Kids playing together

[SunshineSally46]

I have seen no end of photos on social media lately of people allowing kids from different households to play together. Although the rules state we can now meet up outside I thought the 2 meter distancing rule still applied yet these kids are hugging and playing together in paddling pools and things like that. It's not ok yet is it?

My dc would love to see their friends but even though they are older I can't guarantee they will all keep their distance when excitable and playing so I haven't let them yet. Have you?

[ScarfLadysBag]

Except there's no evidence that children are super/spreaders and actually evidence that the opposite is true So call them what you like but it isn't factually correct

[RainbowMum11]

And the R number has gone above 1 and the number of positive cases has been increasing in the North West and South West of England so perhaps how complacent you have become depend on which region you live in too?

[JassyRadlett]

So whilst there is a small risk of DD becoming seriously ill with Covid, she is very able to spread it (we call kids super spreaders, in every setting).

Can you share the evidence on which you’re basing this statement for Covid-19?

[ScarfLadysBag]

https://fullfact.org/health/covid-19-in-children/

Nonetheless, the overall trend from current evidence suggests that children play a minimal role in the transmission of the new Coronavirus

But who ever left facts get in the way of things, eh?

[BogRollBOGOF]

DS (7) played football with the neighbour in the park. I had no issue with tackling as contact was very short-lived.

I'm happy to maintain 2m in places like queues but I am not going to enforce unnatural rules that defy the way children play, especially with DS1 (9) who has ASD and spent years building up to real friendship and learning how to play and collaborate with children. I do not need to encourage any fear of other people or fear of "germs" or "dirt" to a naturally risk adverse, anxious child who will struggle to unlearn it and revert to a real normal. DS1 is OK with a quiet life, my concern is that this is a temporary situation and he needs to be able to adapt to a normal level of busyness over the coming months.

DS2 is struggling more. At 7, he looks likely to be missing a sixth of his school life. He has not had normal childhood interactions or activities for near 2 consecutive summer holidays worth. A sociable child, he is lucky to have DS1 close in age and interests, but it's not enough, especially when DS1 is prone to emotionally overreacting and physically lashing out. That is not a long term, healthy dynamic. Under normal circumstances most parents would be very concerned if that was the dynamic of their child's only friend.

The first week of lockdown, DS2 and next-door/ friend/ classmate were happily playing football over the fence (it was unenforcable not to as balls always go flying in both directions). After a week it wore off. DS2 withdrew because he found it so hard having his friend so near but so far on the other side of a 6 foot fence, constantly hearing but never seeing. Now rules have eased, he gets to hear his friend being excited over his grandparents popping round. Due to timings, ill health/age and location, my DCs haven't seen a family member beyond our household since Christmas. They probably won't be seeing half their family this year because flying during a pandemic and frail grannies are a bad combination. Let's hope granny has a few more years left in her...

We go for a 5 minute walk to the local shopping precinct... past their shut-up school (to their year groups)...past the closed up community centre where they should be doing Scouting... past the padlocked playground... past the locked up leisure centre where they do sports clubs... So many reminders of what they have been banned from doing for months and have no sign of being restored to them.

We've kept talk of the virus low key, factual and up-to-date. No scaremongering.
But DS2 is struggling. He's always affectionate, but is wanting a lot of physical contact. Crying that he needs new friends. A far more sensitive temper than usual. DS1 will find it harder when we come out the other side, and the longer this deprivation of normal childhood activity limps on for, the harder that will get to for him adapt back.

Children learn so much from their peers and parents can not replicate that. DS1's and his friend's only phone conversation went "Hi"... "Hi"... "Hi"... "Hi"... pause I'm wearing a minecraft t-shirt... hands phone back. A friend tried video calling DS2 a couple of times that turned into a monologue about the statistics on pokemon cards... DS2 put the phone down leaving friend monologuing to the artex pattern on the ceiling. They just don't have the maturity of social skills to deal with this shaddow half-life by phone or zoom and they find it easier to retreat and pretend that real life didn't happen. Some children will find it harder to bounce back from that than others.

