Will Government announce mandatory face coverings in shops by Monday?

[Derbygerbil]

It seems they are now convinced that face coverings are a good idea in enclosed spaces, and are happy to make mandate it.... They are desperate to keep infections down so they can continue to open up the economy, so my money is on them extending it over the weekend to more
places, still from 15 June to give people time to comply.... especially given the very recent WHO advice.

I would hope they didn't. While social distancing and masks may be slightly more effective than social distancing alone there is no doubt social distancing alone is more effective than masks alone which would be the effect of mandating masks in shops. I honestly believe a complete ban on masks in supermarkets is the best way to reduce spread in such an environment as it is pretty obvious to anyone who has been in a supermarket that those in masks are blatantly ignoring social distancing and are generally getting in the way of everyone else who are social distancing.

Snoods, home made masks, surgical masks will not give people protection.

You’re missing the point... The point is that coverings that prevent a significant proportion of droplets that tend to carry Covid as per the research posted above, and that you would be protecting others.

To object because it doesn’t provide complete protection would be like saying that because children in car seats can sometimes still get injured in an accident, car seats are pointless!

i think the govt is hoping that by making people wear them on public transport people will get use to them and just carry on wearing them elsewhere without being forced to

I would hope they didn't. While social distancing and masks may be slightly more effective than social distancing alone there is no doubt social distancing alone is more effective than masks alone which would be the effect of mandating masks in shops

The Government will be looking to increase economic activity as much as possible, and I think face coverings very likely feature in their calculations. Whereas I agree that social distancing at 2m with face covering is better than no social distancing without a face covering, arguably 1m with face covering is better than either (if fabric stops say 90%+ of particles as many do based on the research posted by @PestymcPestFace), and also supports economic growth. If I was the Government I’d be concerned that people will more and more start to ignore the 2m rule anyway, and that banning masks wouldn’t really make much difference in a couple of weeks. Besides, how often are people within 1m of each other in a shop for any period of time? It’s within people’s personal space in the way 2m isn’t.

i think the govt is hoping that by making people wear them on public transport people will get use to them and just carry on wearing them elsewhere without being forced to

I doubt it, as in most places only a tiny minority use public transport, especially at the moment, so it won’t lead to widespread change in public behaviour by itself.

WHO have changed their stance on face masks for the public and are now advising all Governments to encourage everyone to wear masks/face coverings in public places where there is widespread transmission and social distancing is difficult eg. public transport, shops, refugee camps etc.

Fabric masks should consist of at least 3 layers of different material.

Over 60's with underlying medical conditions should wear medical masks where there is community transmission.

So, hopefully from my point of view, they will follow the advice and make it mandatory.

I have to wear one every day at work. 4 hours continuous work in one today until a break. I had to sleep for a couple of hours when I got home as it makes me so exhausted. I also feel disorientated sometimes and cannot think as well as usual.

Having worn both, there’s quite a difference between a face mask (stuffy and rather claustrophobic) and a face covering (lighter and far less oppressive to wear). I can see that the former would be tough for many in certain jobs.

And no they don’t need them in school. Junior school children rely on the teachers expression when they are teaching. Especially foundation level children when learning to read, this would be impossible to do. Thankfully the teacher friends I have are against it.

I agree on this... We need to balance risk and reward. The way out is not to try and stop it completely - that’s unrealistic, at least at present - but to contain it and be able to track, trace and isolate groups where into which it has spread. In a school you would need to focus on the class into which it has spread... and not be overly concerned about the whole school if there are adequate distancing in place. In a public environment, you can’t do that (and track and trace isn’t operational and won’t be for a while - besides it needs everyone to participate for it to work).

Hopefully, it'll give the selfish fuckers on Mumsnet something else to fill their "can't/won't" stompy boots with.

@daisychicken

I can understand why you’re not keen, and this is an issue. I think the Government needs to be proportionate and consider the benefits and the disadvantages in the round. Ultimately, if it believes there are both overall public health and economic benefits to doing it, I think it will. Clear plastic visors may be an answer if the Government does go down this route.

The fact that a poll this morning in the Times showed overwhelming support for Government making face coverings mandatory in shops as well as transport (to my surprise - apparently it’s as popular as David Attenborough ) I’m even more confident they will.

@Derbygerbil I'm all for facemasks/covering of some kind, I think we do need to protect each other and this could be a way of getting life back to some sort of normality. We just need to make sure those who will struggle (whether wearing or communication) are supported, protected and helped.

I wonder how effective clear visors are when compared to a mask?

I am making some masks with clear vinyl but, I don't know if they will meet the recommendation WHO have given out. And although I can help others by wearing one, I need others to wear one for me!

No idea but it’s easier to SD in a shop than on public transport.

@Penyu are you in HK? My friend just sent me a message that she's sent me a DHL parcel full of masks for DH, DS and I.

@MarshaBradyo: I think that's true if you think of supermarkets but, some of the small independent shops can be quite squashed even with just a handful of folk in them and while people may be reasonably ok with queueing in order to manage capacity just now, I can't see how that will work in the wind, rain, sleet and snow of Autumn and Winter.

Folk will just think, "sod it, I'm off" which will be another nail in the coffin for the small independents.

I guess this means that ds and I will be even more restricted in our movements than we already are.
We don't have masks or anything that we could make face coverings out of and I can't afford to buy any.

@RoryGillmoresEvilTwin: Don't know if this is of any help to you but, have you looked on your local Facebook page?

In this area (not particularly affluent - or friendly!), there are lots of people who will run up a few facemasks, free of charge, on request.

You and your son won't be the only ones in this position so I'm sure there will be help available for folk in your situation.

Where are all these masks the government want people to wear? I haven’t seen any being sold in supermarkets. I know you can buy online but in other countries I have seen them being given out at stations etc. What’s the picture here? Surely they should be provided it deemed essential.

Winged true it could help in that way.

@Wingedharpy thank you. I hadn't thought of that.

I am not too sure what the government plan is - if there is one... I guess it would be nice to eradicate the virus completely and if that meant suppressing the spread even further by making people masks in shops for a bit, doesn't seem a bad idea...

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8394485/Plans-reopen-shops-chaos-experts-warning-second-wave-likely.html

@RoryGillmoresEvilTwin

If this rule does come in, I’m pretty sure free face coverings will be pretty easy to come by, as they are in many other countries. Shops will want customers so will likely hand them out to people who don’t have them. If the population of India can do it, despite the poverty of many of them, I’m sure we’ll find a way.

They are compulsory in shops in Germany so maybe we should do the same - a lot of commentators have suggested Germany has handled this all rather well - maybe we should follow their example...

Best place to buy masks i've found:

plus-mask.com/products/type-iir-sterile-ultimate-box-of-30

plus-mask.com/collections/civilian-grade-masks

They also do kids masks!

Well, they didn’t.... but I still think it’s coming as part of reducing social distancing to 1m once retail opens up more fully and to help business. I believe Cabinet are meeting Tuesday to agree a way forward...

I'm more than happy to wear a mask especially if it means social distancing can be reduced to say 1 metre.

Also it will hide my double chin and no need to wear lipstick