Covid: What they don’t tell you

[FreedomIS]

Not a fan of the DM but thankfully and finally reliable data and facts are being reported.
People should be angry about how misleading the government has been.

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8971669/What-DONT-tell-Covid-facts-twisted-strike-fear-hearts.html

*Deaths from influenza/pneumonia:
Yes I know it isn’t COVID! But ...

1976 - 62,357
1999 - 60,018
1997 - 57,271
1982 - 57,220
2000 - 56,623
1983 - 56,192
1995 - 55,828
2017 - 50,100

Has the government handled this the right way?

Yes.

The above figures are for years without any type of lockdown or restrictions on group sizes and mask wearing etc. Without lockdown in March, and all of the various restrictions since then, our current covid death rates would be way worse than they are now. So a ridiculous comparison.*

This

I just wanted to say about the underlying conditions - I’m late 30s and a t1 and if I catch it and die then so be it. I don’t expect everyone else to live like this just because I’m vulnerable. The state has spent quite enough money on keeping me alive to date, 100 years ago I’d be dead already. In fact should I develop covid and be unwell I’ve been quite clear that I don’t want medical intervention. It’s my bad luck that I’m t1. I don’t expect everyone else to sacrifice everyday life for me.

In a July report commissioned by Chief Scientific Adviser Sir Patrick Vallance, scientists estimated that there could be 119,000 deaths if a second spike coincided with a peak of winter flu. Yesterday, that figure stood at 54,286 – less than half that.

Er - we are at the START of the flu season when December 2020 begins, the peak would be some months later!

Hahaha read the full article, it’s ridiculous!

@idontknowaboutmortgages point is right:

"what is the agenda here"?

@Unremarkablebear

I just wanted to say about the underlying conditions - I’m late 30s and a t1 and if I catch it and die then so be it. I don’t expect everyone else to live like this just because I’m vulnerable. The state has spent quite enough money on keeping me alive to date, 100 years ago I’d be dead already. In fact should I develop covid and be unwell I’ve been quite clear that I don’t want medical intervention. It’s my bad luck that I’m t1. I don’t expect everyone else to sacrifice everyday life for me.

But you should have forty more years left and you have a manageable long-term condition! If the NHS shouldn't treat you who do you think is worthy of treatment? I mean this genuinely and kindly - are you depressed?

@CrunchyCarrot

In a July report commissioned by Chief Scientific Adviser Sir Patrick Vallance, scientists estimated that there could be 119,000 deaths if a second spike coincided with a peak of winter flu. Yesterday, that figure stood at 54,286 – less than half that.

Er - we are at the START of the flu season when December 2020 begins, the peak would be some months later!

Yep agree crazy reporting

stealth anyone who feels differently I suppose. I just think the nhs has spent the best part of 30 years keeping me alive as it is, if it happens then it happens. I could have another 40 years. Equally I could die of a hypo in my sleep in any night of the week. I don’t feel I’m a good use of resource and they’d be better to use the bed for someone with a better chance of recovery.

I suspect most of us have stories like that though. I had meningitis as a teen, almost died. Many women and babies are saved through c sections. Most men in their fifties will have had something.
You're as worthy of saving as all of us (well apart from me obviously as I'm the best :o)

@unremarkablebear If your in your 30s and don't value your life then you have an issue and thankfully you don't speak up on behalf of vunerable people.
It is not just the vunerable that are at risk of covid everyone is. Everyone should be mindful and consider others. This virus has brought out the selfishness of many.

"The Daily Mail’s chart of Covid-19 death figures doesn’t use the real numbers"
fullfact.org/health/mail-deaths-chart/

More misleading claims from that Daily Mail article:
mobile.twitter.com/_johnbye/status/1330575361688690688

"The first clue as to what is going on is that “The Statistics Guy” turns out to be a cranky Covid-denial twitter feed, run by a guy with a cartoon avatar. He advertises things like mass demonstrations against “The Great Reset” (a weird conspiracy theory, don’t ask)."
mobile.twitter.com/NeilDotObrien/status/1330830796966518785

mobile.twitter.com/robfordmancs/status/1331310559594225665

I don’t sitdown but I think it’s a valid point. Health is luck. I’m not lucky in terms of being t1 diabetic but plenty of people I know my age are healthy and they should be able to live their lives as normal. Ultimately it’s survival of the fittest and I’ve always been aware that I’m more vulnerable than if I didn’t have t1. That’s life.

