Vitamin D

[Borderscotch]

Seen lots of info on vitamin D but not sure what I should be looking for in a supplement, what amount etc. Can anyone help. I did Google but confused myself

Sorry, forgot link again

www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2015/03/150317122458.htm

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I was very defficent a few years ago, my blood work was like 12, I was prescribed it to start with then took it regularly myself at 4,000iu, a day. you really need to take a high quality D3 gell capsule tablet.

We are all taking 1,000iu a day at the moment I should probably yp mine to 2,000iu but haven't had a blood test in a while. I was told to not stop taking it though.

You really shouldn't take more then 4,000iu without a blood test to confirm your deficient. Event then I only need to take 10,000 for 2 weeks before dropping to 4,000iu. This was done under my GP who was checking my blood work. I did carry on taking 4,000iu for 6 months but didn't need to carry on at that level after that as my levels where over 100 at that point.

The uk recommendation is ridiculously low, and only enough to prevent rickets. They have shown that people who work outside all the time in sunny clinics regularly have over 100ml in there blood work.

I only took k2 when I was taking a really high dose, most of the time you should get enough from your diet if taking a maintenance dose.

The thing is, the advice all still seems very general - how are supposed to believe both that 4,000iu is the max safe dose and that it is the optimum dose? And that the same dose is safe for a young, slim, fair skinned adult who does not wear sunscreen year-round, 24-hours a day, as for an obese, middle-aged, dark skinned person who covers up for religious reasons?

I'm not skinny but I am very fair skinned, my ancestors hail from bonbine Scotland so I was very surprised I was so defficent.

But your right the only way to tell is a blood test, but you can get home blood tests.

@MigGril - yes, but with no consensus on optimum blood levels, where does that leave someone who is not deficient, but who some experts argue is still at risk (while others don’t)?

I like to skip our government advice and go straight to more recent research. You mit find this site useful.

www.vitamindsociety.org/

But basically we are now looking at 100-150nml for optimum vitamin D levels.

@Walkaround - I find the medical research studies linked to by BahHumbygge very informative on optimum levels. Ivor Cummings's lecture is excellent in explaining the difference between levels that prevent rickets and optimum levels.
For the purpose of MN threads, if we could just get a clear message out to people not already taking a supplement, and a suggestion to take a test if they can afford one, we will have achieved something 😊.

Testing is definitely the key. As per above, my DM and my MIL. Two very different individuals. DM, 92, olive skinned, still sits out in the sunshine in the summer, her level was 75, so she was given a small boost supplement to take daily. MIL, 85, fair skinned, never goes in the sun, her level was 12!, she got a huge initial dose, and then a large daily dose.

@DianaT1969 - I agree that it is a very important message that all people in the UK should be supplementing (and that the UK advice on daily intake is ridiculously low by international standards, despite being a country that should be at the forefront of research on this, due to the impossibility of citizens of this country getting vit D from sunlight for half of the year here). However, deciding on a very high dosage (eg 4000iu) on the back of some research studies is not what I personally feel safe doing - hence why I am inclined for now to stick with 1,000iu a day, because it’s what I’ve done for years already, so don’t need any kind of “booster” to get levels up, and is a level that nobody seems to think is unsafe. I feel very angry, though, that this is something that this country has done so little about for so unbelievably long, leaving its citizens in a highly confusing situation where, even if everyone does start to supplement, there is woefully inadequate advice on how to do it safely and effectively.

We can't possibly test everybody to give a bespoke dose, so we need some general guidelines, eg fair and young, x and dark and old, y. Well, perhaps a bit more specific than that! But at least some guidance beyond "take some vitamin D".

And, as pp mentioned, have one recognised measure, not a whole host of 100s/1000s/uis/ugs/ etc etc. it's no good telling us to take 100 mls if every commercial product is measured in ugs.

And, for the last few years, the message has been a manic plea to cover up in the sun. I have seen people covering prams/pushchairs with tent-like structures in April . And on MN I remember threads when I was more interested in young children (!) with people getting hysterical about their dcs being out at playtime at school without being lathered in sun block.

Thanks for the advice. Like some pp here I'm a bit reluctant to supplement at a high dose without knowing what my starting level is so I've ordered a Vitamin D postal test so that I can try and make an informed choice about what level to go for.

Are particular brands better than others? I'm after a D3/K2 combined supplement that has as few other ingredients as possible.

I'm reluctant to buy from Amazon as, quite aside from the moral argument, they don't have a great track record with selling cosmetics and if they'll sell fakes/seconds of cosmetics I can't trust them not to do the same with vitamins.

