What changes do you think the updated school guidance will announce on 11th August?

[Lemons1571]

I think masks for secondary kids. Not sure if they’ll also go for masks in some primary years. Hopefully also optional ppe for school staff.

Teachers don’t need to wear masks unless they are close to children or walking around school. Children only need masks when they are walking around campus. That was the rule in my DC’s school prior to the summer holidays and they managed to get the whole school back (nursery to year 6) without any cases of Covid-19.

But with respect, @BunsyGirl , the wearing or not wearing of masks at your school is irrelevant. You had no cases because no one was infected and community transmission was very low. There was no covid to pass along. You say your school is primary: if you are in a classroom with the same people for 6 hours you are likely to get it masks or not. They are not useful in this case. The masks are more useful at secondary where interactions with the same group are shorter.

I had a phone call while wearing a mask. My sister didn't even know I was wearing one until I told her at the end of the call. So I definitely disagree with your claim that most people can't hear anything.

That said, I'm a teacher and would struggle with mask wearing all day due to discomfort and anxiety (the masks remind me of covid, which raises my anxiety and makes it hard to concentrate), although some colleagues did do it throughout June and July.

@Barbie222 No it is not irrelevant. How many schools do you know that got the whole school back?! Sensible measures, no Covid-19. And, incidently, they had several cases pre-lockdown but transmission was NOT widespread amongst the pupils. That was also the case in the attached senior school (i.e. years 7 -13). Teachers CANNOT stand at the front of a class and teach in a mask. It will not work and is unfair on the children who deserve an education.

Mask wearing is a moot point though. The gov have recently released parental info on reopening and it clearly states that mask wearing will not happen. It would be an odd step to admit this is wrong, and not in line with gov approach to the pandemic thus far.

@bunsygirl I watched teachers teach successfully while wearing masks. I couldn't see any impact.

Teaching while distancing had a much, much bigger impact.

the poor staff only 2 weeks to implement stuff if there are big changes

That’s longer than we’ve had for any of the other changes 🤣

@solidaritea What about children with hearing problems? Also, I have struggled to make myself heard in a supermarket wearing a mask. Unless a teacher is close to a child, they do not need a mask. That was the rule at my DC’s school and it worked well.

Bunsygirl - have you actually been in a classroom?

I do not want to wear a mask all day, but neither do I want to catch COVID and take it home to my family / pass it on to my class.

By far the bigger issue for me is having to distance from the children. How will I help them? Listen to them read? Give them feedback / live mark.

I am lucky, I work in a small school in a rural area, but to be honest I cannot see schools staying open for long at all. They may be officially open but people will be isolating left right and centre and if that's too many staff off we will have no choice but to close temporarily- possibly repeatedly.

I think all schools need to be poised to be able to switch between in school and remote learning and possibly do both at the same time - it all might get off to a poor start due to local lockdowns that seem to be increasing and also massive numbers of children and teachers quarantine from European holidays at the end of August who get caught out... just think what it will be like when the colder weather draws in...

[quote BunsyGirl]@solidaritea What about children with hearing problems? Also, I have struggled to make myself heard in a supermarket wearing a mask. Unless a teacher is close to a child, they do not need a mask. That was the rule at my DC’s school and it worked well.[/quote]
No idea why you think that masks are ineffective if people are 2m apart. As far as I understand, they reduce transmission of covid particles out of and into the mouth and nose of people wearing them.

Obviously, if children need to lip read at all, this should be taken into account and people working with them probably can't wear a mask. Some children won't know they do this, which I agree is a bigger problem.

Honestly, if only the teacher wears a mask, and not the children, it's probably unlikely that spread will be reduced.

Saying "it worked well" at your child's school really isn't very enlightening. A sample of one is useless in a pandemic.

@BunsyGirl "Teachers CANNOT stand at the front of a class and teach in a mask. It will not work and is unfair on the children who deserve an education."

Who made you an expert on pedagogy? Teachers can and will teach in the ways they and their colleagues see fit.

Do you usually go in and check what teachers are wearing, where they're standing, whether they're circulating, what they're saying and how they're explaining to or directing children?

Only those with QTS are actually allowed to observe to manage performance and make a judgement about a teacher's effectiveness.

@solidaritea is right that distance will be the bigger issue for communicating and tracking progress, but if children aren't wearing masks, I won't be getting withing 2m of them to check their work!

@pontypridd

I think teachers should be protected. But I can't hear anyone when they speak in a mask. Can you?

I've noticed - more importantly - that my secondary aged child can hear and understand even less than me when we're out and about and someone speaks to her through a mask. We're always within 2 metres distance at those times too.

Kids won't be able to hear or understand if teachers wear masks. There'll be no point in them going to school.

