School buses ...

[GlomOfNit]

We just got emails here about how school will start back up in September. DS goes to secondary and goes on a bus service that up until now has been public transport (in theory anyway - the service only runs at school times and is packed out with rowdy secondary kids, I don't think any member of the public would want to get on!). Because of the restrictions placed on public transport, the transport company who run these 'public' services at school times have said it's not going to be either economically viable or even possible to double the fleet in order to abide by the government guidelines. But - that whole fleet of school services has been converted into 'school buses', meaning our kids still have a transport option. Great.

However, the guidelines that strictly limit the number of passengers on public transport and make them wear masks, don't apply to school buses. They don't have to wear masks (it's 'recommended' yeah, that'll work ...) and there is no limit to the numbers on board.

School have said how they're isolating year groups (they get their own toilets, areas of school, timetable is staggered to avoid inter-year group mingling etc) yet the buses that deliver at least half the kids to school will be crammed with mixed year group students, and they don't even have to wear masks!

Just seems crazy to me - no joined-up thinking. Anyone else banging their heads on the table over this? I'm thinking, if I can manage it, about starting a car pool with a couple of friends - at least they'll be in the same year group.

Yes, it's ridiculous. My dad is the chair of governors of a large school that buses in students from lots of surrounding villages, the council sent them lots of guidelines and things to implement and he asked if they'd be providing extra buses and was told absolutely not.
My mum is a teacher at a different secondary school and they've put a huge amount of effort into plans for September, separating year groups etc and it will all be messed up when the kids all get on the same bus.

DS starts secondary in September, and the plan was for him to get the bus (not school one). Now school have asked for everyone to avoid public transport which I fully support but I'm not sure how it's going to work for us. DP is currrently working from home so could run him of a morning but he usually has a team meeting at about 3pm which is when DS comes out of school. I can't pick him up as I've got to pick up DD from primary school - suppose I could make him wait and then get him after I've got DD.

You're right there has been no joined up thinking, not with this and not with a lot of things. (Remember back in Feb and March the government was tell people returning from highly infectious areas to self isolate for 14 days after getting on public transport to get home from the airport and I think that's still the policy with our new quarantine rules - sorry going off on one but it's the same thing and whenever the government were questioned about it they just fluffed the answers). I think your car pooling idea is a good one as it's limiting the chance for infection to spread. It just increases the amount of cars on the road at what is already a crazy time of the day, but apart from cycling I can't think of another way around it.

The transport situation is really concerning as a parent, even more so as a high school teacher. My teens will not be getting the bus and either myself or my partner will be transporting them; we will just have to drop them early and collect late if we can't work out our hours around them. We have these concerns for our own classes too; it effectively turns our 'bubble' into over 2000.

This is a minefield! Just to put another perspective on this, I work for a local authority and the school transport team is working like crazy to try and find solutions to the transport issues for all the schools in our area, based on complicated, sometimes contradictory and ever changing Government guidance. There are so many more factors to this than you can imagine - including negotiations with cash-strapped bus companies/franchises, lack of funding, and difficulties working out demand for different routes - let alone the year group bubbles mixing and all the practicalities of that. I guess what I'm trying to say is it's worth bearing all this in mind before you criticise the schools too much. It's an absolute nightmare to sort so we all might need to have a bit of patience!!

based on complicated, sometimes contradictory and ever changing Government guidance. There are so many more factors to this than you can imagine - thanks for saying that @SingingGoldfinch

Teachers and school staff have been trying to say this on many threads over the past couple of months only to be told that we are negative shirkers who deserved to be furloughed and/sacked.

Students at my school either train and walk or catch school bus so the train users have to wear masks but the bus users don’t? Anything to do with education seems to conflict with what is being offered in shops/offices.

The guidance is a joke.
It will all change multiple times before the start of term.

My DS will be in the same situation. The school he goes to is the catchment school but it’s 10miles away. Transport is a school bus and the letter states the pupils will be in charge of social distancing and maintaining their year groups bubbles and don’t have to wear face coverings. This is beyond a school issue-they are doing all they can,this is a government funding issue so bubbles can be maintained

I agree with the most recent few posters. Public transport will be a nightmare- and I still don’t get the year group bubbles. Even in a smallish school with, say, 4 classes, that’ll be 120 children in a bubble - except, if they have siblings in another year, or a few other years, then the bubbles actually become gigantic.

And they say that then if there are a few children testing positive then they’ll shut their bubble. But if your child is one of the ill ones then shutting the bubble won’t help your child/family/teacher.

If the numbers don’t improve a lot, I just can’t see how the schools can stay open for very long. It doesn’t make sense.