This experience has dragged up a lot of memories of when I was also 7 and we moved across the country severing my friendships, rather ill-timed in the summer term. In the final weeks of the school year I failed to make any friends before the summer holidays. It felt like an eternity being an isolated, only child with not a single friend. That was about 10 weeks from the move to the new school year, but at least there was the interest of new places to explore and visit not stuck in the same house, doing the same walks, seeing all the fun things shut up. I had forgotten quite a lot of that summer 30+ years on.

This is not healthy for children. They need their peers. They need normal interactions with their peers, not social distancing. Some children will feel long term effects from this.

[manicinsomniac]

Some children will feel long term effects from this

Yes, they will. And it's awful.

But some people will die from this.

Some children will lose their parents to this.

Some people will be left with scarred lungs meaning their next bout of flu could kill them instead. Some of those people will have children too.

Generally, women in their 20s-40s are a fairly low risk group. A lot of those who have died in that demographic were nurses who died caring for people who may have either broken rules or come in to contact with people who broke rules.

What seems like a miniscule risk to you could set off a chain of infections that could deprive another child of their mother or father. Is it really worth that to mean your child can play normally a few months early?

I get that it probably won't happen. But that's why we need official rules. Because everyone thinks it won't happen to them when, statistically, it has to happen to someone.

[Designerenvy]

I've been very compliant with the guidelines all the way through .
However, I have let my kids meet their friends since last week . They play together ( outside only ), carry hand sanitizer but probably don't maintain the 2 metre distance , but no hugs etc .
I was very nervous at first but I now can see the benefit it's having on the kids . They're so much happier and even have more energy.
Kids need friends!
We have to learn to live with this virus. It isn't going anywhere fast.
From next week we can meet in groups of 6 , inside and out ( Ireland ) , I will be allowing this too .
I will have hand sanitizer available and a separate hand towel for each visitor, I will wipe down surfaces and handles with antibacterial wipes before they arrive. I'll have those wipes available if anyone wants to wipe down something before they use it.

It sounds like work but I think this is what we will have to do for now. Staying as safe as we can but also socialising and enjoying each others company.

[Tonkerbea]

I don't like the inference that if you're maintaining 2m and sticking to guidelines that are in place to keep the R below 1, that you don't care about your child's mental health.

[Drivingdownthe101]

Tonkerbea I don’t think that is the inference. If your child is fine with that then great. These posters are talking about the mental health of their children. I haven’t felt the need to let mine play closely with other children because a) they have each other and get one well and b) one has gone back to school and the other will be soon so they have interaction there. However in different circumstances, if I felt mine were struggling with their mental health, I would act differently.

[midnightstar66]

@manicinsomniac what's the difference between a few dc playing in a bubble when care is taken, and the dc that are in school? apart from that in our case none of us are leaving our street apart from the odd supermarket trip. The dc in school are,or are mixing with, children of adults who are on the front line.

[Springhere]

If your child is fine with that then great. These posters are talking about the mental health of their children.

This is the key to all of this, surely. Some children are really struggling and their feelings are just as real, valid and important as those of adults. If these children continue to be isolated for months longer, there could absolutely be longer term effects on their mental health and wellbeing.

Most posters are arranging meet ups outdoors where children don't have physical contact but aren't continually told to keep 2 metres apart. This is extremely low risk and could have enormous benefit for children who are suffering ill mental health.

[manicinsomniac]

midnightstar because that is part of an essential plan to get the economy and education going again. The plan needs to get more extensive and more free as time and conditions allow. People who do their own versions of this could delay and endanger the return to normality and more lives could be lost than are already being sacrificed through this process. The success of the easing of restrictions relies on everything which has not been relaxed staying in place

[Nonotthatdr]

@manicinsomniac

If the government Showed any sign of getting its act together and getting nursery’s back - as in making their guidance mandatory I would wait for that. It’s not happening though so I will set up the exact same provison with some friends Children, doing exactly what they should be doing in nursery following the government guidance - the Dominic Cummings incident showed me that the government are not actually thinking about kids and aren’t expecting people to follow the guidance, of children are harmed after this the line will be “any reasonable parent would have ensured that their child had sufficent socialisation to forward their development”, I think it could be argued as a health need for these kids. Preschoolers (3-5) need to play to develop. It can’t be delayed for 6 months or longer......

