What is the logic behind face masks protecting others but not the wearer?

[trulydelicious]

Say the 3-ply IIR disposable masks sold at Boots for instance.

Intuituively one would think that the barrier in the mask would prevent (to an extent) droplets going out through the mask as well as droplets coming in if somebody sneezes or coughs near the wearer?

In a way this should also work for non-surgical cloth masks (although the level of protection may be lower).

Am I missing something?

TheLegendOfZelda So you really don't care that people around you (ie "random strangers") might get sick? That's pretty unusual.

Out of interest, what do you define as a "proper mask"?

We aren't supposed to be wearing FFP3/N95 masks, just a face covering.

Hence why the 'covering wouldn't protect the wearer.

Medical staff need these types of masks, not us lot wandering around Tesco.

Yes, the only reason why the whole face covering utter nonsense is being pushed is because of shortages within medical settings. Face coverings don't protect you. If they did, your surgeon would be wearing a nice patterned version made by a local nana.

I am just more honest about things. If people really cared about strangers' health, poverty would be eradicated and childhood polio would no longer exist, children would not die of starvation and diarrhoea. You may say you thoughtfully wear your manky scarf to protect others, I say it is a pathetic talisman you cling to, like a hand of fatima or a crucifix. Whatever. I will wear it to keep you happy when required. If I think my own health is at risk I am not so stupid as to think it's helping.

I prepped for this back in February. I have everything my family and I need, if required. I don't judge it to be currently required for us. I don't need to rely on the community for anything, thank you, although I am sure it is lovely of you to wear your socks on your heads to protect us.

Unless you have a real reason, I cannot fathom why you would not wear a mask? They aren’t nice to wear, but in doing so your protecting someone else. Why would you not? It might not be the person your stood nextto, but their neighbour, their grandparent.
Genuinely, how much of an arsehole do you have to be to consider not wearing a mask if you have the choice?

I’ve got some really pretty reusable washable ones. I keep seeing disposable ones just thrown on the ground. Seems such a waste.

@EvilPea

Unless you have a real reason, I cannot fathom why you would not wear a mask? They aren’t nice to wear, but in doing so your protecting someone else. Why would you not? It might not be the person your stood nextto, but their neighbour, their grandparent. Genuinely, how much of an arsehole do you have to be to consider not wearing a mask if you have the choice?

I’ve got some really pretty reusable washable ones. I keep seeing disposable ones just thrown on the ground. Seems such a waste.

I completely agree about the horrific environmental impact of all of this

Out of interest, presumably you wear your mask around the people you are in longest contact with, to keep them safe ie family and friends, at work and at home, when socialising? At all times apart from when alone, really, would be the only logical result of your argument.

Face coverings don't protect you. If they did, your surgeon would be wearing a nice patterned version made by a local nana.

Yes but, as has already been pointed out on this thread, there is quite a difference between doing your weekly shop in tesco and intubating a Covid patient on the ICU.

You may say you thoughtfully wear your manky scarf to protect others, I say it is a pathetic talisman you cling to, like a hand of fatima or a crucifix. Whatever.

Riiiiiiiight.

I sneezed in Sainsbury's yesterday. I was wearing a mask. I also, due to work, was in close contact with lots of people last week. It's unlikely I picked anything up, but if I did it wouldn't be fair to sneeze it all over people in a supermarket. I think masks should have been made mandatory in shops long before now.

Out of interest, presumably you wear your mask around the people you are in longest contact with, to keep them safe ie family and friends, at work and at home, when socialising? At all times apart from when alone, really, would be the only logical result of your argument.

No, I work from home and only really go out for food shops. The masks we are wearing aren’t going to long term protect my family and given our toothbrushes share the same pot, would seem completely futile.
I do only wear them inside in shops, but I’m only going inside, in shops. So I’m not sure quite what your point is?

I actually hate seeing the masks around, I’m slightly deaf so can’t lip read. I also have nhs relatives struggling as they wear the proper masks all day.
But if who and the government are saying it’s the right thing to protect others, then of course you do it. I’m not sure why you wouldn’t if you could?

But if who and the government are saying it’s the right thing to protect others, then of course you do it. I’m not sure why you wouldn’t if you could?

