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See all MNHQ comments on this thread

The government is trying to make you think schools will be socially distanced

999 replies

noblegiraffe · 28/08/2020 08:58

The government are currently running a (well publicised) propaganda campaign to say that schools are safe. They are using social media influencers, journalists and friendly scientists (firmly ignoring any unfriendly ones like the Royal Society). Branwen Jefferys of the BBC tweeted “So how high is government anxiety about school return? A PR company acting on behalf of the Cabinet office is now emailing media offering experts to support the “messaging”. Strange way to approach news journalists ..”

And just about every news outlet running stories about schools seems to be rotating stock footage of half empty classrooms with teachers miles away from the kids. There have even been photos of kids getting temperature checks (not allowed). I was watching Sky news where a commentator was saying how awful it was that kids would be sent back to socially distanced schools. The PM gave a rambling speech to carefully spaced kids in a library. And in a visit to a classroom it’s clear that the kids were all shoved down one end in order to give some lovely spaced kids at the other end for the PM to pose in front of.
metro.co.uk/2020/08/27/boris-johnson-staged-school-visit-social-distancing-13188600/

Matt Hancock was on the news saying it was really important for teachers to stay 2m from the kids to avoid spreading the virus between all the bubbles they’ll be working in, despite knowing that this will be utterly and hopelessly impossible.

Why are the government lying? Why are they sending the ‘right’ experts to the press? Why are kids being spread out for staged photo shoots instead of honest pictures?

And why are the press largely going along with it?

Schools are going back, in a lot of cases to an estate that is unfit for purpose. Old buildings, no ventilation, large class sizes. Pupils will be crammed in facing a teacher who won’t be able to stand 2m from them. If it’s so safe, why aren’t they showing and acknowledging the reality?

YABU: what they are doing is fine and there are perfectly reasonable explanations for all the suggestions of socially distanced classrooms and schools in the media

YANBU: the lying liars are lying to us again

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Kaktus · 29/08/2020 09:53

Publishing guidance then changing it 2 hours later is incompetence. I am private sector (work for a large bank) and if I sent something out that I then withdrew/altered 2 hours later my boss wouldn’t be too impressed.

MarshaBradyo · 29/08/2020 09:55

I don’t have very low standards I think people will pit against each other though and imagine the worst.

It happens on here with parents / teachers etc

MarshaBradyo · 29/08/2020 09:57

I mean I know people have to let out their frustrations, better here than Twitter or irl I guess.

ineedaholidaynow · 29/08/2020 10:01

And if you did get it wrong you would acknowledge and apologise. Also if you change reports etc, you normally highlight the changes not expect people to plough through numerous pages to see if they can spot something different

SmileEachDay · 29/08/2020 10:03

Marsha

You seem unwilling to accept the experience of teachers - I don’t know if you saw noble’s thread that listed all the ways the government have got it utterly wrong on their approach to education during covid.

Whose fault do you think the exam fiasco was? The confusion before the summer re which kids could go in? The masks in schools confusion?

Who should be held accountable?

MarshaBradyo · 29/08/2020 10:12

Smile I didn’t read that thread I admit I’m up to the limit with posts about what we’ve done wrong though. There’s another one about what we’ve done right which I found refreshing - the U.K. has done a fair bit right. I won’t list it, but the thread will be somewhere. My main issue with education in particular was excluding so many school children for so long and 25% for yr10 and 12 which was far too low.

Scotland and NI had to about turn on exams too didn’t they? In a devolved setting DfE wasn’t the only one. Yes I thought it outrageous to see state disadvantaged, so explicitly, but it was changed tg. This actually makes me more wary of part time. It will be a divergence between the two sectors and harder to unpick as not so explicit.

Masks honestly as long as it’s not causing infection spread, fine. The school has responded quickly with its decision, it hasn’t been onerous.

I know if you’re impacted as a teacher you will know all the detail. But right now finally someone (Whitty) is talking about impact on children.

noblegiraffe · 29/08/2020 10:12

Smile I just updated that list on another thread!

  1. Chaotic school closures and keyworker provision (couldn’t decide what a keyworker was until the very last minute)

  2. Forgot that kids on free school meals would go hungry so heads had to go round delivering sandwiches while the DfE put together an utterly shambolic voucher system that crashed and was pretty unusable.