Report in today's Express about how the standard RDA for vitamin D could be out by a factor of 10:

Coronavirus cure: A doctor points towards glaring evidence vitamin D could be the answer
CORONAVIRUS has taken away the lives of 48,888 people in the UK; the unfortunate reality is that this number is set to increase over winter. As Britain is under lockdown, Dr Gareth Davies suggests a way out of this crisis.

"The current NHS guidelines suggest everybody needs to be taking 400IU of vitamin D daily between October and early March.

Yet, Dr Davies insists this recommendation needs to be increased.

He suggests that 4,000IU daily is what is needed to keep people safe from coronavirus."

www.express.co.uk/life-style/health/1357526/coronavirus-cure-vitamin-d-supplementation-research

Another article here about how 4000 iu should be the recommended level:

COVID-19: Scientists raise the vitamin D alarm
02-Oct-2020 By Nikki Hancocks

A group of researchers and doctors have formed an international alliance aiming to encourage governments to increase recommendations for vitamin D intake to 4,000 IU daily as they believe this would reduce COVID-19 hospitalisations.

HTTPS:WWW.NUTRAINGREDIENTS.COM/ARTICLE/2020/10/01/COVID-19-SCIENTISTS-RAISE-THE-VITAMIN-D-ALARM

NewShoes... the Better You sprays are good, this one contains 3000 iu plus K2. Though it does contain xylitol if you're avoiding artificial sweeteners. Sorry for the Amazon link, but it is available in other shops such as health food stores and online retailers.

www.amazon.co.uk/BetterYou-DLux-Vitamin-K2-12ml/dp/B0773QKKLP/?tag=mumsnetforu03-21

Otherwise I've bought Nature's Aid vitamin D from the health food shop, which seems very high quality, and I've also bought online from Phoenix Nutrition. I had a delivery problem with them and they were quick to send out a replacement order. Reading the reviews will give you a feel for the reputation of the product, even if you purchase from another store, or you could ask for advice in your local health food shop as to which brands are best.

@BahHumbygge

Thanks for this. I'm not keen on sweeteners but they're not a complete no-go if I can't find an alternative.

The stumbling block I've hit is finding K2 that isn't derived from soya or other legumes (I'm allergic to the whole legume family).

I may have to just take Vitamin D alone and hope that it isn't harmful without K2.

I take Incite vitamin D3. It is a tiny tablet

Argh, the soya thing is a real stumbling block WRT vit K2 as most of it is manufactured from natto, fermented soya beans. Some people make their own natto from other beans such as black beans, but that's no go if the whole legume family is off limits. Best thing I can suggest is to buy the vitamin D on its own and get K2 through dietary sources such as Gouda, Jarlsberg and similar cheeses, grass fed butter, grass fed dairy, dark chicken meat, egg yolks, liver etc. The cheeses don't have to be grass fed, as it's the fermentation culture in the cheese which makes the K2. Eat foods to nourish your gut health as well, as it may be possible to synthesise K2 internally in your gut (though science yet unclear).

Vit d3 I take it with k2 everyday
Been taking it for 18 months now.
Fit as a butchers dog
Also take zinc ascorbate, multi absorb b, good quality vit c and I’ve heard melatonin is good ..been taking that for years
I’m also blood group O
I’m not getting covid.

@BahHumbygge

Did you just tell me that I need to eat nice cheeses for my health?

If I have to...

Do you think Vit D deficiency could be behind the North/South divide we are seeing? It is sunnier in the south and people who live there seem to spend more time outside enjoying the sunshine. Obviously other factors at play too but might there be something in that?

As in worse cases of Covid up north compared to down south...

@Sandysmam - while that's possible, I think the North is experiencing their first wave. They were locked down before it took a hold there and were at least 2 weeks behind London in terms of cases and transmission.

My parents who live in another European country are both D3 deficient.
My mum has been prescribed a ‘rebuilding dose’ of 20,000 iu a day for 3 weeks. My dad has to take 24,000iu a day for nearly a month.
Then both can drop to 4000 iu a day.
This shows how much is needed to rebuild your levels.

The highest dose I could find online is 10,000. I am also deficient , my levels are 13.

My most recent vitamin d result were 39. I take 25ug a day but my levels seem to fall easily. I've previously been prescribed the high dosage weekly by my GP. What dosage should I be taking as the 25ug doesn't seem to get me to optimal.

You can take up to 100ug apparently