How can you make sure people are isolating??

[Chestergirl39]

I heard on the news this morning that only a really low percentage of people actually self isolate or quarantine when they have been officially told to do so, either by test and trace or after a holiday.

Obviously this could be one factor in the recent increase but what can be done to check people are doing it? Should they be checked up on? Why aren’t people doing it?

Does anyone admit to not doing it, and if so, why not?

There isn’t a way to enforce it.
When Boris originally mooted police checks on those arriving in the UK Cressida Dicks quickly told him that wouldn’t be happening. The police do not have remotely the man power for that.

Again I think people are really over-focusing on quarantining after holidays here - that's a choice; being contacted by test and trace isn't.

hardback but the same thing applies.
There is no method of externally enforcing it and no will for the people to do it voluntarily.

This "really low percentage" is being misrepresented. The 18% and 11% figures refer to self isolation up to August, not now. The figure for the current situation is around 70%.

Also important to recognise that many of those breaking isolation are doing so to get food. Unless you suggest people should buy in two weeks of emergency food (panic buying), then these people will need to leave the house.

www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/coronavirus-self-isolation-uk-rules-symptoms-police-fines-b594240.html

@halcyondays

If you can’t afford the associated costs, then you just don’t go abroad on holiday. Why on earth should the government pay?

We should never have let people go off to other countries and trust them all to quarantine. It’s a complete farce.

Because that's not the only time you need to isolate. It also happens if you're contacted by track and trace, or if someone in your family has symptoms.

People can't afford to keep taking unpaid time off work - and it's totally unrealistic to expect them to.

People should be paid if they need to take time off to isolate yes I agree. Unless it’s because of travel. But the pp was talking about China putting returning travellers in mandatory hotel quarantine and charging them for it. NZ I think the government was paying for hotel quarantine for people returning to the country but were going to stop once people who’d be stuck abroad had got back.

The fines obviously aren’t a deterrent enough so maybe harsher measures that are easy to introduce are needed. Removal of driving licences, criminal record, ban on travel etc. Workplaces who know an employee should be isolating and let them into work should face huge fines.

@IceCreamAndCandyfloss

The fines obviously aren’t a deterrent enough so maybe harsher measures that are easy to introduce are needed. Removal of driving licences, criminal record, ban on travel etc. Workplaces who know an employee should be isolating and let them into work should face huge fines.

Why do people think fines are the answer? The poorest people will just be made even poorer. If you struggle to feed your family as it is, taking two weeks off work with no pay could easily push you over the edge. Adding a fine to that isn't going to help anyone.

If track and trace get in touch, and people have to isolate, then the government should be giving them something to make sure they can still pay their bills and feed their families.

ice the police have said they don’t have the resources to deal with it.
The courts certainly don’t hand the resources to process all these new criminals.

We are on day 2 of my dd having to isolate due to a positive case in her class. We have had tears both days, and tantrums at not being allowed out. And it’s hard to explain to her that we can’t even go for a walk on the empty field where we would meet no one and touch nothing. It seems so unfair to her and I can bet not everyone in her class will be as strict.

I am tempted to put her in the car a couple of times over the next two weeks and drive round with her She will be in contact with no one and a change of scenery would be so beneficial to her mental health. She’s 7.

As a parent it’s up to you to explain why she cannot go out. Some friends of mine are back in China with children of a similar age. They have just finished two weeks hotel quarantine and now have two weeks home isolation. It is tough, but only works if we are all prepared to make small, individual sacrifices.

Personally I think anyone who goes abroad should have to quarantine for 2 weeks - at their own expense. It should be factored into the cost of a holiday. Companies could be set provide a service delivering food and meds etc. You should have to inform the authorities where you will be and checks should be made. If this is not followed the government should look at using hotels or something as quarantine centres- like in China.

I have sympathy for people who are asked to isolate if they’ve been in contact with someone positive and do feel there should be help with wages, bills and shopping. Also with help for relatives they provide care for. However it does then need to be made more official and checks should be made on a few occasions with fines for non-compliance. No one should be out of pocket through no fault of their own.

The problem is, those who are out socialising more often may then have to isolate more often and could then milk the system- I’m not sure how you address that, without penalising those who are being sensible.

Isn't your question the wrong way round? Why are you socialising indoors with these people?
Only meet non-members of your family bubble outdoors, keep your distance and don't prolong contact.

Same at the workplace. Maintain distance in well ventilated areas.

The story is different for schools and we already knew that some parents would send DC in - even if they potentially had it. Lots of MN threads on that already though.

So OP, if someone has returned from abroad and hasn't quarantined, how would I catch it? I'm not socialising with them. 3 mins in front of a supermarket cashier is the most prolonged exposure most of us have with strangers.
If someone caught it in a bar and hasn't quarantined - again how am I or any of my family going to catch it?

We are choosing not to go out to bars, restaurants , public places etc to minimise the risk of contact, but we're going to work on public transport and got 2 DC at school. With the t and t app I dont know whether they can contact you if you've sat near someone infected on a train, and obviously there are risks of school bubbles being broken. That's the potential for many periods of self isolation whether ill or not. I think a lot of people may break the rules for financial reasons. Imagine being on your 4th period of self isolation. How many people IRL could take that much time off work.