Professional speakers like teachers wearing a mask will undoubtably lead to voice misuse to ensure people can hear you.....which leads to voice loss and not able to work! Voice loss in teachers has always been an issues (I work in ent field)

There needs to be a bit of awareness raising on using your voice safely with a mask before they should bring in masks in school. I think they should bring them in for secondary but not without thinking about the complications.

@ineedaholidaynow

Sorry, just seen your post:

anything between 24 and 29

I expect there will be no new guidance on the 11th.

I expect that the existing version of the guidance (released without warning or notification on 27th July) will be updated frequently, and randomly, often late at night, in the weeks between 11th and the start of term.

I then expect schools to be working with very different versions of the guidance, unsuspectingly, because they will now know when it has been changed.

I anticipate that the end of august will see an announcement from boris about hopw great everyone being in school will be, promising / threatening at least 3 things that have never ben mentioned in the guidance and are impossible in practical term.

i then expect another version of the guidance 3 days later from the DfE, who will have tried to square the circle between existing guidance and what BJ has said, creating something even more inconsistent thereby.

I then expect schools to open, with mixed success. Those who have interpreted the guidance in a way that turns out to be 'successful' will be praised, and others who have quite at random interpreted it in another will be vilified for 'failing children'.

Schools will start cliosing again within a fortnight, and we may have a workable version of guidance for the rest of the year (blended learning with smaller classes) by half term.

Apologies for typos.

@Prokupatuscrakedatus thank you. So similar or slightly smaller than us. It will be interesting to know how it goes.

@ineedaholidaynow

DS goes back on Monday - I'll report back.

@cantkeepawayforever

I expect there will be no new guidance on the 11th.

I expect that the existing version of the guidance (released without warning or notification on 27th July) will be updated frequently, and randomly, often late at night, in the weeks between 11th and the start of term.

I then expect schools to be working with very different versions of the guidance, unsuspectingly, because they will now know when it has been changed.

I anticipate that the end of august will see an announcement from boris about hopw great everyone being in school will be, promising / threatening at least 3 things that have never ben mentioned in the guidance and are impossible in practical term.

i then expect another version of the guidance 3 days later from the DfE, who will have tried to square the circle between existing guidance and what BJ has said, creating something even more inconsistent thereby.

I then expect schools to open, with mixed success. Those who have interpreted the guidance in a way that turns out to be 'successful' will be praised, and others who have quite at random interpreted it in another will be vilified for 'failing children'.

Schools will start cliosing again within a fortnight, and we may have a workable version of guidance for the rest of the year (blended learning with smaller classes) by half term.

If I could put money on what I think will happen-it would be exactly this!

@SmileEachDay

the poor staff only 2 weeks to implement stuff if there are big changes

That’s longer than we’ve had for any of the other changes 🤣

Yeah about 1 week, 6 days and 23 hours

How many schools do you know that got the whole school back?! Sensible measures, no Covid-19.

Schools with sufficient staff could take back more bubbles. The restraining factor on school opening was staffing. Absolutely nothing to do with the wearing or not of masks.

Once again, if your school had no COVID, that's because none came in and the chain was broken by isolating people who were positive. Matt Hancock has said himself that there is little point in wearing a mask in an office or primary school, as you will be exposed whether you wear one or not; masks aren't that good at protecting against long term exposure in the same room. They will reassure people who don't understand this, but nothing more.

At secondary there may be times when contact is passing and short enough that masks will protect both staff and pupils.

The key to protecting schools is having community levels low, track and trace working fast, and smaller groups of children.

But once in a school, it will spread fast.

@pontypridd

I think teachers should be protected. But I can't hear anyone when they speak in a mask. Can you?

I've noticed - more importantly - that my secondary aged child can hear and understand even less than me when we're out and about and someone speaks to her through a mask. We're always within 2 metres distance at those times too.

Kids won't be able to hear or understand if teachers wear masks. There'll be no point in them going to school.

I can hear people if they speak clearly. My class would be able to hear me- but then again I have a loud voice

I thought masks are being worn to help protect other people from the wearer, not the wearer themselves? So unless children wear them, a teacher wearing one will not be protected from the children should they have the virus.

I am going to end up teaching as normal, because I work in special needs and there is no way my pupils are going to be able to learn without an adult looking at what's in their books and helping from close quarters. Plus, for those who are hearing impaired, it would be absolutely detrimental. All I can do is approach by going round behind them so they're not breathing in my face. If I need to sign up have to move back to the front.

I'm kind of resigned to it, now, teaching with no safety measures.

@KatherineOfGaunt do you think your families will be more cautious outside of school so hopefully not bringing the virus into school as they know no SD/masks will be possible in school?