The schools are open! Except to all the kids self isolating...

[DonLewis]

I keep reading about closing the schools is the last point on the plan for closing things down in the event of another lockdown.

Great.

But, both of my kids schools are open but they both have whole year groups self isolating. And each week they're open another year group bubble gets burst and another 200 kids are at home self isolating.

But the government get to say the schools are open. It's really getting my goat. My kids have had less than a week at school between them! And I can't see things improving. It's not the schools fault. Why can't we do something different? Close the schools for 2 weeks. Kind of force a 2 week self isolation for all school kids. In those 2 weeks schools get to focus on their online provision. Then, reopen the schools and if bubbles get burst, the teachers have had a head start on planning.

Not sure what I'm posting for. I'm just feeling quite fed up about it all.

@SimpleComforts

Where are you getting this information from? The guidance to secondary schools has been for children to remain in bubbles by year group. Children within the year group bubble are not required or able to SD. They will come into close contact with different students in each lesson, during break times, lunch etc. There is no way for any school to know all of the other students in which any particular student has been in contact with within the bubble, and they aren't required to. It has always been the plan to close bubbles as cases are identified and it has always been the plan for secondary bubbles to be organised by year group. Why are people surprised by this? The hope seemed to be that it wouldn't spread in schools bc children are less susceptible to COVID but obviously this is not the case.

@Barbie222 aren't most european schools all back as well
We have tech etc but my yr 11 son no sen needs to learn in school
Ideally and we have to try, if we have to go back to home learning then so be it
How would teachers cope with having some on school and some home with blended learning as in some areas it could be half class in who don't have access to pc or parents are keyworker and other half at home , the teacher then teaching both lots

@bigvig totally not happening in the colleges here my son is at one and niece is at the other
There bubbles are the classes obviously some my have a slightly bigger bubble if doing 2 a levels as opposed to my son who is doing a btech so his bubble is 27 or if they catch a bus in from a village etc but no one here will have a bubble of 500
They aren't allowed lunch in canteen or breaks only in classroom or go home
He goes into college for 2 days and has teams class on other day and one independant learning day although ,he is doing sports which requires practical this is on hold at the moment

Masks have to be worn going around the campus and they have staff members checking at entrance , all in masks as well
In fact i think its extremely well run and my niece at another college is being run exactly the same

If his and my Neice college can do this i can't see why others can't

I actually think people shouldn't just assume children with SEN fair less well with remote learning. It entirely depends on what their SEN is. Some have found they prefer it. No hustle and bustle from the classroom environment and they can build up their own little routine with it.

I have no qualms above us schools being open until the figures reach a level where a large proportion of pupils have to be absent and socially isolate frequently. Then it makes more sense to switch over to remote learning as the quality of life will be worse for everyone having to frequently isolate than learning remotely but being able to leave the house within the restrictions.

What I want is high quality learning from home - or from specially set up computer centres in libraries etc. I can't take the anxiety of 2 children at 2 different schools where the threat of isolation is constant. And school is awful for them at the moment - all the good bits - clubs, trips etc etc - not happening. Not even proper playground fun. Dreadful and now they are getting really really depressed. They were happy under lockdown.

I guess the upside of isolating a whole year group is that you can do online lessons for them.

If you have some kids in and some kids at home, the ones at home lose out (I am assuming that teachers' unions would never agree to livestream or record lessons so those at home could keep up).

Throughout the summer, teachers warned of this.

Many were abused and bullied for not having a 'can do' attitude.

Some kept posting regardless, because they thought it was important.

Now parents are realising that those teachers were right....

Huge bubbles are inevitable for KS4 and KS5, because of students doing different combinations of GCSE and A-level subjects. 6th form colleges have particularly large bubbles, for obvious reasons.

Whether it's 200 isolating or 2 I think the constant disruption to the school work is almost intolerable.
My daughter's school has staggered starts and finishes which writes off 40 minutes of the day on each side.
Table bubbles will burst if there is a case so not the whole year but that plus testing waits and self isolation it must be like juggling cats for teachers to manage the learning.