  3. Issued no guidelines for minimum education requirements during lockdown leading to vastly different provision between schools. Even Ofsted said they couldn’t judge schools on lockdown provision as there were no standards to judge them against.

  4. Claimed responsibility for setting up an online school that had actually been set-up by teachers, merely because they chucked some money their way. Forgot to tell schools about the online school so many had no idea that it existed. Forgot to advertise it to parents even though it was exactly the sort of thing many parents were asking for.

  5. Had to be shamed into u-turning on their insistence that free school meal children should go hungry during the holidays by a celebrity footballer (well done Marcus Rashford you absolute star)

  6. Said that they would provide free laptops to disadvantaged kids so that they could access schoolwork, then only provided a tiny proportion of the laptops required because they incorrectly assumed that each school already had 280(!) laptops of their own. The woefully inadequate amount of laptops provided didn’t arrive until the end of the summer term rendering them pointless.

  7. Fed stories to friendly newspapers about schools re-opening in May to judge public reaction, leading to anxiety and uncertainty among parents and school staff

  8. Announced that primaries would reopen to 3 year groups only, as getting parents of those year groups back to work was more important than the education, mental health and wellbeing of the other 4 year groups. Announced that Y10 and 12 would have ‘some face to face support’ without clarifying what that meant

  9. Took ages to release the guidance for reopening pushing back Y10 and Y12 opening.

  10. Released guidance at the last minute meant that carefully laid plans by schools had to be scrapped and restarted. Guidance was repeatedly updated but with full versions released each time and no tracking of changes so time was wasted trying to find out what was new.

  11. Announced that primary schools would open to all pupils before the summer holidays, an announcement that had surely not been run past anyone who worked in schools given that under the government’s own guidelines for schools for bubbles of 15 and no rotas, this would require double the classrooms and double the teachers available. Then backtracked on this a few weeks later (getting the friendly press to blame the unions) again creating uncertainty, anxiety and disappointment for parents and pupils.

  12. Neglected responsibility towards children with SEN and disabilities, EHCPs weren’t to be followed, update/transition meetings were cancelled and parents were left without respite.

  13. Issued guidance for childcare settings very late and only for some types of provider

  14. As lockdown eased, completely forgot about re-opening baby groups for new mothers so guidance wasn’t issued and they had to stay closed

  15. Promised massive funding for a GREAT SUMMER CATCH-UP which hasn’t happened. Now pencilled in for November, but they don’t appear to be organising it.

  16. Promised an army of retired teachers to tutor kids as part of the GREAT SUMMER CATCH-UP now downgraded to recent graduates hired through govt approved agencies, with schools having to pay 25% of the costs.

  17. Ignored education select committee questions about Ofqual’s algorithm when they raised issues in July

  18. Lied and said they didn’t have early access to the data from Ofqual’s algorithm

  19. When Scotland u-turned on their use of an algorithm, instead of making a considered response, came out with the bizarre notion that kids could use their mock grades - a suggestion that had obviously never been put past anyone who worked in schools. Again.

  20. Took 5 days to realise that their mock suggestion created more problems than it solved, then u-turned on awarding CAGs creating problems for Y12 next year. Many students who now qualified for their university places had lost them due to the delay

  21. Delayed Level 2 BTEC results the day before they were due to be released

  22. Fed stories to the friendly press that the unions are blocking the re-opening of schools in September so if it goes tits-up, they can blame them again (unions are asking for a ‘plan B’ in the case of local lockdowns, and for working conditions comparable to those of all other workers, no strike action has been proposed or balloted for so they couldn’t block re-opening even if they wanted to)

  23. Blamed Ofqual for the algorithm they were told to create (prioritising statistics over teacher assessment)

  24. Branded a teacher payrise that was agreed back in January a ‘reward for work during lockdown’, knowing this was incorrect, and deliberately fuelling outrage that they themselves had caused by having no minimum requirements for education in lockdown leading to vastly different provision.

  25. Not funding this payrise so teachers probably won’t get it as otherwise it will lead to redundancies for other staff members due to having to fund it from already dire staffing budgets.

  26. Issued guidelines that said that schools should reopen with increased cleaning schedules, increased handwashing, hand sanitising but providing no extra funding for this.

