Why aren’t we talking about universities?

[Redolent]

Not the teaching bit, which I’m sure will be managed somewhat well, but the bringing together of young people - freshers’ week and beyond - in what is normally an excess of socializing, partying,?alcohol and sex. I rarely see this being mentioned alongside schools even though it coincides with opening.

Backtracking has already happened in the US, eg UNC reversing its plan to hold in-person classes after only a week. 835 positive tests so far.

indyweek.com/news/orange/unc-carolina-inn-covid-19/

I work with a lot of Uni students (although I'm not employed in or by a university) and they were, IMO, hit hard by this. For most of them, uni ground to a halt very abruptly and in most cases, they returned to family homes. For many that was fine - although probably it felt like a "step backwards" and was frustrating. But for others, it will have been very difficult and possibly damaging.

Ultimately, as a student, you're probably not going to want to "bubble" with a flat load of people who you've never met before and may have nothing in common with. A lot of provision is moving online, but it is not the greatest option (especially given the level of technical ineptitude demonstrated by a lot of uni profs...) and I imagine there will be a push to return to f2f provision. Many students want/need to get a part-time job, which will of course necessitate further f2f contact anyway. And so on...

I'm not meaning to say that it isn't important to SD and avoid the spread of the virus - of course it is. But the mental wellness of teenagers and young people is also important... and it would be good not to overlook that.

DS2 heading back to his university "city" fairly soon.

It seems that the potential student impact may well vary dependent on the local population size - both students and residents. Looking at the latter there are a number of towns and cities, population less than 200,000, with significant university presence. So the likes of :

Lincoln (pop 99,000, most recent 7 days cases per 100,000 9.1)
Cambridge (pop 125,000 - 2.4)
Winchester (pop 125,000 6.4)
Newcastle-under-Lyme (pop 129,000 - 17.0 -; home to Keele I think??)
Exeter (pop 131,000 - 6.8)
Norwich (pop 140,000 - 2.1)
Guildford (pop 149,00 - 12.7 - Surrey Uni)
Oxford (pop 152,000 - 26.2)
Reading (pop 162,000 - 10.5)
Canterbury (pop 165.000; 4.2 - Kent uni)
Charnwood (pop 186,000 - 8.1 ; Loughboro Uni, but Charnwood is the lowest level council area)
Bath & NE Somerset (pop 193,000; 14.5)
Colchester (pop 195,000 - 2.0; Essex Uni)

Somewhere like Durham is not included as it sits in a larger unitary area; however Durham city has a far smaller population again c. 60,000?

Ideally of course a balance of population and student numbers would be looked at; but hopefully an interesting starter for ten

Just asking people to think about the impact of half a million people moving from one part of the country to another in a very short timeframe. Some into a lockdown area. Some out of a lockdown area. Some from one lockdown area to another.

Yes - we are in the midst of this in the US, and it is a scary time.

It seems that the sensible universities are testing students immediately upon arrival, so they're minimising spread that way.

But the potential for spread caused by unrestrained socialising is huge, and universities need to think hard about how they will manage that. It's not OK to just shrug and say 'Well that's what students will do.'

DD's university has set aside hundreds of rooms for students who test positive to isolate in, and they're implementing very very strict rules about gatherings.

I was wondering the other day what happened to students who had nowhere else to go and no family to turn to. Previously LAC for example. If given very short notice to leave their accommodation, what provision was there for them?

I think a lot of towns that are quite small but have multiple universities will likely see an increase in cases. Canterbury for example has 2 universities (Kent and Christchurch). Its unrealistic to expect that tens of thousands of students will not increase the number of cases.

@unmarkedbythat

I was wondering the other day what happened to students who had nowhere else to go and no family to turn to. Previously LAC for example. If given very short notice to leave their accommodation, what provision was there for them?

Universities gave them accommodation. Same with overseas students who were unable to return home.

@HerstoryInTheMaking

I think a lot of towns that are quite small but have multiple universities will likely see an increase in cases. Canterbury for example has 2 universities (Kent and Christchurch). Its unrealistic to expect that tens of thousands of students will not increase the number of cases.

Canterbury's a good example: population 50,000. Students add a further 50,000! Great for the economy though....

What they can't of course manage is what those students do in the evenings. Sit in their room/bubble every night? Or wander around the local area - parks, pubs, restaurants etc.

Even if those students were at home with their parents, they would still be going to parks, pubs and restaurants.

There are some cities like Canterbury mentioned above where students massively increase the population, but a lot of cities will have some young people arriving to study there and other young people leaving to study elsewhere.

Does it really make a difference if an 18 year old is in the Wetherspoons down the road from her parents' house in Manchester, or the Wetherspoons down the road from her uni house in Leeds?

Agree sepie - prob will be more monitored at uni than at home! And at last they will have something to do after this weird year.

The uni I work at is asking all students to sign a covid behaviour charter to ensure students are aware of appropriate Covid safety measures, and deliberate or repeated breaches will be subject to disciplinary measures. Not perfect, but trying to keep student life safe.

@siepie

It makes a difference because for freshers week as 18 year olds will be moving across the whole country. Spreading local outbreaks. Halfway through term maybe not so much.

DD's university is imposing a 14-day quarantine for all students immediately after arrival, to minimise the spread of Covid from one region to another.

This is on top of Covid testing before they travel, Covid testing upon arrival, and weekly Covid testing on an ongoing basis.

Once they've all quarantined for 14 days then the rules on socialising will still be fairly tight. But at that point they'll be allowed to leave their flats/halls/wherever and mix with others while wearing masks.

Her pre-travel Covid test arrived today so she's about to do it and FedEx it back.

Student age people have been moving about during the summer holidays - city to coast a few times here. Seems less risky to me being on a tested and managed campus

Not the teaching bit, which I’m sure will be managed somewhat well, but the bringing together of young people - freshers’ week and beyond - in what is normally an excess of socializing, partying,?alcohol and sex. I rarely see this being mentioned alongside schools even though it coincides with opening

My university is getting on and doing things to keep students & staff safe. We have carefully staggered and scheduled Freshers' drop off appointments. We have one-way systems in all buildings. We have installed new ventilation systems. We have invested in new site-wide licences for new software, and employed tens of digital assistants to check all courses and modules are compatible with a blend of in person & online teaching.

It's costing about £8 million extra over what we usually spend on students' amenities etc - the stuff that the tuition fee doesn't quite pay for. The tuition fee never quite covers the actual cost of of a university degree, actually.

And that's before you count the unpaid overtime that everyone I know who works in a university does regularly, and has been doing even more since March.

Staff at my institution - academic and professional services and estate staff and cleaners - all of us, are taking pay cuts, foregoing scheduled increment pay rises, annual leave, promotions - all of those things that a well-ordered workplace rewards its excellent employees with, so that we can try to preserve jobs. But redundancies are on their way.

What we need the parents of university students to do is to model responsible behaviour: social distancing and wearing a mask so as not to be a risk to others. And take university professional and their advice seriously.

They need to get back, my DDs first year was obv cut short, returned home in March. She's got on with it, as there's no alternative, but she's sad that her experience of uni has been blighted in this way. They all got a taste of independence, then bam back home with mum and dad, and not only back home but locked up with them. I'd have hated that at 18/19, however well we got on with each other.

I feel for these students. DDs is heading back next week, house share with one other friend/student. Easy enough to isolate if need be, and to be honest I'm pleased she'll be away from vulnerable grandparents.