, meet with him outside, but not inside.

Having said that, there is no way of policing support bubbles, and I suppose it could be argued that this is a new 'season' of restrictions, so he could argue that his support bubble is you. Only a court would be able to judge whether that's legal or not, because the legislation isn't specific enough to include whether bubbles carry over from one phase to another.

AnotherEmma · 26/11/2020 15:42

Whether or not it's within the rules I think I would see him and self-isolate for 2 weeks beforehand because of his age.

I think the Christmas rules cover 23-27 December don't then - any chance you could move your booking so it's within those dates?

IrenetheQuaint · 26/11/2020 15:43

This comes under care/support of a vulnerable person and is therefore legal. Of course the risk in practice is a trickier issue.

OvaHere · 26/11/2020 15:47

To be honest given his age I'd try and find a way to go and give him a few days of joy and chance to see his family.

I know there's a risk to that re Covid but (and I don't mean this flippantly) everything is a bit of a risk at 91 surely? Especially for someone living alone.

Theotherrudolph · 26/11/2020 15:58

I’d call it care and support of an elderly person and therefore allowed.

Orangeblossom7777 · 26/11/2020 15:59

In terms of travel you would be fine as we can go for holidays to similar areas.

There is some more info here, says something about meeting outside but there is also stuff about vulnerable and emergencies relating to 3 which may apply not sure.

I will find the link for you. www.gov.uk/guidance/local-restriction-tiers-what-you-need-to-know#high-alert

GrumblyMumblyisnotJumbly · 26/11/2020 15:59

If as a family you can isolate for a week beforehand I would absolutely go to see him, obviously taking precautions when you see him- it is an act of care for an elderly person. I had to leave my own parent on their own during the first lockdown, it was undoubtedly the worst part if it, knowing they were in pain through loneliness. I say this as someone who otherwise would recommend everyone limits contacts that aren't essential over Christmas - if you live in a household with others you dont have to meet up with other people but a 91 year old should not be left alone.

ultragroupie · 26/11/2020 16:00

@PickleASturgeon

He's 91 and on his own, if it was my Dad, I couldn't leave him in this situation.

I can't believe that this is what we've come to, asking if it's ok to visit our own parents. (That's not a dig at you OP).

Sorry, don't know what the 'rules' are and am beyond caring now.

^^ This. Just go and see your old dad and keep to your plans OP.
Runoutofideas45 · 26/11/2020 16:04

Do what you have to do OP - I shall be having my elderly dad to stay for Christmas .... as we booked his travel months ago and it very probably can’t be changed .... and I wouldn’t want him exposed to the peak travelling crowds either ! ... the dates are slightly different to 23-27 ! It’s his choice- he knows he wouldn’t survive covid - my mum died this year - he’s frail - next year could be too late

Roselilly36 · 26/11/2020 16:04

Fine, as I see it, you are caring for your elderly dad.

Apandemicyousay · 26/11/2020 16:12

As with others- you’re providing support and care, and so legality not so much issue but whether it’s sensible to mix with teenagers. Can your teens have a few days off school so you have 10 days isolating before you go?

Lougle · 26/11/2020 17:25

That's true. I forgot that rule - care for over 70s.

cologne4711 · 26/11/2020 17:27

You may not be able to bubble with your father, but I would have said that any visit to someone of his age counts as a care visit.

sausagepastapot · 26/11/2020 17:35

Go and see your dad.

Omeara · 26/11/2020 17:39

I would go.

Cupoftchaiagain · 26/11/2020 17:41

Yes he’s a vulnerable person and you are emotionally supporting him. Plus if he hasn’t seen his other bubble (your brother) for more than 2 weeks he can form a new bubble with you and then 2 weeks later with your brother again. But all that aside just consider the contacts you and kids have had and how you can minimise those before seeing him

Kjc39 · 26/11/2020 17:48

Just go see your dad. He’s 91. Everything is a risk at that age. Make the most of him whilst he is still around. Ignore the stupid bubble rules.

DonaldTrumpsChopper · 26/11/2020 17:51

Of course you must go and see him. You are caring for him.

And, frankly, who is going to know who he is a bubble with?

Original poster
LimitIsUp · 26/11/2020 17:52

Thanks all - good to know that this seems reasonable. The teen issue duly noted - but as it happens ds (16) finishes school for Christmas on 11 December and as we live rurally I can guarantee that he won't be seeing anyone between 11/12 and 27/12 when we visit. Also dd (18) finishes work on the 17th - so all should be good

OP posts: