Case in bubble, but only close contacts isolating

[AlexaShutUp]

There has been a confirmed case in dd's year group. There are 160 of them but they are treated as one bubble due to being in GCSE year/mixed classes. There is no social distancing in school, and no ventilation in some of the classrooms, so probably quite high chance of transmission within the bubble.

I had assumed that a positive case would mean the whole bubble having to isolate, but it seems that they're isolating "close contacts" only. I assume that this means those kids who sit near the confirmed cases in class and the friends that they hang out with at lunch etc. However, it doesn't seem to account for close contact in the very crowded corridors etc, though I guess most (not all) of the kids will be wearing masks as they move around the school.

I can see the logic in identifying certain kids who need to isolate while the rest of the bubble cracks on, and I appreciate that the school is no doubt trying to minimise the educational impact of any confirmed cases, but I'm surprised as I thought the whole point of the bubble system was that everyone would isolate if one went down. Have I got this wrong? Would be interested to know how other schools are managing this.

I'm happy that dd can stay in school, just a bit concerned that contacts of the confirmed case might have been missed and that keeping them all in school could spread it further. DH and I are both in the vulnerable category, so just a bit nervous, but perhaps I have just misunderstood how the whole bubble thing is supposed to work?

"Extremely alarmist".

Whatever measures are being taken in secondary schools aren't working.

@QueenBlueberries

wowwwww. Hold your horses there.

Noblegiraffe has one perspective. She has been extremely alarmist on many boards. Try and keep a balanced view on this.

Many schools go way beyond what is expected by the government. We have had face masks in corridors from the start, have two food halls, scattered start/break/lunch and everything in between, fixed seating plans, the teachers have plexiglax boards between themselves and pupils, teachers can wear masks to teach if they wish, pupils are reminded when they walk in every class to use handgel, to put on their masks before going out of lesson, we have a rota of cleaners in school all day/starting early/working late.

I want to teach in this school.

My school is nothing like this.

My dd is in a bubble of 300 in her y11 and over the last few weeks quite a few children have tested positive and over the last few days it's been children in dds actual class. When she told me yesterday that she sits near one of the cases and wasn't sent home like the others who sit around the case were I rang the school.

Head of year explained the process to me and said they contact PHE England first and then they tell them who to treat as a close contact based on distance and time. They don't actually ask the child who they sit near in classes, they go off a seating plan that teachers are supposed to strictly follow and told me my child isn't a close contact so no need to isolate.

Except the seating plan isn't followed by some teachers and students are moved about if the behaviour of others are disruptive and quite a few times dd is one of the children told to go sit next to a disruptive pupil, or if she's sat on her own because the people who usually sit near her are isolating she's told to swap seats. It's not just one teacher that does this either, it's about four but I've learned has done it almost every week since they've gone back.

Head of year spoke to dd on phone and went through the last few days classes with her and it and it turns out she should have been sent home to isolate on Friday.

My school is also nothing like the one mentioned by @QueenBlueberries

They are using the same method at our school. I get an email to say which year and that close contacts have been informed.

I've never received an email saying that a teacher has a positive test and close contacts (pupils sat near the teacher) have been contacted to isolate. I'm assuming that this is because teachers aren't in a bubble and they'd be sending home pupils from multiple year groups and not because they are trying to suppress staff infection rates from parents

WOMAN- don't they ask who the child travelled to school with and who they spent lunch/break with?

Our school is also nothing like QueenBlueberries one.

Only desks cleaned between lessons are the science labs if they do an experiment and the food tech rooms. Normal desks aren't cleaned between lessons and the specialist cleaners come after school (we had an email about this)

Government guidance says no teaching in masks but masks in communal areas and corridors mandatory.

The only similar thing to plexiglass is plastic sheeting down the middle of the food tech rooms so kids stick to one half of the room. The plastic is the sort of stuff used in shop packaging and not solid wipeable plexiglass.

There can be quite a lot of pressure on teachers to say that they aren’t close contacts of any kids, whether that’s true or not.

This is what is happening in my dc's school and its worrying. The school sent an email yesterday saying there were 2 cases in 2 different year groups (Didn't inform us which ones but I already knew one year due to FB) and that close contacts had been informed and told to isolate, this was the first positive cases in the school.

Now 2 of the close contacts get the school bus (provided, not public bus) to our village with my Ds's and they sit together on the bus, yet no mention about the bus situation once they have left school.

The email also stated that the school will not be telling parents when their has been a positive case and only parents who need to know will be informed.

It all just seems so wrong to me, We as parents should be informed of any cases and be able to make a decision if we still want to send our kids and take the risk, I would honestly rather take a fine for unauthorised absence than any of us catch it.

@noblegiraffe

There can be quite a lot of pressure on teachers to say that they aren’t close contacts of any kids, whether that’s true or not.

Is that because of the guidelines or parents being pissed off? I've seen some of the classrooms at our school and the teacher would have to walk constantly or have a watch with timer so that they move every 14 mins

This has happened in my DS’s school too. They used to send home whole bubbles, but now it’s only close contacts. I think that ignores the evidence about airborne transmission in enclosed spaces, but hopefully it’s mitigated by lower transmission rates amongst children.