I would like to take a punt at the answer, if I may. Ahem. Is it “I have superior intellect that allows me to accurately assess risk and I have decided that I don’t need to, if you were clever like me you would also know the TRUTH but sadly you are mere sheeple, unthinkingly following orders from above. Pathetic.”?

Interestingly there was an article on BBC news the other day that men are less likely to wear face coverings than women, presumably because of the above thinking.

Men have always pinged up on stats as not following new advise and guidance.
I remember all the initial lockdown threads where people were concerned their partners weren’t social distancing, were still going out shaking hands, and not taking Covid seriously.

accurately assess risk but this is it isn’t it, we can risk assess for ourselves. I know who is at risk in my family.
But I can’t risk assess for the person next to me in the supermarket

What about the valved masks? My understanding is they filter most of what you breathe in, but pass out unfiltered breath, therefore those would protect the wearer but not other people?

@TheLegendOfZelda

Absolutely! if face masks were for our good, they 'd have been introduced in March.

The new rule is coming in tomo, yet guidance still hasn't been published, shops have told staff not to ask customers to wear them or refuse their trade and Police forces have said they do not expect deal with calls saying someone won't wear one unless there are other offences, such as violence etc.

Its a complete farce and anyone supporting that moron Johnson should remember that european countries were giving out masks many weeks ago.

There isn't anyone really on here saying they won't wear them, just that they will whilst continuing to point out the arbitrary nature of the rules around 'face coverings'
If you can't see how arbitrary and illogical it is, then that's up to you. Perhaps you also subscribe to the 'it trains you to like wearing ventilators' and 'it's like when you are incontinent' schools of thought.

Absolutely! if face masks were for our good, they 'd have been introduced in March.
Like other countries you mean?

You do know this is a new virus? That we are learning about all the time?

@minisoksmakehardwork

What about the valved masks? My understanding is they filter most of what you breathe in, but pass out unfiltered breath, therefore those would protect the wearer but not other people?

Yeah, I quite like those

I read an article today about a study carried out in Poland suggesting that narcissists and people with psychopathic/sociopathic tendencies are most likely to refuse to wear masks. Either because they don't think they work, or they don't care about others. I immediately thought of MN and all the recent threads by anti-maskers 🤣. Medical reasons excluded of course. It was picked up by the Mail, so you'll understand why I don't link to it.

@EvilPea

CDC said face coverings in April, WHO - face coverings should be worn in public places very early june.

China and other Asian countries using them from the outset in January/Feb based on their exp of SARs, another CV virus.

European countries using them in May as they came out of lockdown.

UK recommends them as we approach August.

I wear full FFP3 mask for work. It is classified as PPE - personal protective equipment that is it protects my airway. In order for it to protect me it has to be ‘fit tested’ to make sure that it has an airtight seal and I can only breath in air that has been filtered.
The common or garden face covering/ mask or any form of mask is simply a piece of fabric to catch droplets from exhaled air. In effect you are wearing the tissue rather than having to grab it from your pocket when you cough or sneeze. Wearing an FFP2/3 without fit testing is a waste and if they have a valve, not really the desired plan. The valve allows your exhaled air out without filtering so you might as well not be wearing it.
In summary, simple face coverings worn by everyone slightly ( 4% ish) decrease risk for everyone. Filtering respirator masks protect the wearer but no one else.
Mask wearing is not new in medical fields and there is plenty of evidence of how ineffective they are in protecting the wearer. However there is a very small increase in protecting others when combined with social distancing.

Interesting *@Angrymum22 *. It's a minefield really

See How Many Droplets Are Spewed When You Cough Without A Mask

Masks worn properly protects everyone within splitting distance. All masks are better than nothing but none are "bulletproof".

Every little helps and properly fitted certified EU FFP3, USA 3M N95 and PRC KN95 also protects the wearer (especially if also worn underneath a face shield covering.

Happy mask wearing and save lives!

"Happy mask wearing and save lives!"

So go to some fucking pubs and lecture them then.

@HeIenaDove

I agree with your not wearing a masks but stop singling out pubs and restaurants the sole purpose is to put things in your mouth, it's a different issue.

Judging by most people I've met in past few months, I'm not sure I'm that bothered about other people.