School buses and masks

[Derbygerbil]

My understanding is that the latest guidance on school travel doesn’t require any social distancing on school buses or the use of masks, in contrast to public transport.

I understand the social distancing element, as there simply aren’t enough buses to double or treble up on services to ensure pupils are appropriately distanced, and realise we need to be practical.

However, given those on the bus won’t be in a bubble (which is a flawed concept in my opinion, but anyway), I don’t understand why the Government aren’t requiring masks as they are in most other indoor settings (where social distancing is still required as well!). I appreciate it won’t stop infection, but masks are about reducing risk not eliminating it.

I expect there will be some who will say “whatever, we all just need to get back to normal as let Covid do its worst”, but my point is that’s not the Government’s policy.

It seems to me that Government policy on Covid is a complete dog’s breakfast, that is highly inconsistent and is losing (or has lost) public trust as a result. For instance:

Go to France where cases are less than 1 in 1,000 people - You must quarantine for a fortnight!

Travel on a school bus - Screw social distancing, and hey, don’t even bother with a mask!

It seems to me that Government policy on Covid is a complete dog’s breakfast, that is highly inconsistent and is losing (or has lost) public trust as a result.

This is a great summary!

It would seem Covid has been trained to only spread in images they want the science we are following to be applied!

We've been told masks will be required on the bus. I wonder at what level that has been decided?

I thought the new guidance did require masks on the bus.

I’ve tried to find guidance but failed... The best I found was draft home to school transport guidance published on 31 July which didn’t mention masks at all. I was going on information I have heard from local passenger transport unit. However, I did find an interview with Nick Gibb (Schools’ minister) saying they would be for over 11s. Whatever it is, it doesn’t seem very clear... I imagine updated guidance will probably be published at 11pm on 31 August .

Our school buses are requesting masks are worn.. Bus queues will also be socially distanced in year group bubbles...

I suspect this comes from a place where it's understood it just wouldn't happen/trying to enforce it would create too many other issues. Are drivers to refuse to take children who don't have a mask and leave them stranded, for example? What are drivers expected to do if children wear them to get on and then take them off?

I think the science says that masks incorrectly and unhygienically used will actually increase spread compared to a no-mask scenario, so for a cohort of chaotic children without strict supervision requiring a much higher adult to child ratio, it is safer not too have masks.

Masks are compulsory on our school coaches, and only 2 bubbles / year groups on each coach. As long as they go back, that's the most important thing for me.

This is what the DfE guidance says, it doesn't rule out face coverings:

"Dedicated school transport, including statutory provision

Pupils on dedicated school services do not mix with the general public on those journeys and tend to be consistent. This means that the advice for passengers on public transport to adopt a social distance of two metres from people outside their household or support bubble, or a ‘one metre plus’ approach where this is not possible, will not apply from the autumn term on dedicated transport.

The approach to dedicated transport should align as far as possible with the principles underpinning the system of controls set out in this document and with the approach being adopted for your school. It is important to consider:

how pupils are grouped together on transport, where possible this should reflect the bubbles that are adopted within school
use of hand sanitiser upon boarding and/or disembarking
additional cleaning of vehicles
organised queuing and boarding where possible
distancing within vehicles wherever possible
the use of face coverings for children (except those under the age of 11), where appropriate, for example, if they are likely to come into very close contact with people outside of their group or who they do not normally meet"

www.gov.uk/government/publications/transport-to-school-and-other-places-of-education-autumn-term-2020

This was updated 11 August 2020

The text I copied about comes from that update sloth. If course schools haven't been open to communicate that since....I'm fully expecting more updates, in numerous areas in the last week before we go back.

