What's life like in other countries at the moment?

[ChaosTrulyReigns]

I seem to recall tales of Lockdown in France, Spain, Italy and even Sweden taking up a lot of news columns in the spring.

But there seems to be very little now. Obviously there's a lot to fill the papers with currently, so maybe that's the reason?

If you're not in The UK, how's life for you?

[sashagabadon]

@UntilYourNextHairBrainedScheme

Here in Germany there was an announcement a couple of days ago that vaccination won't be compulsory - that was actually the big story in my area.

My parents in the UK are convinced that the UK is developing the vaccine all alone, and getting all flag wavy about it. Here people seem to thing the German- American BioNTech- Pfizer vaccine is the vaccine. Its weird how many people seem to think that only their own county has a vaccine in trials.

This is very true
However I do think those countries developing the vaccines using their populations as the guinea pigs / volunteers should be proud and blowing their own trumpets a bit. So the Germans should be proud as should the Brits. I am. The vaccine is really part 2 of this saga and I think the U.K. is doing well in part 2. The Germans have done well of course in both parts

[IrishMamaMia]

Having a bit of time out from lockdown in the summer and the ability to do some travel has made things just about bearable.

[IrishMamaMia]

Absolutely @sashagabadon it's such a brave thing to do. I am proud of the expertise in Germany and UK.

[MarshaBradyo]

Absolutely Sasha the volunteers and the scientific expertise. Incredible breakthrough

[Mistigri]

France here. Lockdown definitely more resented/less respected than the first time, but mask wearing is pretty widespread and is mostly enforced.

Govt has made a number of unforced errors which have cost public support.

Employers not playing the game - working from home is supposed to be the rule but seems to be the exception in practice. And the covid protocol for high schools is a joke.

Universities supposed to be shut but my son is still having in person classes (exams, practicals).

There are some signs that cases are decreasing but not fast enough.

[UntilYourNextHairBrainedScheme]

MarshaBradyo no - Merkel has only said healthcare workers and risk groups will have priority. Spahn has said Germany will have one million doses - the contract is being negotiated still and the final trials are not complete. Apparently concrete policy will be made in the next few weeks. Talk is of it being available in spring but assurances it won't be rushed and implication that if its available in the USA first that'll be because their approval standards are lower...

[Tadpolesandfroglets]

There’s obviously not just one factor involved in a country’s successful handling of the virus. There’s lots of reasons why Australia or NZ, for example have faired well. Not having a bumbling idiot for a PM for example is probably a significant one. However, you can’t ignore density figures. We are a small island stuffed to the gunnels, added to that we don’t have near constant sunshine (uv also kills viruses) and high vit D levels because of this. And we (the U.K.) are mostly non-compliant, or it seems way.

[sashagabadon]

@IrishMamaMia

I am happy about NZ and Australia, a family member lives there and life is fairly normal but she does mention the spectre of Covid hanging over them so not unaffected.
I think the difference between NZ and Australia has been the will of the people. I, and I'm not alone in this, would not be willing to have the travel restrictions and longer lockdown measures. There would have been mass civil disobedience across Europe if that was the case.

Agree with this. I cannot imagine any European country closing their borders indefinitely in the way ASU’s and NZ has done. Even if we had say in Feb or March, to still have them closed now and potentially for most of 2021 is unthinkable. Politically it would be a no go for any country to maintain and if we had closed the borders in Europe back in March we’d be having a truly hideous first wave about now instead of a less hideous one now. Plus think of all the knowledge we gained in the NHS alone with all the trials and research. We would not have had the number of patients/ opportunities to gather knowledge. Careful what you wish for springs to mind

[islockdownoveryet]

@RaspberryCoulis

The difference between Aussies and Brits is that Aussies follow the rules whereas British people are more rebellious

What a load of absolute tripe.

I agree , if that's what you've heard on the media it's a small percentage of people.
I don't believe for a 2nd that 100% of people round the world are following the rules and it's only us brits who aren't .
Its true I think us brits are more vocal at disagreeing and yes there are many that are rightly or wrongly protesting about lockdown but most of us want to get on with it .

