Vaccine for health care staff

[MiaMarshmallows]

Anyone else very pleased by this?
Reported in the Independent newspaper that all NHS staff will be vaccinated from early December

Clearly there is a vaccine available as they wouldn't be rolling it out to NHS workers in December. Don't know why people are saying one isn't available yet because there must be if it is being said that it will be rolled out in mere weeks.

It’s been clearly stated by the head of the U.K. task force, that only half the population will get the vaccine.

www.google.co.uk/amp/s/news.sky.com/story/amp/coronavirus-vaccine-head-less-than-half-of-the-uk-population-could-get-vaccinated-12090472

The head of the immunisation programme told the Financial Times: "People keep talking about 'time to vaccinate the whole population' but that is misguided.

"There is going to be no vaccination of people under 18.

"It's an adult-only vaccine for people over 50 focusing on health workers and care home workers and the vulnerable."

There are plenty of vaccines very close to ready. Some are already being rolled out to health care workers in other countries (not just China and Russia) under emergency use agreements. The phase III trials finish very soon for several candidates too.

And while the UK might only fund the vaccine for the elderly and vulnerable plus HCPs the vaccine itself is suitable from 18 (and I think Oxford are extending their research into 5year olds+). Although that may mean paying privately and i'm not sure how that would work if it were to be required for travel.

The head of the immunisation programme told the Financial Times: "People keep talking about 'time to vaccinate the whole population' but that is misguided.

She isn’t the head of the immunisation programme. She’s the head of the task force in charge of getting vaccines. Who gets immunised and in what order is for DHSC to decide, and they say they’ll decide it based on what JCVI recommend.

Who knows what’s going on behind the scenes, but Matt Hancock has certainly distanced himself from what Kate Bingham said and said that JCVI recommendations couldn’t even be finalised until JCVI knew what vaccine it was dealing with and how well it worked in who. So at the very least, it has not been ‘clearly stated’ what the UK’s vaccination strategy is going to be.

Assuming it gets approval, of course it’s great news. While life will not be back to ‘normal’ for a while, it will take the pressure off hugely if we have vaccinated just HCW, care workers and nursing home residents,

Then roll out to the rest of the over 65s and vulnerable over 50s. That would make an enormous difference to deaths.

Its the first and most important step to a slow, steady return to life as we knew it.

What about people under 50 who are vulnerable enough to get a free flu jab. Will we be getting it do you think?

The way I understand it is that the vaccine will be rolled out in stages, healthcare staff and care home staff first, then the elderly, then the vulnerable, then the over 50's. I think that all adults will be eligible for vaccination in time, but they will need testing in children to be completed before the could vaccinate them, and considering children are largely asymptomatic or have mild symptoms, the benefits may not be worth it.

We will just have to wait and see, but any government is going to pull out all the stops to try to contain covid once a vaccine is approved.

@Starlight101

What about people under 50 who are vulnerable enough to get a free flu jab. Will we be getting it do you think?

It certainly shouldn't be limited to 50+. Worldwide data and experts including SAGE have noted the risk starts in the 40s, particularly from 45. I linked the minutes of the relevant SAGE meeting yesterday.

Separately everybody is at risk of long-term disability because of Long Covid.

Prioritising order to receive the vaccine is one thing. Denying access is quite another and very wrong. It would be particularly bad if the 45-50 age group were excluded. That leaves them terribly vulnerable. At increased risk but no protection.

Sorry but this fallacy you keep spouting about 45 year olds being at serious risk has to be challenged @SheepandCow.

The true death rate from COVID is very difficult to estimate due to the large number of asymptomatic cases.

But if we look at somewhere like South Korea that has done lots of testing, the fatality rate for a 45 year old would be somewhere around 0.1%. This will depend on health conditions so for a healthy 45 year old it will be even lower- possibly at around 0.05%.

A 45 year old has a 0.03% chance of dying in a year on average. So the risk of a healthy 45 year old not only catching COVID but then going on to die from it is less than the risk of them dying from another cause in an average year.

You'd better have a word with the scientific experts ecosse Tell them that their expertise and experience is rubbish becauuse you know better. I'll repost the link to the relevant SAGE meeting minutes. They refer to the risks from 45.

We are not South Korea. They took effective containment measures. Meaning less chance of catching it in the first place.

assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/921187/S0656_Forty-eighth_SAGE_meeting_on_Covid-19.pdf

@Ginogineli

They don’t even know if it’ll affect those over 70

So it may be pointless as the vast majority at risk are over 70

In which case it won’t go ahead they sad this morning on bbc

Actually the signs are looking good. It's believed that the Oxford vaccine boosts the immune response in the elderly www.independent.co.uk/news/health/coronavirus-vaccine-oxford-university-ready-christmas-latest-update-b1340874.html

@SheepandCow

As I’ve already explained, containment measures do not change the death rate of a virus.

A 0.1% death rate means that a 45 year old who catches the virus has a 0.1% chance of dying. The death rate is still 0.1% whether you have 100 cases or a million cases.

Do you have a link to the figures you'll quoting ecosse?

For the time being I'll trust the expertise and knowledge of the experts like SAGE over you. They noted the risk of serious illness or death increases from 45.

Here @SheepandCow www.statista.com/statistics/1105088/south-korea-coronavirus-mortality-rate-by-age/

Ah right thanks. So from South Korea.
A country that (very sensibly) took effective containment measures. Shame we didn't do the same.

Interesting to see their data. Thanks ecosse. I like getting info from other countries.

But as I’ve said @SheepandCow, the death rate has nothing to do with containment measures.

A 45 year old has a 0.1% chance of death. That does not change whether you have 10 cases or 10 million.

I thought the experts had become more cautious since the original announcement?

I'm afraid, for me, it's a case of believe it when I see it.

I'm also not sure how much of the problem it will solve. What is the likely take up for a brand new vaccine that seems to have been rushed through?

I assume they expect a big take-up?
Otherwise why the need to ration.

Again, the vaccine will not just be for the over 50s. The vaccine tests are being carried out on volunteers age 18-80.
They are hoping to possibly start vaccinating in December, after vaccinating front line staff and the vulnerable it will be rolled out to the general public.
I know this as I've been told it by a Dr involved in the trials.
Vaccinating just one age group would not give the herd immunity needed.

If anybody is interested they need more ppl in the vaccine trials.
Here's a video that discusses results from stage 1/2 of the Oxford vaccine. It's looking good.

m.youtube.com/watch?v=HiLdEaSOJN4

Watching Good Morning they think now that because antibodies last such a short amount of time people will need to be vaccinated everyb6 months.

That's good news @Torvean32
Perhaps it depends on the vaccine? I know someone on the Novovax trial. She says they're testing on ages 18-84.

I wonder whether length of immunity period will vary by vaccine? Some might offer longer periods.

Who exactly is the ‘they’ that was on Good Morning and thinks that? I would be surprised if it was a consensus.