How do you define a vulnerable person (providing care for)

[Comefromaway]

Mil has dementia. She’s very difficult. Father in law has found it hard to cope with for over a year now. He was having suicidal thoughts. Their house is dreadful (they’ve not been coping with looking after it and it’s in a bad area). They are trying to get into sheltered accommodation but there is considerable resistance from various people.

Mil cannot be left alone ever. Before March they used to spend a lot of time at our house just to get them out. Lockdown affected them badly. Mil deteriorated and fil ended up in hospital. We started seeing them in the garden or dh would take them for a walk.

But now you can only meet one person from outside your household outside. Fil can’t go anywhere without mil so he can’t see anyone. But providing care to vulnerable people is allowed.

Dh can’t drive (medical reasons) so he can’t go there much. We live in a nice area and have a nice big garden (they have a tiny back yard and live next door to druggies).

What’s the answer?

I would think that both your MIL and FIL would fall under the vulnerable category and you would therefore be able to provide support in any way you felt necessary

Don't over think things, they are clearly both vulnerable, your judgement of the situation is good enough. Support and care for them as much as they need and you can cope with.

I would have them come live with us but even before the dementia mil was very difficult and would blatantly over rule us with the kids(who are both autistic). To the extent she openly went against any discipline including stuff at school.

Ds is finally back on track after a difficult few years involving Camhs & social services. He can’t cope with mil lack of boundaries (even before dementia she refused to acknowledge the kids bodily autonomy) and now she’s incapable of social distancing.

I sound like I’m making excuses but I have to put Ds first.

I don't think they are going to be checking up on it. It's being left to common sense.

I care for a couple like this. Family do as much as they can, and I work a few set hours. Your in laws definitely class as vulnerable and you can help them as much as you see fit. (Don't bring them to yours, you'll regret it. You have your kids to think of)

Adult Social Care offered a few hours careers but mil won’t accept them(she has never accepted her diagnoses) & fil doesn’t want strangers in the house. She thinks we are preventing her going to visit her parents (they’ve been dead 20 years). She’s also been violent recently and we’ve hidden the knives.

They are clearly vulnerable. People will have to make judgement calls.

I'm sorry OP that sounds very difficult

I don't think anybody would suggest they weren't vulnerable.

If people can self-certify that they don't need to wear a mask, I think people can self-certify that they are caring for someone vulnerable. Anyone of a certain age or with some sort of physical or mental illness. And obviously anyone under 16.

I’m thinking that if fil drives to our house I can sit with her for an hour whilst dh and his dad go for a walk. It gives him a change of scenery and an hour away from her every now and then?

Our neighbours know about her condition as they were very sympathetic when fil was hospitalised last summer.

Of course your PIL are both vulnerable and you absolutely allowed to provide care and support to them whether it means you going to them or them coming to you. Any elderly infirm person that needs to be brought to someone else's garden for recreational exercise, should be absolutely exempt from stay at home rule.

It makes me angry that you should feel worried about breaking rules. You are bearing a great burden of responsibility to five "vulnerable" people, and anything that helps you care for them when you are asking for so little...letting your MIL in your garden...is exempt. You aren't demanding tea at the Ritz to cheer her and your FIL up

@Comefromaway

I’m thinking that if fil drives to our house I can sit with her for an hour whilst dh and his dad go for a walk. It gives him a change of scenery and an hour away from her every now and then?

Our neighbours know about her condition as they were very sympathetic when fil was hospitalised last summer.

This sounds like a perfect idea, and would be under providing essential care. We will still be going to MIL's as she needs meds and general help around the house.

She thinks we are preventing her going to visit her parents (they’ve been dead 20 years)

She's probably not wrong, but not how she thinks!

Honestly, you need a medal!! You must REALLY love your DH.

No ones going to be fining you for helping them, in whatever way you can handle.

& if that's carers or care homes no one would blame you for that either!!

Take care of yourself in all of this!!🌷

Dh is really worried about his dad. Mil is in great physical health but his dads blood pressure is through the roof, he gets chest pains and he had a bad pancreatitis flare up which is what landed him in hospital. Dh and his sister took it in turns to sleep at his mums house during that time & she came to our house in the daytime (we were both working from home then but are back at work now) but I don’t think sil would do that again as mil tried to push her down the stairs and was very threatening.

For some reason she responds very well to dh and doesn’t threaten him though she sometimes forgets who he is.

It sounds as if you are a very caring person and doing your absolute best for your DC, mil and fil. Your DH is very lucky to have you. The suggestion you made about fil driving mil to your garden and your DH going for a walk with his df sounds perfect. Caring duties are allowed during lockdown. Could a home help clean up oil home while they are out visiting you? It would lighten your load a little. Please take care of yourself and DH too. Could they.mot drive to visit sil too?

Thanks for your support though. I just want to do the right thing by everyone.

@Comefromaway

I’m thinking that if fil drives to our house I can sit with her for an hour whilst dh and his dad go for a walk. It gives him a change of scenery and an hour away from her every now and then?

Our neighbours know about her condition as they were very sympathetic when fil was hospitalised last summer.

That sounds like a very good plan. I'm sorry MIL has been violent to your SIL. It's so sad when it comes to that. Was mil always difficult or is it since the dementia? Wishing you all the best, however you decide to handle it. It might be worth looking into a 'PA' rather than a carer agency, as then you would get a regular person who she could get to know. I do this, and was introduced to my couple as a family friend who wanted to help out, which made the transition easier for them.

Yes, she was always difficult in that what she thought stood and if anyone disagreed she’d do it anyway/go behind your back.

I suppose I'd ask myself an I helping this person or caring for them in some way? Would most people view it as care?
I'm in a similar situation: I have visited elderly relative to provide care as they are physically and mentally unwell but not seen my mother who lives ten doors up because that would be a social call.
Do what you think 99% of people would think reasonable is the way to go.

I see my own parents every day as I work for their construction company oddly enough.