Christmas households: just to confirm..

[Lelophants]

If we see my parents on Christmas day and DH parents boxing day, that means we are three households. So my parents can't then visit their elderly parents or my brother. And my in laws can't visit their other children. 🙈

I work for the NHS and am not off much of 23-27 and not long enough to visit family as they're many hours drive. Honestly this feels like a kick in the teeth to some keyworkers as we are the ones who can't get the catch up with family we are all so craving as we are keeping the NHS running.

I think the guidance has been laid out and it's for individual families to now make the decision on what they feel is best for all of them. By the sound of it we're over half way through this nightmare so hopefully it won't be long before we can all be together again.

We're at home with my mother in law. My ds is taking my mum and her mother in law. We've decided that as they are on their own and elderly it was more a need for them to be with is than our siblings families getting involved.

It will be quiet, we will make the best of it and look forward to the good times coming.

It gets more confusing: existing support bubbles count as one household, so theoretically you could have people living in 6 different houses in one Christmas bubble.

Tbh I think its an empty gesture those who want too see friends and family will do so anyway regardless of what restrictions are in place and there are those who will just stay at home regardless. I think those who religiously stick to the 3 household bubbles will be a minority compared to the other 2 groups.

Lelophants But with a vaccine just around the corner, surely some of them can accept that just because they can't all meet up as normal this Christmas, by Easter it should be much better? It's just one day, and I say that as someone who loves Christmas and hosts everyone, but this year we're sticking to us and are planning to do Xmas again at Easter (or whenever it's safe), complete with tree!

@FoolsAssassin

If students are back by 9th does that mean by 23rd they are then integrated into our household or are they still counting as separate household by then? Sorry if that’s a silly question, I have remnants of a migraine .

"f you are a student who has moved home for the university holidays, you are considered to be part of the household to which you have returned. You are not treated as part of your term-time household for this period." from government website

Wondersun, I think it becomes one unit of three households, so Lelophant's household, Lelophant's parents' houshold and Lelophant's DH's parents' household can only see each other.

I can see this being really confusing and the rules being in broken by accident. For instance if the first set of parents don't know that the second set of parents are part of the group of three households, then they could inadvertently meet up with another of their children.

We have MIL in our support bubble and Dd will be home from uni, so God knows if our "one household" will be all together at Christmas as it seems daft to mix.

@Longwhiskers14

Lelophants But with a vaccine just around the corner, surely some of them can accept that just because they can't all meet up as normal this Christmas, by Easter it should be much better? It's just one day, and I say that as someone who loves Christmas and hosts everyone, but this year we're sticking to us and are planning to do Xmas again at Easter (or whenever it's safe), complete with tree!

The problem with 'it's just one day' argument is that depending on restrictions where you are it may have been several months since you were last allowed to see family indoors, and it could be several months more to go. My parents or PILs wouldn't normally be too concerned about not seeing us at Christmas itself - DH and I spent our first Christmas as a married couple alone and no one was too fussed - but since they haven't been able to see us indoors in comfort since October 17 and they don't know when they'll next be able to they'd really like to if the opportunity is there, so choosing one or other of them will be massively hurtful.

@MargosKaftan your original plan relied 100% on social distancing, it’s not just 6 people but 6 people AND socially distanced (whether you were intending to or not that is the rule your plan was using). You can still do that.

If you do not want to have to socially distance then that is what the new relaxation covers for those 5 days, limited to 3 household bubble.

Or if you want gatherings of more than 6 people

Thank you Ravensoap, I just found it too. All academic as we’ve all decided that as DS not finishing school until 18th, too risky to see 83 year old Dad at the moment.

@Notonthestairs

Sky news refers to a three household bubble - which I interpreted as GooseberryTart has ie fixed 3 household, the bubble wouldn't be extended.so if we see my in-laws and my Dad then my In-laws are in my bubble and have used up their allowance.

Would be very happy if that is wrong!

Nope that's correct.

The Christmas Bubble of 3 households all need to be in agreement that they're in the CB. It's one fixed bubble for the Christmas period.

I'm thinking in most families it's only going to allow for 'one side' of the family to meet up.

