Children and teachers have been thrown under the bus, haven't they?

[ReadTheData]

Can I please urge all of you to write to your MP about this?

The government have had months to prepare and in only the third week of September they have failed already. They have not kept up their end of the bargain for opening schools safely.

Taking two weeks off every time for symptoms is not feasible for children, working parents or teachers, especially in the winter term.

They're deflecting blame to the few that have taken unnecessary tests, but the number of people who would choose to take this horrible test or put their children through it for kicks, a laugh, or whatever, are surely few and far between. And it's a nightmare getting a test anyway! So I don't believe that propaganda for a minute, the government are doing everything they can to wriggle out of it.

I'm sure no parent wants their child to be part of some kind of sick experiment - and I'm sure teachers don't want to be thrown under the bus either. In fact, I wouldn't be surprised if the teachers went on strike over this.

Please stand up and shout about this to anyone who will listen. I want my children to get in education this year and I want children, parents and teachers to stay safe.

How come we fight an invisible virus if we don't even know how many cases there are? The government need to get their shit together instead of lurching from one disasterous decision to the next.

If the guidelines state as a class of 15 we do not shut bubbles but only remove the positive child - then we would have avoided it

But even private schools don’t take this risk

People need to take as step back and look at the actual numbers and statistical risk here. More risk of being killed in a car crash on the way to the school?

I also hope people consider other things like mental health of children, those who are abused being trapped with abusers, disadvantaged children being set back further from not going to school... the average age of death with COVID on the certificate is 82. It’s a balance that involves not just preventing death, but preventing suffering of the young from the lockdown itself.

We do have to think about the adults going to school, cleaners especially but I assume they have better protection?

@millymollyfarmer We have extremely clinically vulnerable teachers and they are teaching in the same conditions as everyone else in school as shielding has ended (for now.) I think once there’s an outbreak in school all the extremely clinically vulnerable staff and students should go straight home and work from there.

I agree with you that we need to have children in school and we need to treat people with medical conditions etc. There is a balance to make between assessing risk of Covid and risk of death / impact on other areas of people’s lives.

If the government got test, track and trace sorted this would help in so many areas of our lives. Without it people will be in and out of work and school.

A disrupted education is on the cards for many this year and it’s not fair to the children, their parents or their teachers.

Last did you see the Scottish guidelines on what would happen if there was a positive case? Say in primary class so all in same room

In my school the adults have the same protection as the children - hand washing and 1 way system in school. That’s it. Cleaners get a plastic apron and gloves.

[quote Bol87]@TheClaws - if you read, people are happy their kids are back, it’s the lack of preparation, tests and contingency people are angry about. Not the re-opening of schools. I don’t know why teachers are ‘terrified’, I certainly don’t know any terrified teachers but I do know they are already fed up & angry at the disruption & lack of support.[/quote]
This

Although as you say two consecutive days would not have changed outcome for first week

It’s the SD and whether state schools would do it less cautiously than private

[quote Cookiecrisps]@millymollyfarmer We have extremely clinically vulnerable teachers and they are teaching in the same conditions as everyone else in school as shielding has ended (for now.) I think once there’s an outbreak in school all the extremely clinically vulnerable staff and students should go straight home and work from there.

I agree with you that we need to have children in school and we need to treat people with medical conditions etc. There is a balance to make between assessing risk of Covid and risk of death / impact on other areas of people’s lives.

If the government got test, track and trace sorted this would help in so many areas of our lives. Without it people will be in and out of work and school.

A disrupted education is on the cards for many this year and it’s not fair to the children, their parents or their teachers.[/quote]
You're not allowed to be a extremely clinically vulnerable teacher though (I am). You're only allowed to be extremely vulnerable when the government tell you that you are. The rest of the time you're entirely disposable

I didn’t, and I can’t be arsed to read it all again

I was really impressed with how well thought out it was though. Although mostly the detail was done by the council.

We have a year group self isolating atm due to a number of positive cases in their year group. My form today were telling me many of the self isolating year group are hanging out at parks and houses in groups all day, posting videos on social media. So, thats great

Fair enough

If the state guidelines said with SD only positive child had to isolate them maybe...

But I reckon state teachers might be annoyed that private get to send everyone home (or maybe not)

But I still don’t advocate for exam years

@noblegiraffe

How many child deaths have there been? Surely that should be the primary concern?

Are you ignoring all the adults who work in schools? You are, aren't you?

Sadly, I don’t think many think about the risks to the school staff, they just want their wants. Even worse they know the risks and expect staff to take them.

walksen Thanks for the link to the junior doctors thread, although it would be easier if he wrote it in a blog or did a video! there’s interesting comments underneath too. I will weigh his comments against Heneghan’s, although favour the latter and his understanding of evidence for obvious reasons.