"But of course the government got it wrong. They assumed it was a virus that would wipe out 5-10% of the population"

This is total gaslighting bullshit. The figure often quoted in the press was about half a million based on early estimates of the IFR of 1%. There was also some idea that significantly more may need hospitalisation

I also think it is rather arrogant to throw around the term critical thinking as if it is some special skill that only those who believe that covid is an overblown "casedemic" or whatnot.

I have rather more confidence that world leaders and their scientific advisers have critical thinking skills than some random person on the internet.

Let's also not forget that these leaders and advisers have to apply these skills in deciding how to implement actual policies as opposed to the great Barrington crew who said " shield" the vulnerable with no actual suggestions as to how this could be achieved in practice.

I’m with you OP

@Unremarkablebear well I got diagnosed with stage 3 cancer. I fought to live and my life is worth living. I am classed as vunerable and I'm damn sure covid isn't going to wipe me out. My life is not worth less than anyone else's. I paid into the NHS and i have as much right to live as the next person. I hate the vunerable tag as it implies people are weak. I'm tougher than most people. I was given a 6% chance of survival and im still here. Sorry to be blunt but you need to get off the pity train there are people who's health is far worse than yours and yes they deserve as much health care as the next person.

I don’t disagree Sitdown
However I’ve been at sahm for a number of years. I haven’t contributed and it seems unfair for me to take out. Also mine is a lifelong condition. It’s probably cost them hundreds of thousands of pounds for very little return.

I’m very glad you beat the odds

@FreshFreesias

I’m with you OP

What is that supposed to mean? The Daily Mail article published an incorrect graph taken from an anonymous twitter account, did not publish the most recent ONS figures and contained a number of other errors. It also challenged a winter deaths scenario figure as being wrong when winter has only just started.

So what exactly are you supporting here - the publishing of misinformation in a national newspaper?

@raviolidreaming

The issue with 'underlying health conditions' is that it doesn't account for life expectancy had that person not contracted covid. Is a 35 year old with diabetes an acceptable death because they had an underlying health condition? A 45 year old with asthma? A 70 year old with stable angina who was otherwise fit and active? Underlying health conditions doesn't mean that death was imminent. People aren't expendable because they aren't in perfect health.

This.

Many of the so called underlying health issues that make someone vulnerable to Covid are not normally life limiting.

I'm CV. 46y with arthritis and on medication for it. This has no impact on how long I will live. It doesn't reduce my life expectancy.

I caught Covid and was rather ill. I was in hospital with a huge blood pressure spike and rushed there due to risk of stroke and heart attack.

Had I died of a heart attack due to the Covid complication it would have been reported as 'woman with underlying health issues' - but that's just not right really is it?! My underlying health issues wouldn't have been the cause of death. Covid would have been, or rather a complication caused by Covid.

I hate the whole 'underlying health issue' - it potentially could hide so much!!

Erm doesn't it just show that the precautions are working?

@Aragog I totally agree. Anyone can catch Covid and be ill with it and die from it. Far too much is blaming underlying health issues. I doubt many people are 100% tip top healthy. Its giving people a false sense of security. What do these people class as underlying health issues. Many people are a few pounds over weight or have high or low blood pressure. It does not mean those underlying health issues are going to kill you.

Absolutely @Aragog. I get so wound up with the whole was it with or of COViD?
I have mild asthma. Only ever needed oral steroids once in my life. I have a primary aged dd but according to some I am weak and vulnerable and don't matter. Dh is ecv too and had been whole throughout. Again his life expectancy is unaffected.
Glad you are on the road to recovery.

Wfh not whole.