I'm staying home alone because the virus won't be taking 5 days off. I'd rather wait, get the vaccine & see everyone in spring/summer!

[quote 1dayatatime]@beela
I think you should start providing the official advice, at least it's clear and simple.

Although I am some will question what if you don't like Quality Street and can we eat Celebrations or Caburys Heroes instead?[/quote]
@1dayatatime no probs. Other sorts of chocolate are allowed, if you really don't like Quality Street.

Pointless for me, but hopefully it means Mum and Dad can see sister A and sister B can see her son and grandchildren.

I accepted weeks ago that I wouldn't be seeing any of my family over Christmas.

@Tupla

Wondersun, I think it becomes one unit of three households, so Lelophant's household, Lelophant's parents' houshold and Lelophant's DH's parents' household can only see each other.

I can see this being really confusing and the rules being in broken by accident. For instance if the first set of parents don't know that the second set of parents are part of the group of three households, then they could inadvertently meet up with another of their children.

Well, no, if they've been listening!!

People were told to discuss this and mutually agree who was in the 3 household bubble for the period!

It's going to be a sad old New Years Eve!

@FoolsAssassin

If students are back by 9th does that mean by 23rd they are then integrated into our household or are they still counting as separate household by then? Sorry if that’s a silly question, I have remnants of a migraine .

Students count as part of the household they have returned to for the holidays.

In tier 1 you can meet with other households under the rule of 6 but should social distance. Within the "Christmas bubble" you dint have to. So your in laws could still see their other kids, but would have to keep a distance.
In tier 2 they could meet them outdoors or ina restaurant

For my Mum to see her 3 children, one of whom still lives at home, it's already a bubble of 3 households.

Which means DH doesn't then get to see his Mum. Who also wishes to see her 2 sons, who also have their own families they wish to see.

So the exclusive bubble of 3 households does not even allow parents to see their own children's families, unless there are only a few. What a mess!

In tier 2 they could meet them outdoors or in a restaurant

You can't go to a restaurant with people not in your household in tier 2 - outdoors only

@MargosKaftan

So the original plan we had made for "rule of 6" in teir 1 was PIL would go to BIL & SIL for Christmas day (they have 2 dcs so that's 6), then come to us boxing day (we are a 4, so another 6). While PIL were with us boxing day, BIL & SIL would go to her parents. Her parents would be with one of her brothers for Christmas day and would see the other brother at New year.

We'd see my brother &his partner on 27th or 28th. Dh and BIL would go for a bike ride/coffee some point over the week and we'd accepted we couldn't get together with the cousins this year. My parents live overseas and had cancelled coming back this year, so takes that complication out.

All fine under rule of 6, but the new rules mean you can see one side of the family only. And everyone has to stick to it.

PIL can see both of their adult sons, DILs and grandchildren, but at the cost that the DILs families can't see the grandchildren over the other days of Christmas.

Has this been aimed at people who all go away for Christmas as a group or single adults living away who want to go to their childhood home for Christmas at the same time as their sibling?

Does noone have in laws in the cabinet?

Wow you were planning a lot of mixing!

I think the government have just past the buck, multi generational households could essentially meet up with other similar households. In my opinion they should would have been better off stating the number of people who can meet.

We're having inlaws here Xmas regardless of what was allowed. I know they're seeing sil on boxing day. (were not were going to my df who is our support bubble as he's a single person so affectively our household.)
Thats it.
However. Sil has ready said they will be seeing her inlaws and another Friend as their 3 households.

I think lots going to be like that.
Were only seeing inlaws who are our childcare anyway and our support bubble.

a friend has said she's choosing 2 other houses.. Each day!

If the two sets of parents were never in contact then they have not formed a bubble! Well, if the two sets of parents aren't in the same bubble, then OP can't see them both, because you aren't allowed to be in more than one bubble. So either GPs1 and Op are in a bubble, in which case she can't see GPs2 because that would be forming a separate bubble and no-one can be in more than one bubble. Or GPs2 are in the same bubble as GPs1 and she can see both, but neither set of GPs can see anyone else (except according to the normal Tier rules)