Why can’t people who’ve had confirmed covid be exempt?

[Isadora2007]

And if they don’t think it confers enough immunity how is the vaccine going to differ? If people who’ve been vaccinated won’t need to self isolate after exposure anymore then why isn’t that the case for people who’ve had it?

Because the immunity given by a vaccine is not the same as the immunity from getting it
How is it different? Immunity is immunity no matter how you acquire it. Whether that’s from catching a disease that triggers an immune response, or from receiving a vaccine that triggers the same immune response.

The antibody test is not enough to say weather you can get it again or not. Since Covid has not been around long enough we wouldn’t actually know yet. Plus some of my colleagues had a positive antibody test and were shocked because they were never unwell!

I think it's likely that booster shots will be needed for the covid vaccines. I also know of some people who got it march and earlier who are now getting it again but milder.

Vaccine immunity is different to nature immunity by contracting the virus.

If there are different rules for different people many would exploit. Faked Covid+ tests etc.

It might currently be rare to get it twice but who's to say antibodies last about 9 months and are currently wearing off for people who had it in March?

For what it's worth, my DSis had it in March and still has a full load of antibodies.

I am not an immunologist but if as Bluntness says viral load is important, vaccination means you can inject a shed load of the part of the virus that stimulates the immune system without injecting a shed load of the live virus which might kill you!

Or I could be talking bollocks?!

Vaccine immunity is different to nature immunity by contracting the virus
That doesn’t make the immunity different. Natural immunity is the disease triggering your immune system response. Vaccine immunity is the vaccine triggering your immune system response. In both cases it’s triggering the same immune system response. So the immunity is the same.

Because people would would deliberately get infected, some of those would infect other people and some of those that are low risk would still need hospital treatment and so risk overwhelming the NHS. Getting it deliberately would understandably be tempting for those that are young.

vaccination means you can inject a shed load of the part of the virus that stimulates the immune system without injecting a shed load of the live virus which might kill you!
They never inject a live full strength virus in a vaccine.

A live vaccine (such as the Oxford Covid vaccine) involve injecting a weakened form of the virus to make your immune system respond. An inactivated vaccine involves injecting a dead virus to make your immune system respond. This is traditional vaccine technology that’s been used for decades.

The new mRNA vaccines (such as the Moderna and Pfizer vaccines for Covid) involve genetically engineering a small part of the virus and injecting that to make your immune system respond. This is brand new technology and as such I’m a bit wary of it, I’d feel more comfortable having the Oxford vaccine.

@PucePanther

Because the immunity given by a vaccine is not the same as the immunity from getting it How is it different? Immunity is immunity no matter how you acquire it. Whether that’s from catching a disease that triggers an immune response, or from receiving a vaccine that triggers the same immune response.

That’s really not the case. This explains it quite well and is reassuring.

www.google.co.uk/amp/s/uk.mobile.reuters.com/article/amp/idUKKBN27E2NQ

They never inject a live full strength virus in a vaccine

Exactly. But they can inject a massive amount of something similar to the virus/part of it to produce the immune response without exposing a person to the live virus and all the deadly symptoms that come with it.

One of the problems is that people think it is rate to get it twice however we don't know that. There are not many cases proven but they have no way of knowing if people have had it then had it again and been non symptomatic. There are too many questions still unanswered to be able to give definitive information.

This is new, it will take time to work it out.

Those who've had covid could be protected from future symptoms themselves, but still able to transmit the virus if they come into contact with it (i.e. increasing number of asymptomatic carriers). Vaccines need to protect those you come into contact with.

Also, as above, it would lead to idiots deliberately trying to catch covid, an approach which has many issues. Not least that stupidity has the potential to lead to higher viral loads that may lead to more severe illness.

Me and DP had it back in April, as did both of my grandparents. Now, DP and grandad tested positive for antibodies, whereas me and my gran did not, despite the fact that we both had it too.

Interestingly, we did have milder symptoms than the other two so perhaps that does have an effect on future immunity.

But I think the main point is that:

1. Nobody understands enough about the virus yet to give people free passes.
2. If people are picking up virus particles through things they've touched, and are spreading those particles around, they can still spread the virus whether they've had it or not, therefore isolation after being in contact with an infected person is still important.

New research suggests that immunity may be longer lasting than previously expected, although only time will tell for certain.
www.nytimes.com/2020/11/17/health/coronavirus-immunity.html

Surely the main reason is there would then be absolutely no incentive for following the rules anymore. Everyone would want to get it so they can come out of lockdown. Cases would explode.

Interestingly, people I know who've had covid are more determined than most to follow the rules. Mostly because they really know it's a nasty disease I suspect.

@PucePanther

vaccination means you can inject a shed load of the part of the virus that stimulates the immune system without injecting a shed load of the live virus which might kill you! They never inject a live full strength virus in a vaccine.

A live vaccine (such as the Oxford Covid vaccine) involve injecting a weakened form of the virus to make your immune system respond. An inactivated vaccine involves injecting a dead virus to make your immune system respond. This is traditional vaccine technology that’s been used for decades.

The new mRNA vaccines (such as the Moderna and Pfizer vaccines for Covid) involve genetically engineering a small part of the virus and injecting that to make your immune system respond. This is brand new technology and as such I’m a bit wary of it, I’d feel more comfortable having the Oxford vaccine.

I said something similar on another thread and everyone laughed at me and the rest of the thread was people joking about gene changes and how we would all become zombies - not the most constructive vaccine thread in the end

I am pretty sure there will be a U-turn on this once the elderly and most vulnerable in society have been vaccinated. In that, it will actually be beneficial for us to continually be exposed to mild forms of this disease, often in childhood, to boost long term immunity. The current policy is to avoid Covid parties. Why did Boris Johnson have to self-isolate: well he is PM and was very ill last time so for the 1 per cent chance that he could get it severely again but mainly because he has to stand as an example, to do the right thing, to show he is self isolating (and by implication, we all should). The "let us just get Covid over and done with" mentality is definitely starting to take hold now. It is dangerous for the at risk groups due to the constraints in the NHS. It doesn't help that government know and are showing by keeping schools open that there is a sense of going for herd immunity among the young & healthy.

If people who’ve been vaccinated won’t need to self isolate after exposure anymore

Has that been announced? I haven’t seen it.

We don't know yet whether people for whom the vaccine is effective (ie they don't get ill) will or will not be able to nevertheless be infectious to others. Or last I heard we don't know. But even if that is the case, them passing it on won't matter so much if the people they pass it to have also been vaccinated and will mostly also not get ill or severely ill.

@tanstaafl

You can still catch it, have no symptoms , and pass it on.

There have only been a handful of cases in the world where they have caught it twice. It's very very rare.

@PucePanther

vaccination means you can inject a shed load of the part of the virus that stimulates the immune system without injecting a shed load of the live virus which might kill you! They never inject a live full strength virus in a vaccine.

A live vaccine (such as the Oxford Covid vaccine) involve injecting a weakened form of the virus to make your immune system respond. An inactivated vaccine involves injecting a dead virus to make your immune system respond. This is traditional vaccine technology that’s been used for decades.

The new mRNA vaccines (such as the Moderna and Pfizer vaccines for Covid) involve genetically engineering a small part of the virus and injecting that to make your immune system respond. This is brand new technology and as such I’m a bit wary of it, I’d feel more comfortable having the Oxford vaccine.

The Oxford vaccine is not a weakened form of coronavirus but a different (non-infectious) virus entirely, engineered to produce a coronavirus spike protein that causes an immune response when injected with it. The mRNA vaccines also produce a spike protein that give an immune response, it's just a different way of getting it into the body - using a different vehicle.