  27. Instructed heads not to take any measures that would improve safety but would require more space (e.g. use of village halls) or not have pupils in full time (rotas, staggered timetables).

  28. Didn’t realise that kids wouldn’t be able to get to school on public transport under current social distancing requirements as there aren’t enough buses until three weeks before schools reopened, and decided to throw £40 million to LAs to sort this (what? buy more buses?) so that they could blame the LAs when it inevitably goes wrong and kids can’t get to school. Withdrew free bus travel for kids in London.

  29. Reintroduced fines for not sending your kids to school, even if your kid is clinically vulnerable and knowing that schools aren’t Covid-secure.

  30. releasing important information about schools and education in an ad-hoc way via comments dropped into speeches (leaving everyone waiting for the detail), press releases in the middle of the night, and worst, and most damaging of all to public confidence - via leaks to the press (including, memorably, one about schools reopening guidance to the Huffington Post ) leading to endless speculation about whether this leak is a correct policy or merely a flag-flying exercise.

  31. rejected an offer of free help from the Royal Statistical Society with composing the ultimately doomed algorithm by insisting on a 5 year non-disclosure agreement that goes against the principles of the RSS. Given that the technical details of the algorithm have been released in excruciating detail, one wonders what exactly the government needed to be sure wouldn’t reach public ears before the next election.

  32. Gavin Williamson’s priority, after u-turning on A-levels and GCSEs, was not to hand in his resignation, as would previously have been expected when being responsible for such chaos, it was to organise a photo shoot.
    Posing with a whip, he not only didn’t resign, but he implied a threat to Boris Johnson if Johnson tried to sack him: I used to be Chief Whip, I know your secrets.

  33. are pre-blaming teachers for any outbreaks in schools by saying that teachers need to be extra vigilant with safety outside of school (what does that even mean? No illegal raves, or no trips to Asda?).

  34. Releasing the Plan B for schools in the event of local lockdowns that had been asked for by headteachers and the unions for months (see point 22)), late on the Friday evening with no working days to implement them before schools go back (for most schools) and after schools have gone back in Leicestershire. The Plan B will require massive amounts of work to organise.

  35. Updating the schools re-opening guidance merely hours after it was published on the Friday evening before schools went back, removing a paragraph about bubbles being sent home in the event of a positive test. This crucial paragraph had already caused massive discussion and stress for teachers and parents in the hours it was up.

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SmileEachDay · 29/08/2020 10:17

I know if you’re impacted as a teacher you will know all the detail. But right now finally someone (Whitty) is talking about impact on children

How dare you. The implication that I - and other teachers - aren’t talking and thinking about the impact on children is massively insulting.

latticechaos · 29/08/2020 10:22

I posted on the thread about things the UK had done right. But objectively the list of things done badly is very long, and sadly stretches back to failure to prepare for a pandemic in the first place, and chronic underfunding of public health, health, education and welfare. This crisis has shown which countries are structured to care for citizens and which are not.

I am not at all happy or accepting of the deaths, the fact many services had to stop and the failure to prepare for how to get our of lockdown.

I think British people deserve much, much better. Certainly my children deserve better than this chaotic school oversight.

MarshaBradyo · 29/08/2020 10:22

Hmm it wasn’t meant to be insulting. I didn’t say you weren’t thinking about them. I said it was the first government message explicitly on children being better off in school than out that I appreciated. It’s not a comment on how teachers feel.

Up until that point government messaging had mostly been about how great it was 1 million (iirc) were back. Which was no help to the years that weren’t.

SmileEachDay · 29/08/2020 10:28

Perhaps I misinterpreted what you wrote, Marsha.

Teachers not giving a shit about the children is a well worn trope on here.

MarshaBradyo · 29/08/2020 10:30

Fair enough. I definitely didn’t mean that. I was just thinking of government messaging when I was writing.

noblegiraffe · 29/08/2020 10:32

Any comment on my list, Marsha as it's the first time you've seen it and you were full of sympathy for the DfE?

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MarshaBradyo · 29/08/2020 10:40

A quick look and yes looks like a bureaucratic nightmare. Hard to deal with if you are in the mire with it.