Several countries have enforced 14 day quarantines on entry, some being paid for by the traveller - Australia, New Zealand and south africa do. A friend went to SA - they weren't allowed to leave the room, like a pp said, temp taken every day, food delivered to their room. They were allowed additional food, and to be brought stuff from family but that had to be delivered to their room, and they could not see family, and 15 min outside activity supervised by hotel security.

OP, you can't make sure people are isolating. Thank God. I'd go and live abroad if my movements were being tracked and I were being checked up on all the time.

I wouldn't isolate if someone told me to, because the only remaining part of my job involves leaving the house, and as I have no other income thanks to stupid bastarding lockdowns, there's no way I'm not doing it.

I would also not do it because I can't buy into the Covid hysteria when I'm more likely to be run over than die of Covid (as are most of us), and I don't refuse to leave the house just in case I get run over.

@DianaT1969

“Isn't your question the wrong way round? Why are you socialising indoors with these people? “
Only meet non-members of your family bubble outdoors, keep your distance and don't prolong contact.

Same at the workplace. Maintain distance in well ventilated areas.

The story is different for schools and we already knew that some parents would send DC in - even if they potentially had it. Lots of MN threads on that already though.

So OP, if someone has returned from abroad and hasn't quarantined, how would I catch it? I'm not socialising with them. 3 mins in front of a supermarket cashier is the most prolonged exposure most of us have with strangers.
If someone caught it in a bar and hasn't quarantined - again how am I or any of my family going to catch it?”

Sorry I don’t really understand what you’re saying?

It wasn’t me I was speaking about, but a generalised comment about if people who should be isolating / quarantining are actually doing it and who monitors them?

Obviously this could be one cause of the increased spread.

You are lucky you are able to keep away from others. I have not been for a meal or socialised indoors since before lockdown but do have 3 kids in school and work in a hospital so minimising contact is harder for me- which is why I want people to follow the rules!

@Chestergirl39

I heard on the news this morning that only a really low percentage of people actually self isolate or quarantine when they have been officially told to do so, either by test and trace or after a holiday.

Obviously this could be one factor in the recent increase but what can be done to check people are doing it? Should they be checked up on? Why aren’t people doing it?

Does anyone admit to not doing it, and if so, why not?

In NZ ppl coming back go to a set facility thats monitored it seems to be the most successful route as NZ have eradicated Covid again.

Is our only option to use the fact we are an islabd. Nobody in or out except for work.

I am nearing the end of a 14 day isolation from the school I work in, because two students in my form tested positive.
The govt guidance is 10 days isolation but my school won't let me back before 14 days. So technically I can go out this weekend, although I'm not allowed back in work until weds (ie I've done the 10 days iso)

This is incorrect.

It's 10 days isolation for those with symptoms or a positive test, 14 days isolation for contacts.

www.gov.uk/guidance/nhs-test-and-trace-how-it-works#part-2-people-who-have-had-close-contact-with-someone-who-has-coronavirus

@Torvean32

Sounds a sensible approach to me, it doesn’t seem to work like that over here. Considering we’re an island too (albeit more populated) you think it’d be easy to manage but our government prefer to rely on the public to be sensible and to comply through goodwill and that’s why we’re in the mess we’re in! It would probably be seen as infringing our human rights or something if they brought that in over here- even though it’s ok to do in other countries!

[quote ChaChaCha2012]This "really low percentage" is being misrepresented. The 18% and 11% figures refer to self isolation up to August, not now. The figure for the current situation is around 70%.

Also important to recognise that many of those breaking isolation are doing so to get food. Unless you suggest people should buy in two weeks of emergency food (panic buying), then these people will need to leave the house.

www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/coronavirus-self-isolation-uk-rules-symptoms-police-fines-b594240.html[/quote]
I may have misunderstood (not read the actual research) but I don't think the 70% refers to the current situation (August isn't that long ago, and it will have taken them that long to do and analyse the research, surely?). I think that's 70% of people asked that fully intended to isolate properly (but didn't have symptoms and hadn't been contacted by test and trace at the time). The 18/ 11% were the people who actually did when it came down to it. I suppose the 30% who didn't intend to were people who knew they couldn't afford to miss work etc, rather than just stubborn people. However, the 50-60% who intended, but didn't make it seemed to"fail" for relatively small reasons like needing to get shopping or to a medical appointment, so it may be that easily accessible, practical support to provide assistance with those reasons would be helpful, as well as financial support for the 30% who just couldn't afford to.

People failing to quarantine after holidays (when they travelled fully knowing what the rules were on return) I have little sympathy for, frankly! They just need to do it and shouldn't travel if they can't. But now we're moving out of the main holiday season, I think it's residents rather than travellers or returning holidaymakers we really need to encourage/ support to isolate.

Also, it turns out halls of residence are very easy to surround with police to stop people from leaving ! Maybe the students should be tipped out, and all returning travellers should be housed in one of those for a fortnight (not an actual suggestion, for the avoidance of doubt...)