[TheHoneyFactory]

@Tadpolesandfroglets

There’s obviously not just one factor involved in a country’s successful handling of the virus. There’s lots of reasons why Australia or NZ, for example have faired well. Not having a bumbling idiot for a PM for example is probably a significant one. However, you can’t ignore density figures. We are a small island stuffed to the gunnels, added to that we don’t have near constant sunshine (uv also kills viruses) and high vit D levels because of this. And we (the U.K.) are mostly non-compliant, or it seems way.

oh we have a bumbling idiot... he just fucked up so badly over our summer that Morrison didn't dare dally over covid. People died, lost homes and experienced horrific trauma (still are) only months prior to shutting borders. He needed to be seen to act as the hatred for him was palpable in March.

[IamTomHanks]

@ImRealHonest

I live in Al Ghadeer so I have what I call the golden ticket. I can travel freely through the checkpoint without a COVID test.

We've got the plexi-glass fish bowels in my office as well. We were gearing up for 70% but the high number of daily cases made us go back to 20%. However word around the virtual water cooler aka Teams chats is that we will be go up to 70% in the next few weeks.

Honestly, I'm pretty content with how the UAE has handled everything.

[Namenic]

Honey factory - i think internal borders probably did help and think that U.K. should have blocked off low incidence area early with furlough and quarantine for cross border workers.

But U.K. could not even manage their external borders let alone any internal ones.

[miimblemomble]

Employers not playing the game - working from home is supposed to be the rule but seems to be the exception in practice. And the covid protocol for high schools is a joke.

This, in France. And I’d add the recently dropped insistence that primary aged kids aren’t a risk to each other or to a mask wearing adult.

The ministers get up on tv and tell us how dreadful it all is, how awful the numbers are, blah blah protocol renforcée ... and then schools just carry on as they are, the metros are still full of office workers and I get a text from the phone shop / Darty /FNAC saying they are still open!

I’m finding the cognitive dissonance a bit hard to take tbh.

[Jroseforever]

There really isn’t much difference between how every COuntry has each responded. Maybe a difference in timing but only days or weeks difference. Small differences in the time bars shut etc

But these little tweaks I suspect are insignificant in the overall picture.

Likewise, populations have responded similarly. Differences being marginal.

It’s about population density. That lies at the root of the spread of a pandemic.

[ChaToilLeam]

Hello from Germany!

Here in Bavaria we have lockdown-light: businesses and shops open, but cafes, bars and restaurants closed except for take out. Museums, galleries, sports centres also closed, hotels closed to tourists but open to business travelers. Working from home recommended where possible. Masks on public transport, shops, schools, and a lot of town and city centres. Restrictions on meeting: 2 households max, up to ten people. All Christmas markets are cancelled. 😢

Most people are just getting on with it, our wave 2 numbers are high though starting to turn around, if this morning’s report is anything to go by. Very hopeful about this vaccine. We have our fair share of Covidiots though: protestors in Leipzig and crunchy anti-vaxxers...

[Frazzled2207]

Really interesting to hear these stories. I think we are (for these four weeks anyway) among the tighter end of the spectrum in terms of rules, that said I think we probably have a very high proportion of rule breakers too. There’s little confidence in the government which is probably a factor.
But conversely wfh seems to have become much more of a “thing” here which is good news generally (especially for parents) but especially with the pandemic - Interesting to hear it’s not necessarily the case everywhere.

[Malin52]

Agreed that NZ pop density is a factor. But we have the same density as Finland Norway and Saudi Arabia. The chart shows the vast difference in the figures. Also we don't all live miles from each other surrounded by sheep. In the cities we live in flats and there's loads of large shared houses. We go to busy restaurants, pubs and use public transport....sometimes these are busier than London because we are smaller!

The difference is:

• quick early lockdown
• a lockdown that shut EVERYTHING except supermarkets and even they were closely defined and one in one out. No exceptions for takeaways, food delivery or B&M! Even construction stopped.
• immediate border closure to all except citizens and permanent residents (still in place)
• enforced government quarantine for all border arrivals

And importantly

• clear, thoughtful messaging from the government; it made sense, they gave reasons, they were consistent, they did as they said and they reviewed the approach regularly using expertise and science. Everyone was behind it. Kiwis are belligerent at the best of times and not great at following the rules but hell, this time they did.

