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Masks. To wear or not to wear

215 replies

ripples101 · 26/10/2020 19:19

There are two premises:

  1. Wearing a mask DOES help to reduce the spread of covid-19

  2. Wearing a mask DOES NOT help to reduce the spread of covid-19

Obviously, only one of the statements above can be true.

First question: Which of the above statements do you agree with?

Next...

If you DO wear a mask, I think it's reasonable to assume that (for you), one or both of the following statements are true:

  1. You do believe that wearing a mask does helps limit the spread

  2. You do not have a physical or psychological reason that prevents
    you from doing so.

But if you DON'T wear a mask, then the reasons why could be any one (or any combination) of the following:

  1. You have a physical or psychological reason that prevents you from doing so (but you still believe that wearing a mask does help reduce the spread)

  2. You do have a physical or psychological reason that prevents you from doing so (but you don't believe that wearing a mask helps reduce the spread)

  3. There is no point in wearing a mask because you believe that wearing a mask does not help to reduce the spread of Covid-19

  4. You don't believe that you are at risk if you catch Covid-19

  5. You won't be told what to do

  6. You don't believe Covid-19 even exists

(11, 12, 13, etc. etc.) Insert any reason of your own here....

So the question to anyone/everyone.

Which number are you?

(You can choose more than one number!!!)

OP posts:
Mydogdoesntlisten · 28/10/2020 13:18

Sorry Bwlch, my phone autocorrected your nameBlush

20mum · 28/10/2020 13:40

@islockdownoveryet Sorry to hear your son has difficulties. I used to work in a brilliant school for special needs children, and campaign and do voluntary work for disabilities of all kinds. As you see in my post, I reported the words of the t.v. doctor, and the added sentence about some, rare, people who genuinely could not wear masks.

Very reasonably, you mention that you do not insist on taking your unmasked DS out and about constantly in close proximity with the public. You have made a couple of exceptions, but I hope you will agree that although your own DS has not, necessarily, got heightened physical risk, other people, of all ages, do.

That g.p. may have been thinking of patients who came into her surgery. She said every one wore a mask and she couldn't think why any would not, but the extra vulnerable would have been under self imposed solitary confinement, rightly scared to go out while public places are filled with aggressive non-mask wearers.

Is permanent solitary confinement for life, for those thousands living alone, a fair price to pay for those who demand a lovely time getting drunk in close proximity with strangers at the club or the pub, or sitting on public transport, or going round shopping centres and supermarkets, and all without wearing a mask? One of these bullies, in a hundred thousand, might have a condition like your son..... but I doubt it, don't you? The asthmatics I know are the most eager to keep covered, because they are vulnerable. They would prefer to have someone else bring their shopping while an attack is near, and only go out in the intervals when breathing through a mask is possible.

Pandemic risk is like climate emergency. It won't all be over soon, or ever. This isn't going away. 2023 was the most optimistic time when W.H.O. had hoped worldwide covid19 could be 'over', but news now confirms there is no such thing as immunity. In fact, having it once is now known to very soon lose any degree of immunity gained, and the second time infections are worse than the first, and more likely to have fatal or permanent effects.

A normal lifestyle of mask wearing has been commonplace, every-day habit for many years, in the Far East, where they have already been accustomed to a permanent lifestyle of being extra careful of repeated major virus attacks. Swine flu, Asian flu, Spanish flu, Ebola, Plague, and more, have swept through communities and spread to other countries, especially with mass migration and encouragement of non essential travel.

None have entirely vanished from the earth, and all can mutate, and entirely new ones can arise at any time on top of the others. Even T.B., which was a major killer eliminated from U.K., has sprung up again. Permanently living in ways to avoid disease spread is the only viable way to re-arrange our lifestyles. That will have to be the normal situation everywhere in the world, in the new reality.

There is straight choice between every vulnerable person (millions) enduring permanent imprisonment in solitary confinement, or, on the other hand, a small belligerent element (not you, I hasten to add) being given the 'free pass' of being able to yell the word "exempt", and, under that fake cover, using their self awarded right to do anything they damwell like, fists clenched, and not care how many other people die as a result .

A ban on bare faces would have deprived your DS of the two exceptional outings you mention, and you are the world expert on how to please him, but isn't it possible you might have found ways he could do something equally enjoyable to him, but away from proximity with strangers, or by staying in familiar surroundings?

A permission for just one person to go bare-faced, on the other hand, has been abused as the open gateway for the worst elements among the hard of thinking, beating up and even stabbing and coughing in the faces of innocent people, even one local spitting in the face of someone's baby, as a punishment for the mum wearing a mask, which offended his opinion there is no such thing as Covid19 .

DameFanny · 28/10/2020 14:10

That's awful @20mum - have you got a link to the baby incident? I know some people who need to hear about that Sad

Dinosauratemydaffodils · 28/10/2020 14:35

A normal lifestyle of mask wearing has been commonplace, every-day habit for many years, in the Far East, where they have already been accustomed to a permanent lifestyle of being extra careful of repeated major virus attacks. Swine flu, Asian flu, Spanish flu, Ebola, Plague, and more, have swept through communities and spread to other countries, especially with mass migration and encouragement of non essential travel.