So when schools send whole year groups home then does that mean there's multiple cases in the year or not enough staff?

WOMAN- don't they ask who the child travelled to school with and who they spent lunch/break with?

They have a seating plan for lunch too. The same children are supposed to sit on the same table. (Doesn't always happen though as lunch supervisors will send one to another table and sometimes students will move to sit with their friends who they don't have classes with)

Similar for the bus. They're supposed to be separated by year group so y11 on top deck at back and are meant to sit in the same seats but that doesn't always happen either because the bus company doesn't always send a double decker and it's sometimes a mini bus and they're all mixed together instead of space between them.

I would have assumed the school would know the days when the year groups have been mixed with no kind of distance but I'm not so sure now to be honest.

Yes, that's the directive.
SLT examine seating plans and just send home close contacts.

There was a post on brtus where positive in class, child in room not a close contact. Except a survey test showed they were positive despite not deemed within 2.
There have been schools with 40+ positive.
Ideally kids wouldn't be being moved about. Dc1 said she has 1 person next to her morning then another in afternoon. It is not even just doubling the risk because all the kids are moving about.

We"ve got music teachers going in. Tours of the school. All eating in the open plan hall. 1 toilet per 30 kids. After school and before clubs. Once it's in it will be off like a rocket!!. Even if kids were half as likely to catch and spread there is still a high likelihood with 30 of them. And not only that our reception class has at least 4 adults open plan to each other (and the toilets effectively).
Just pitti g kids and teachers in masks would have saved a lot of lives. Plus would people argue so much if it's say masks for kids or they pay 50% tax and their kids do too or a bill for extra tax on property etc.

Queenblueberries - dds achool is exactly like this - gel on entry to class and all kids have to wipe their desk at start and end

To be honest if other schools are not like this why aren’t people complaining or making changes to their own classes at least? I teach college students but I get learners to use gel on entry, wipe their desks with wipes before and end of lessons etc. I make them sit in same seat each time wtc Not all staff do this but I insist. It’s a few packs wipes a week!

No one tells me too I just do it because to me that’s the minimum.

Many schools go way beyond what is expected by the government. We have had face masks in corridors from the start, have two food halls, scattered start/break/lunch and everything in between, fixed seating plans, the teachers have plexiglax boards between themselves and pupils, teachers can wear masks to teach if they wish, pupils are reminded when they walk in every class to use handgel, to put on their masks before going out of lesson, we have a rota of cleaners in school all day/starting early/working late.

I think dd's school has done its very best to keep the different year groups apart, encourage mask wearing in corridors, promote good hand hygiene etc. I think they are doing everything that they can, but surely very few schools would have the money to invest in plexiglass to separate all of the teachers and pupils etc, nor can they afford a large army of cleaners. I just don't think this is realistic for schools which were already operating on a shoestring previously.

That's what's happening at my child's school and there have been 8 confirmed cases in the past 5 days, so it's not a very efficient method in my opinion. I'm considering homeschooling for the remainder of the term.

My local garage uses a cardboard stand and plastic sheeting as a barrier

I’m sure schools could quickly knock something similar up in using stuff from an art or DT class!

All you need is clear plastic - doesn’t have to be Perspex or expensive material

It could be the equivalent of laminator type sheets at minimal costs nailed to some wooden posts

Hmm, so dd is home now and has been telling me about how it all went. Sounds like they have sent around 40-50 kids home in total. DD sits very near the kid who tested positive in several of her lessons, but not actually next to her. Lots of the kids who dd does sit next to have been sent home, so they could have easily passed something on to dd yesterday if they had caught it from the girl who tested positive last week!

Nothing we can do now, so I guess we just have to wait and see/hope for the best, but the system does seem really flawed. It would make much more sense to me to close the entire bubble, or else test them all, or something.

DD said a couple of the kids had panic attacks in school today. She is quite resilient herself and is coping ok, but she is worried about passing it on to me or DH, or to one of her teachers - she's aware that a couple of them are vulnerable and that they are feeling really stressed right now. Also wondering what's going to happen about her mocks this month, as loads of her year group will still be isolating when they were supposed to start!

What a mess!

It really is a big mess. And so very stressful for the kids. And even more so for those like your dd who is also worrying about her vulnerable family. Hope everything works out ok for you.

Thanks starrynight19, I really appreciate that.

I am feeling quite anxious, but realise that we're in a better position than many. One of dd's friends told her that his mum is in the clinically extremely vulnerable category, which must be really scary for the boy and his family.

to all school staff and parents who are being affected by this.

It's a bit perverse to be honest. My DD best friend doesn't sit with her in class, but they spend lunch and break together and travel in with each other. Her friend is anti mask and won't (not can't) wear one.

The school has confirmed that if the friend gets it my daughter will not be told to isolate because they don't sit in class together.

Hmmmm

The school does the seating plans bit, it’s up to the child to identify who they are close contacts with outside of lessons.

In that respect, at least, dd's school seem to have got things about right - the girl's friendship group all appear to be in isolation now, as well as the kids she sits next to in class.