@OpheliasCrayon I think it’s terrible how these children and staff are being treated. I feel for anyone like this who is working in an environment with little protection (no masks / visors or SD) whether that’s in a school, factory or other workplace.

Most people don’t need that level of protection. I get the frustrations with the vulnerable though. They should be paid and protected, at home.

@PenguinIce within my local area I know of 4 schools with positive cases including my own which has a year 1 bubble completely closed and us teaching remotely from day 4. I’d love to know where the government are getting their stats from as Public Heath England are the ones advising on the closures (including ours) so must have some record.

[quote Cookiecrisps]@OpheliasCrayon I think it’s terrible how these children and staff are being treated. I feel for anyone like this who is working in an environment with little protection (no masks / visors or SD) whether that’s in a school, factory or other workplace.[/quote]
I have masks and visors but they're for the childrens benefit not mine. I'm still going to catch everything going. But school and my job has been risky for me well before covid - I have multiple chronic illnesses so parents deciding to send their kids into school before the 48 hours after D&V is up because "they seem fine and only threw up once" ...can land me in hospital if I catch it....so... Covid and risk is nothing new to me really. I just accept it and move on. I love my job so...it is what it is. Sadly though I think that's why teachers, drs, nurses etc etc get taken advantage in many ways...covid...pay...hours...etc...because we do it as a vocation so because we want to do it ...the gvmt constantly take the piss....

I an has a rebuttal video on that too. I don't have time to look into all the details but I did find it is interesting how both are selective about tests Vs cases.

Ivan claims increases are due to tests and in his rebuttal shows tests increasing from 50k to 200k then says there is your trend data etc whereas the junior doctor focusses on changes from August to sept where the increase in tests is small but increases in cases much larger.

On the data thread here it was clear that case increases in July and early August were explained by increased testing and the test positivity rate was pretty static. Chris wittys graphs on the last briefing showed that the increase in cases is real.

The upshot of this is that commentators on the internet can be very selective about the data they show. I'm less inclined to trust Ivan's video because it is obvious to most people by now that cases rising is no longer due to more and more testing and Ivan's rebuttal video seems to deny or minimise this.

Links to dispassionate analysts without some kind of agenda would be useful.

I'm presuming everybody who is suggesting blended learning can work from home, isn't working or has the time to teach their child.
Whereas in the real world, many families have both parents working, many in roles that cannot be done from home or their employers will not accept it any longer.
I can't see many employers agreeing to their employees having every other week off school.

"I can't see many employers agreeing to their employees having every other week off school"

Hopefully they will be understanding about repeated periods of self isolation due to repeated instances of positive tests in a bubble and a number of incidences of being off for a few days with coughs and temperatures and waiting for a test....

Links to dispassionate analysts without some kind of agenda would be useful That doesn’t exist unfortunately. The epidemiologists advising govt have to carry on the same path. What a horrible job. If you say, oh realistically we are looking at 40-60,000 deaths, not much more than usual, they won’t get anyone’s attention and if they’re wrong it’s actual lives lost. If they’re wrong about the high numbers predicted without LD, then it’s still bad because of the cost in all sorts of ways of LD. Imagine the stress involved with being on SAGE or even part of the team on studies which govt make decisions on. I also, perhaps I’m on my own, feel sympathy for ministers and everyone behind them, policy writers lawyers etc as these are huge decisions and problems to deal with. My Mum is PA to someone high up in NZ govt, they’ve been non stop and are all exhausted.

Covid. Coming to a school near you.

I can't believe they are encouraging parents to leave children with symptoms in school until their they can get a test result. How long will the tests take? By the time they come back the virus will be growing exponentially.

I'm hoping I have got this wrong, but that is how it's coming across.

@walksen that wouldn't be as often as every other week now would it?
And thankfully my children's school is being very sensible about colds and saying children can still attend as long as they don't have temps, loss of taste or the continuing cough. Obviously if they are well enough to do so.

Well put op!
Testing was supposed to be the back up and now there is no back up and once again, like back in march when our designated health specialists told us tracing etc and testing wasn't necessary, no evidence for it....

We are back to WHO.... Fighting this virus blindfolded with no tests.

Super parents should never have to go back to teaching their dc again.
Teachers should be teaching them over the Internet.
Employers that can should help their staff. Most have.
Those that can't can't and again special resources should be in place.
I wouldn't ideally leave my 13 year old every day.. But if she was being taught in line, monitor on line etc it would be OK for short term.