The UK did none of these things. Population density is a tiny factor.

Yes there's been some impact but nothing like the impact on the Uk in terms of job losses etc. The brain drain that usually happens with Kiwis flocking to London has reversed as they all decide to come home. Property is booming. NZ tourism is burgeoning as Kiwis holiday in their own beautiful country. Buying local has increased.

Agreed it can't last forever. No one knows how we can reopen Borders when we are in elimination. We are all pretty happy though. Only allowing in those with a Vax cert and tested on arrival? Who knows

[Frazzled2207]

@Jroseforever
I agree that population density is a biggie. That said I think compliance is probably an even bigger factor- how else do you explain that S Korea and Japan haven’t suffered nearly as badly as we have. They are among the most densely populated places on Earth.

[Tadpolesandfroglets]

And I repeat. It’s not just one factor involved.

[TheKeatingFive]

But we have the same density as Finland Norway and Saudi Arabia.

In fairness, Finland and Norway have the best figures in Europe, suggesting that density is very important.

Cultural factors play an important part too. In Ireland, where I am, the culture of large family get togethers, involving a couple of generations, in smallish private homes because of the shit weather, really drove spread in September.

[TheKeatingFive]

how else do you explain that S Korea and Japan haven’t suffered nearly as badly as we have. They are among the most densely populated places on Earth.

Well South Korea is basically a surveillance state and had the best T&T imaginable.

Japan is the biggest mystery. They didn’t lockdown. They didn’t test. They live on top of each other and generations live side by side. I actually think we’ll find they had greater immunity due to previous CV exposure or something. It doesn’t stack up and I don’t understand why it’s not getting more attention.

But yes, multifactorial, very complex, with variables that are unknown at present.

[Malin52]

@RaspberryCoulis

The difference between Aussies and Brits is that Aussies follow the rules whereas British people are more rebellious

What a load of absolute tripe.

Ha ha! Agree. Have you seen a Kiwi queuing? It's a train wreck! They pay no attention to rules. The country was built on the concept of 'she'll be right'! Rules are silly inconveniences. For a compliant Brit like me it's actually quite shocking!

The difference here was the government communication and specifically the leadership of Jacinda. I'll never forget the night before lockdown her Facebook live where she was on her sofa in her sweats having put her kid to bed and she spoke calmingly and convincingly about our 'team of 5 million' and doing this for the country.

That shit makes a difference.

[manicinsomniac]

Saudi
Masks and social distancing
Everything open except schools
Opposite of the UK but with far far fewer cases and deaths

That is fascinating. At the start of Sept a pupil at my school moved from the UK back to Saudi and a colleague joked, 'first time in recent history that that's a very good idea!' I remember thinking I wasn't sure if that was true and checked the stats to see that UK and Saudi were together on the table, with the UK one place above Saudi.

So, in two months, the UK has shot up the table and Saudi has fallen right down it. They are now 8th and 27th respectively and in Sept I think were about 14th and 15th.

I really hope that's not evidence that schools closed/everything else shut works and schools open/everything else shuts doesn't but it's a worrying (for the UK) anecdotal observation.

[Guernseymum21]

Guernsey here. No restrictions but reminders to respect personal space and hand sanitizer at the entrance to all shops/offices/hairdressers etc.
The borders are open but almost everyone has to quarantine for 14 days on arrival and the penalty for breaching this is upwards of £3,000 and potentially prison. You are checked on frequently too.

Guernsey went into lockdown at a similar time to the UK and compliance was high. Once they developed on island testing facilities they were able to understand what was going on better- at the start tests were sent to the UK and took a long time to be processed.

We went about 100 days with no cases, the majority are from travel but there was a cluster on island which resulted in several hundred people being put into isolation and it curbed community transmission.

Very fortunate to be living a normal life but hard to not be able to see family in the UK and abroad.

Guernsey is densely populated and has an elderly population so there was a fear it could be catastrophic here.

[eaglejulesk]

Ha ha! Agree. Have you seen a Kiwi queuing? It's a train wreck!

Not in this part of the country it's not - queuing went brilliantly here!