But it also makes me glad that government direction is school back now. Because every detail and every change will at least be working towards that. I couldn’t imagine how much worse it would be if there wasn’t direction.

latticechaos · 29/08/2020 10:42

@MarshaBradyo Grin you're the most glass half full poster on here! I wonder if you are Mrs Gavin Williamson?

SmileEachDay · 29/08/2020 10:43

A quick look and yes looks like a bureaucratic nightmare

What does this mean?

EducatingArti · 29/08/2020 10:46

@latticechaos

People who didn't want closures would have been better pushing for part time in half classes, so the virus couldn't spread in the first place. I've been boring on about this on every thread!

I have older kids and this guidance will potentially cause closures not prevent them imo as it will drive transmission.

This! Totally agree!
MarshaBradyo · 29/08/2020 10:46

Ha Grin made me laugh Lattice no I’m not, poor old Gav though

I was just thinking the way I cope with all this is to not do detail but look at big picture. It’s related to my old work. Plus I find scientific info calming. I’ve found lockdown a strain but chatting about broad stuff on here has helped (unless people have a go then I get annoyed).

I know it’s harder as a teacher as you have a train load of detail coming at you.

Kaktus · 29/08/2020 10:49

@ineedaholidaynow

And if you did get it wrong you would acknowledge and apologise. Also if you change reports etc, you normally highlight the changes not expect people to plough through numerous pages to see if they can spot something different
Yes. We are selling ourselves short by expecting so little from our Government. It wouldn’t be tolerated in the private sector, such incompetence would be swiftly ‘managed out’, so why do we accept it from the supposed experts? I want my children back in school (they are back, and they went back in June). My children’s school is excellent... they have thrown everything at getting our children back in as safely as possible. I realise that children are extremely low risk, but it’s not only their safety that needs to be considered. I hate the thought that our headmistress and school staff dealing with such incompetent direction from above, making their jobs a million time more difficult in what is already an exceedingly difficult situation. I want to see evidence based direction from the government for getting and keeping children in school, with risk assessments. I don’t want this current shit show.
latticechaos · 29/08/2020 10:50

@MarshaBradyo

I am not a teacher myself, and very glad about that right now, I am livid at how they get scapegoated.

My children have had a couple of total muppet teachers and I complained about them heartlessly, but nearly all their teachers have been great.

I am glad for you that you are not Mrs GW, as of course he is a cheater. Although you would have lovely fireplaces I'm sure.

noblegiraffe · 29/08/2020 10:51

I know it’s harder as a teacher as you have a train load of detail coming at you.

And what about the hate? We've had a metric fuckton of that, a lot of it the fault of the government, and quite a bit of it (the union bashing and the lazy teacher school-blocking narrative) directly orchestrated by them.

Do you have any appreciation for the effect that that has had on teachers throughout this? I mean, I had to take a month off posting here because I literally couldn't take it any more. I was a total wreck.

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HipTightOnions · 29/08/2020 10:53

I know it’s harder as a teacher as you have a train load of detail coming at you.

Many of us can manage perfectly very well. The problem is not the quantity, it’s the gaps and inconsistency and contradictions.

GailWeathers9 · 29/08/2020 10:55

@Piggywaspushed

Do we think someone at the DfE reads Twitter to see what teachers think, rather than asking them beforehand? Then goes 'oh shit, bugger, wank' and changes the guidance?
Probably

www.theguardian.com/world/2020/aug/10/government-paid-vote-leave-ai-firm-to-analyse-uk-citizens-tweets

SaltyAndFresh · 29/08/2020 10:57

Do you have any appreciation for the effect that that has had on teachers throughout this? I mean, I had to take a month off posting here because I literally couldn't take it any more. I was a total wreck.

Me too @noblegiraffe. I tried to discuss it with MNHQ. They did nothing.

Kaktus · 29/08/2020 10:59

And one of the most disgusting things is the pitting people against each other... teachers and parents in particular.
The teacher bashing on her has been absolutely shameful. Equally some of the comments about parents are awful... ‘parents will send kids in dosed up on calpol so they can spend their day watching daytime TV’ etc. In real life the parents I know will try their absolute best to ensure that they follow the rules given, while contending with lack of wrap around care/going back into the office themselves etc.
It’s hard for everyone. And what we need is clear, evidence based direction from those whose job it is to give it. And if we don’t get that, then they need to be held to account.

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