It's all completely pointless. This is lockdown by a different name.

In our school, the colds started spreading immediately. Cue, one week in, lots of kids with runny noses and, yes, coughs. So what to do? Keep kids off, keep siblings at home? Except, keeping them at home with the common cold is excluding them from work. There is no online work for them at all. It's a complete shambles.

The teachers couldn't admit they can't accept kids and prevent the spread of the disease. The government said they could keep schools open and keep the disease under control. No one is being reasonable here. COVID will spread if people leave their homes. Inevitable. Let's just live with it and keep vulnerable groups shielded. It's the only way forward or we simply accept indefinite lockdown by another name.

The teachers couldn't admit they can't accept kids and prevent the spread of the disease.

Er, this is exactly what all teachers and unions were saying since June. However, nobody wanted to hear that, or find any money to make school opening safer. It's the ultimate twist in the narrative to say that it's now the schools' fault!

The teachers kept telling us they wanted more PPE. Teachers told us they wanted to be covid safe, when the reality ANY school opening cannot be 100% covid safe. They said if it wasn't covid safe they didn't want to go back to the classrooms. That is the reality check, isn't it? That nothing can stop colds spreading, other than sitting at home. Kids get covid and spread it, and they are fine. Any vulnerable teachers should be sent home indefinitely. All the others should go back, business as usual. (PS I know I'm being controversial here and my words may upset plenty of teachers, but it is truly my opinion that we should continue life as before)

So who covers the teachers who have gone home @AllWashedOut? What about vulnerable pupils? What about vulnerable parents?

@ineedaholidaynow All vulnerable self-isolate and let the rest of us continue as usual. Sounds harsh - it IS harsh, but why don't you suggest an alternative? You can't because there isn't one, unless we pile billions of pounds into purchasing hazmat suits for everyone.

Not so much controversial as badly thought through, @AllWashedOut . We're all open without PPE and with no additional funds for cleaning or extra staff. That's what you're asking for, no? And yet we seem to be having problems containing the spread? What a surprise!

Barbie, there is no problem with the spread. It's the deaths and morbidity that counts, and those are super low. More people are dying of the flu at this moment in time. Schools have not succeeded in getting PPE funds, but they can send kids home for having the common cold, effectively closing down whole year groups. As they also won't run online lessons, the kids get no education. And the parents are forced to stay home and babysit = economy tanks.

@AllWashedOut but you haven't answered my question, what happens with vulnerable pupils who can't got to school, who covers the teachers who can't go to school?

The vulnerable children SI. There are plenty of cover staff about. My friend works for a local agency, she's very good but most of the year she doesn't have work. She says there are plenty of teachers like her prepared to step into schools. They might not all be great teachers with extensive experience, and some areas will have access to a deeper supply pool than others, but how many vulnerable teachers do you think there are? Sometimes I think people guess the vulnerable class must comprise 1/3 of the UK population or some such! If it were 1% I'd be surprised.

There are plenty of supply teachers, but schools don't have the funding to pay for them

@allineedaholidaynow Now over to you to answer my question: what is the alternative?

@allineedaholidaynow Easy. Government picks up the bill. THIS is what the unions should have been fighting for, instead they were faffing about PPE

@AllWashedOut you don't think unions and schools have been asking for more funding?

All washed out- schools/bubbles don't close for symptoms. Only that child goes home. Bubbles only close following a positive case in the class/bubble, and only if PHE says so.

THIS is what the unions should have been fighting for, instead they were faffing about PPE

Does asking for funding to meet expectations constitute faffing? Yes, surprise surprise, cleaning supplies, face visors and masks cost money. You're going around in circles now.

I think there just becomes a point where lockdown and remote learning is preferable to repeated self isolation (where that is happening). At least (at one point) during lockdown people could go out to exercise, socialise socially distanced outside and see single people within a bubble. And the teachers can then focus on remote learning. Repeated isolations is really a much worse quality of life compared to the lockdown we had.