You have to scrolll through quite a bit but this is in there section 5 - don't imagine many, if any, la would go against this recommendation

"Face coverings:
In accordance with advice from PHE, from the autumn term, we recommend that local authorities advise children and young people aged 11 and over to wear a face covering when travelling on dedicated transport. This does not apply to people who are exempt from wearing a face coveringg_ on public transport.
Until the start of the autumn term, children and young people have not been expected to wear face coverings on dedicated transport, although they have been able to if they wish. We are adopting this new position in light of all children returning to education full-time and the fact that ‘1 metre plus’ social distancing measures will not uniformly apply on dedicated school or college transport.
A face covering is a covering of any type which covers your nose and mouth. Reusable or single-use face coverings are available for parents and carers to buy. A scarf, bandana, religious garment or hand-made cloth covering may also be used but these must securely fit round the side of the face.
Face coverings:
• may be particularly useful where measures such as distancing and sitting in bubbles or year groups are not possible
• may help children to feel more confident about using home to school transport, and parents to feel more confident about their child using home to school transport
• should not be worn by those who may not be able to handle them as directed (for example, young children, or those with SEND) as it may inadvertently increase the risk of transmission
• are not a substitute for other protective measures such as good hand hygiene
Ensure that any additional risk associated with their use are identified, for example, children and young people will need to understand how to handle their face covering properly. Children under 11 may wear a face covering if they are able to handle it as directed. For more information, read how to wear a face coveringg_.
Some children and young people may need to be able to lip-read, or see people’s faces, in order to communicate (there are companies now making lip-reading friendly face coverings).
Some children and young people with special educational needs may be distressed if the people around them wear face coverings; others may become agitated if people do not wear face coverings.
Schools should have a process for children and young people to remove face coverings when they arrive at school. This should enable them to wash their hands immediately on arrival (as is the case for all pupils) and then wash their hands again after removing their face covering. Disposable face coverings should be disposed of in a covered bin. They should not be put in a recycling bin. Children should keep reusable face coverings in a plastic bag they can take home with them.
Operators should conduct a risk assessment for all their operations including dedicated school transport services. This will determine the most appropriate safety measures to put in place such as for social distancing and face coverings. The guidance for operatorss_ provides further advice for staff."

Our school will do a final update next week...

I'm planning to drive my 12 yo to and from school in September, ridiculous having bubbles at school if they go and mingle in the bus!

I'm planning to drive my 12 yo to and from school in September, ridiculous having bubbles at school if they go and mingle in the bus!

The problem with this is that your child will still inevitably mingle with those in her group who have been on the bus!

@slothbyday

Thank you. I hadn’t seen that and it didn’t come up on a Google search.

we recommend that local authorities advise children and young people aged 11 and over to wear a face covering when travelling on dedicated transport.

Why “advise” and not “require” as is the case on public transport? As masks protect others rather than yourself, it’s pretty useless if only the “careful” ones wear masks and the “nonchalant” ones (the very ones who will have been less likely to have socially distant and therefore exposed) don’t.

Our school have said its up to the bus company! In other words, no shits given.

I'm driving my 12yo as well. Yes, she'll be mixing in school but the thought of a packed school bus is more worrying then a classroom.

@Gizlotsmum

Our school buses are requesting masks are worn.. Bus queues will also be socially distanced in year group bubbles...

I can understand how they can distance / group them to go home, but not getting on. They will all be walking past each other.

Our school has requested that they are worn, but said they are not mandatory.

Bubbles are meaningless. Once while classes go back it can hardly be a 'bubble,' let alone when you are talking about 200 children in a year group, who probably have siblings in all the other year groups etc

In Scotland school buses are deemed part of the school estate so masks are not required. My two cycle so doesn’t impact us directly.

It won't be "required" because there is no one to police it. Schools do not get involved with school transport matters. It is the local authority's responsibility and the bus companies and drivers often have enough problem behaviour to deal with without policing masks as well. On a public bus they can be told to get off but not on school services.

There are thousands of feckin coaches in mothballs. Not being enough coaches and no one agreeing to pay are 2 different things.

My friends kids are back (Scotland) and they have to wear masks and stay at school Monday-Friday (island) last year they had an option of a bus and 2 ferries.