If mask wearing becomes permanent here, I hope they legalise euthanasia because I'm done. There is no way I could wear one all day to return to work and even 15 minutes in the supermarket really takes it out of me. The days I do the shopping I need to take pills to sleep. That coupled with no mental health support means putting me down would be the only humane solution. I wish I could show the people who deem them harmless what it feels like to wear one when you have trauma from suffocation.

Yes I'm having a really bad day.

BogRollBOGOF · 28/10/2020 14:38

I think the average mask as used by a member of the public is of limited use. Dubious quality, fit and methods of use. Lab conditions with a N95 mask, it aint.

I am exempt. I tried, and I'm not willing to put shop staff at increased risk by hyperventilating over them when I've coped with obstructed airways for less than two minutes. I wear a visor, mainly for its effectiveness at deflecting ablist arseholes rather than any belief in its efficacy.

Wearing them outside is of negligable benefit. The benefits of open air movements far, far outweighs the marginal differences of wearing a mask.

The main benefit of masks at a viral control point of view is making life so unpleasant, devoid of clear communication, facial expression and clear speech that they naturally deter people from volunteering to put themselves in the position where they have to wear them for any length of time.

BogRollBOGOF · 28/10/2020 14:42

Mask wearing across Asia is not a default. I travelled the length of China when Swine Flu was about and the occasional person wore a mask in cities with high air pollution like Hong Kong or Beijing, but it is absolutely not default behaviour to generally wear them en-masse.

MadameBlobby · 28/10/2020 14:44

[quote 20mum]@islockdownoveryet Sorry to hear your son has difficulties. I used to work in a brilliant school for special needs children, and campaign and do voluntary work for disabilities of all kinds. As you see in my post, I reported the words of the t.v. doctor, and the added sentence about some, rare, people who genuinely could not wear masks.

Very reasonably, you mention that you do not insist on taking your unmasked DS out and about constantly in close proximity with the public. You have made a couple of exceptions, but I hope you will agree that although your own DS has not, necessarily, got heightened physical risk, other people, of all ages, do.

That g.p. may have been thinking of patients who came into her surgery. She said every one wore a mask and she couldn't think why any would not, but the extra vulnerable would have been under self imposed solitary confinement, rightly scared to go out while public places are filled with aggressive non-mask wearers.

Is permanent solitary confinement for life, for those thousands living alone, a fair price to pay for those who demand a lovely time getting drunk in close proximity with strangers at the club or the pub, or sitting on public transport, or going round shopping centres and supermarkets, and all without wearing a mask? One of these bullies, in a hundred thousand, might have a condition like your son..... but I doubt it, don't you? The asthmatics I know are the most eager to keep covered, because they are vulnerable. They would prefer to have someone else bring their shopping while an attack is near, and only go out in the intervals when breathing through a mask is possible.

Pandemic risk is like climate emergency. It won't all be over soon, or ever. This isn't going away. 2023 was the most optimistic time when W.H.O. had hoped worldwide covid19 could be 'over', but news now confirms there is no such thing as immunity. In fact, having it once is now known to very soon lose any degree of immunity gained, and the second time infections are worse than the first, and more likely to have fatal or permanent effects.

A normal lifestyle of mask wearing has been commonplace, every-day habit for many years, in the Far East, where they have already been accustomed to a permanent lifestyle of being extra careful of repeated major virus attacks. Swine flu, Asian flu, Spanish flu, Ebola, Plague, and more, have swept through communities and spread to other countries, especially with mass migration and encouragement of non essential travel.

None have entirely vanished from the earth, and all can mutate, and entirely new ones can arise at any time on top of the others. Even T.B., which was a major killer eliminated from U.K., has sprung up again. Permanently living in ways to avoid disease spread is the only viable way to re-arrange our lifestyles. That will have to be the normal situation everywhere in the world, in the new reality.

There is straight choice between every vulnerable person (millions) enduring permanent imprisonment in solitary confinement, or, on the other hand, a small belligerent element (not you, I hasten to add) being given the 'free pass' of being able to yell the word "exempt", and, under that fake cover, using their self awarded right to do anything they damwell like, fists clenched, and not care how many other people die as a result .

A ban on bare faces would have deprived your DS of the two exceptional outings you mention, and you are the world expert on how to please him, but isn't it possible you might have found ways he could do something equally enjoyable to him, but away from proximity with strangers, or by staying in familiar surroundings?

A permission for just one person to go bare-faced, on the other hand, has been abused as the open gateway for the worst elements among the hard of thinking, beating up and even stabbing and coughing in the faces of innocent people, even one local spitting in the face of someone's baby, as a punishment for the mum wearing a mask, which offended his opinion there is no such thing as Covid19 .[/quote]
What a load of scaremongering crap

MadameBlobby · 28/10/2020 14:45

I have reported your post 20mum. You have no business writing such unscientific doom laden nonsense as fact.

FrustratoPotato · 28/10/2020 14:48

I'm 1 and 3.
I like this analogy I saw on Facebook.