The place I check is Peter Symonds College in Winchester
2,000 pupils per year group (yes, I do mean thousand)
with a catchment that covers the whole of Hampshire, part of Wiltshire, Sussex and the Isle of Wight.
Kids arrive by ferry, train, bus, car and foot

The whole concept of bubbles is a non starter
so until I see guidance that works for PSC, I'll assume ministers are clueless

I just don’t get how I am meant to get my DD into secondary school (1/2 he - 40 mins by public bus) and drop off and pick up my other 2 primary kids who start earlier than they usually would because of staggered starts and finishes?
The busses are running at reduced capacity but no more will be put on and DD is just going to be waving down a full bus? Honestly don’t see how she can get there!

My children go to school on a specific school bus and we have been told that in September they will be seated in year groups with a permanently allocated seat and that they are required to wear face coverings. How that will be enforced is another matter - i can't see how the bus driver can ensure that everyone is in the correct seat - but at least it is an attempt to do something. I wonder if they will put teachers on the buses actually as they've done this in the short term previously when there have been issues with kids not wearing seatbelts or bullying on the bus.

I have no idea how transport is going to work next year and it seems pointless the school going to so much effort to keep the children in bubbles. DC travel on a public bus with children from 3 different schools. It is standing room only by the time it gets to us and its not unusual for the bus to be so full that kids further along get left at the bus stop. We're rural so most children at the school travel like this.

The bubbles are all a bit inconsistent though. Eg at my primary there will be no wrap around because the bubbles can’t mix but my children can go to swimming, gymnastics etc and mix with children from different schools in different ages. There were some murmurings about the school trying to stop social mixing for 2 weeks before term but it’s completely naive that that will happen.

I meant to add so if the bubble concept falls down at primary age, it’s even more problematic at secondary because of the numbers, transport, greater social life/independence etc.

MrsAvocet that sounds very sensible.
The school buses need to enforce masks.
Are the drivers behind barriers?

Thing is the uselessness of the guidelines impacts everyone even if you have kids in primary or a small primary or even no dc but work in an office with people with kids.

Tbh though people on fb are already planning their kids parties etc

We’re a coach company so no idea at all what expected of us come September plus we’ve had zero help from the government on the financial front too so companies will feel aggrieved to spend money implementing protective measures without making much profit.

My children’s transport is similar. Had a very unhelpful reply to my email to the school as part of the problem is no consideration has ever been given for transport for 6th form. Would have been able to avoid the issue if dd’s driving test hadn’t been cancelled twice.

@nex18 What do you actually think HTs can do about it though? It's all well and good spouting off about the realities but the guidance includes very little about transport,and crucially NO funding for anything extra.

We are still waiting for our council to let us know what is happening with transport.
We are a rural county (no cities) and the council said that if they followed the guidelines on social distancing etc then they would need an extra 1000 buses for school transport but they can only get an extra 7!! Times that by the hundreds of LEAs around the Country, There just isn’t a huge fleet of buses sat around somewhere for this sort of situation!!
I’m lucky that if/when I ever go back to work (currently furloughed and our industry is nowhere near being able to open - events/exhibitions) but if I am at work I’m only 2 minutes down the road from the secondary school so can drop/pick up most days and I normally take youngest to primary anyway and pickup on days he doesn’t go to after school club.
It is a worry

It makes year group bubbles in schools pointless. We have had similar letter from school, year group bubble, measures in place etc but they can't stagger start/ finish times due to buses and no extra buses will be available. The buses are rammed as it is so not sure if they will leave half of the kids at the bus stop ( they often don't let all the kids on if bus is full) or continue to ram them in.
School and local council recommend we look at alternative means if transport including driving them in but thats not always practical ( would take 2 hours out of my working day to do 2 round trips) and the traffic would be horrendous. The buses that serve DDs school goes to two different schools so its an absolute joke doing year group bubble of 150 ish pupils which is a massive bubble anyway and then traveling on a bus with lots of kids from different year groups and schools. Not thought through at all. They may as well not bother with bubbles in school because really there is no point.

Do you think children will have to self-isolate if anyone on the bus gets symptoms or tests positive?

We are supposed to make a decision about the school bus (and pay) by the first week in August but the school won’t be telling us how they’re going to run things until the 24th!

Its good to see that parents have finally caught up with what teachers have been saying for months.

All we need now is for one of the usual arseholes suspects to turn up with the can do attitude bullshit.

MayFayre
Do you think children will have to self-isolate if anyone on the bus gets symptoms or tests positive?

Looking at the guidance it is unlikely that anyone will have to isolate if anyone in or around school gets it.

@Hercwasonaroll they have a fleet of minibuses, when my eldest started at the school these were used for transport for 6th form. I’m not sure why they’re not now. I suggest that they go back to using them.

they have a fleet of minibuses
How many minibuses does it take to transport 1,500 children from a catchment 11 miles across ?