Masks.  To wear or not to wear
Ritascornershop · 28/10/2020 14:49

@20mum so I’m assuming you’re a bit thick? You think maybe it’s okay to remove a mask when alone on the moors? Maybe? What has happened to people, the level of hysteria and scapegoating is really very worrying.

Just because one gp without seNaw said she can’t think of a reason does not mean she’s right. As all the mask threads show there are plenty of reasons; autism,
deafness, asthma, other lung issues, migraines, other neurological issues, trauma, anxiety. Ffs, how are any of these people, especially if single, meant to get food or go to work?

The human race has survived other viruses without masks, we will survive this one too. Some people will die with Covid, a few will die of Covid. People die, it’s a sad fact of life. This rabid fear of mortality is very peculiar.

MadameBlobby · 28/10/2020 14:51

@DameFanny

That's awful *@20mum* - have you got a link to the baby incident? I know some people who need to hear about that Sad
I have a feeling you’ll be waiting a long time
gjejgej · 28/10/2020 14:55

You're living in a dream world if you believe disposable masks, as worn by the public, have any positive impact at all.

1: They're not worn properly (under the nose etc.)
2: They're constantly being adjusted, which renders them useless at best.
3: I imagine very few people wash their mask every day. A large proportion have probably been using a single DISPOSABLE mask for weeks/months.
4: Masks give people a false sense of security. Social distancing goes out the window because I've got a mask to protect me etc..
5: If anyone can find a correlation between mandatory mask-wearing and a significant reduction in cases/deaths, I'd love to see it.

Boris can jog on if he thinks I'm wearing one of those stupid fucking things.

islockdownoveryet · 28/10/2020 15:32

@DameFanny

That's awful *@20mum* - have you got a link to the baby incident? I know some people who need to hear about that Sad
Do not indulge this person her last post was rambling nonsense. I'm all for people having a opinion and I respect that but good god . Hmm
loulouljh · 28/10/2020 15:37

I avoid as many scenarios as possible where masks are required. I don't think they are making a positive difference...possible having a negative effect though may be making some people feel better.

loulouljh · 28/10/2020 15:40

and who says it has been well proven the masks work? I have seen nothing to that effect!!!

lljkk · 28/10/2020 15:46

Trish Greenhalgh says masks work.
Or even if they don't work, (she argues) we must take all precautions and masks might work so that 'might work' is good enough to decide what to do.

Don't ask me why. I don't run the world.

DameFanny · 28/10/2020 15:53

@loulouljh

and who says it has been well proven the masks work? I have seen nothing to that effect!!!
www.nature.com/articles/d41586-020-02801-8 there's this?
garlictwist · 28/10/2020 15:54

I don't think masks work. If they did cases wouldn't be rising. I wear one just to play along but think it's a total waste of time.

Toddlerteaplease · 28/10/2020 15:55

I'm just hoping surgical masks are enough to stop it spreading. Did a random test at work and it was positive. As I didn't have any symptoms apart from a headache I worked all weekend. My student has it as well. Hope none of the patients I was looking after have caught it.

Ginfordinner · 28/10/2020 16:10

@garlictwist

I don't think masks work. If they did cases wouldn't be rising. I wear one just to play along but think it's a total waste of time.
It can't be proved that cases wouldn't rise more quickly if we didn't wear masks though. How many people would be prepared to be part of the "control" population to test this theory out?

I do believe that wearing a mask reduces the viral load though.

theDudesmummy · 28/10/2020 16:27

I am absolutely strict about my mask, I wear a washable three-layer with a filter insert.A clean mask every single time I go out (I only ever go out to go briefly shopping, apart from outdoor exercise alone, and then I don't wear a mask) and new filter too obviously. Sanitise hands before and after touching mask, and wash in machine at 60 degrees.

It helps me manage my severe anxiety about it all. I also use antiviral spray on my son's school bag the minute he gets home, and quarantine all mail for 48 hours. These are all things I can do wthout any difficulty, so why not? They may make a difference.

LolaSmiles · 28/10/2020 16:38

FrustratoPotato
I agree with you. I saw that too.

Naturally as this this thread and the comments on local Facebook pages shows, your average Joe with limited scientific understanding feels like their gut instinct and reading some stuff on social media gives them superb expertise and a level of scientific insight that the rest of the population lack.

It's hardly surprising that we are where we are when we have an incompetent government and a reasonable number of the population with a huge chip on their shoulders about 'I don't need no experts'.

loulouljh · 28/10/2020 16:47

For every article that you can find supporting masks you can find another against. I do not believe in them at all. Ihave one disposable one which I wear if I absolutely have to. I am certainly no buying another.

My secondary school daughter was demonstrating to me how thy wear masks at school in the corridor. Suffice to say nowhere near their noses or mouths! They are something to be played with...for that reason alone masks do not work!

shamalidacdak · 28/10/2020 16:49

By now anyone not wearing a mask is raising a flag to the world and shouting "hey everyone look at me, I'm the village idiot!"

loulouljh · 28/10/2020 17:02

An idiot? Really??? I don't think so. There are valid exemptions..that I am sure you are aware of...if I see someone without one the first thought is not "idiot".