[manicinsomniac]

I can totally understand your individual argument. But the problem is everyone's argument sounds valid when explained by them. That's why we shouldn't set up our individual rules.

[Drivingdownthe101]

If anyone has issues with people taking matters into their own hands regarding their children, they need to take it up with the government who have totally failed to consider the needs of children throughout this whole thing.
My children are currently fine. Coping. I’d obviously prefer for my 6 and 4 year olds to be doing more than ‘coping’ but it is what it is.
Some children are not coping. And the government have failed to take these children into consideration, so their parents are doing it instead.

[whatswithtodaytoday]

I really don't understand this claim that children need socialisation under 5. I'm an only child, had a SAHM, no cousins came along till I was at school and my parents don't have any friends with children. I didn't play with other kids until I went to school, aged 5 (my mum didn't let me go until I had turned 5). I'm fine! I also used to spend the vast majority of the summer holidays on my own even I was older - we'd do the odd playdate but probably one or two over the whole summer. I remember those summers very fondly.

I guess if they've been used to it then perhaps they would want to see their friends, but I really don't think many young children are suffering from spending time at home, unless they're already in a vulnerable situation.

[ihearttc]

I've let DS2 who is go to a friends house today. They should have been playing outside on their bikes 2m apart but it's chucking it down with rain so they have gone inside.

DS2 has not seen another child apart from his 15 year old brother since the start of lockdown and quite honestly he is struggling. His class has a zoom meeting yesterday for the first time and he was literally silent despite everyone else laughing and talking...he is never ever silent.

He will get changed when he gets home and also have a shower...his friends parents haven't been anywhere or seen anyone so I feel the risk is minimal. In fact the risk to them is greater as I work in a school.

[Tonkerbea]

@Drivingdownthe101 fair enough, my two seem to be coping (though who can tell what long term repercussions might be), so I've not been driven to organise free play with other households. Though I'd like to, I'm very conscious that in some areas, if transmission increases, we could tip back over R1.

Of course I don't like the lack of socialisation for children, its an awful sacrifice they're having to make. I do think if bubbles with other families had been allowed, people wouldn't feel the need to take matters into their own hands. The government didn't give any hope of this in their road map, a critical oversight that's left people feeling desperate.

[LockdownLou]

@whatswithtodaytoday

So you’re basing your one perspective on the needs of roughly 8 million children? Because you were an only child and didn’t get out much for five years? Tbh I think that shows.

[CornishYarg]

The government didn't give any hope of this in their road map, a critical oversight that's left people feeling desperate.

Exactly this

[Needsomegoodies]

@manicinsomniac I totally agree. Each person can have their own valid argument and their own interpretation of minuscule risk but that’s the thing about statistics - all of the numbers are someone. If we all make our own lax interpretation then transmission increases. It’s not about what that means for individual risk, it’s what that means for the whole country. Less than 10% infected so far.

My family has had it (and I’ve still got lingering issues after 12 weeks) but I’m not letting that change the responsibility I feel to prevent others getting it for now if I can.

[RC000]

@Needsomegoodies and @manicinsomniac I COMPLETELY agree. It is selfish not to follow guidelines. You can justify any breaking of them however you wish. But it doesn't make it okay.

[Nonotthatdr]

@manicinsomniac

The spirit of the rules is that eyfs kids are permitted/encouraged to play with each other in childcare environments, it’s not adding any other risk than that already permitted.

Childcare environments not available to us so I cannot socialise my dd witching the rules at present however If I register as a childminder with my local authority it becomes ok to have a child round (and them there allowed inside as well!).. might go off to google how to do that, but I’m certain the filling in of a registration form does not stop covid.

[Tulipstulips]

I have had a couple of play dates this last week. We told the children no hugging, no kissing - but they were rough housing and holding hands within half an hour of meeting up. At the moment around 0.01% of the population has covid19, and both families I met haven’t seen anyone else (and nor have we) since March. We took a calculated risk... which is what we’re all going to have to start doing unless we want to live in lockdown until there’s a vaccine.

[Stuckforthefourthtime]

@tulipstulips We took a calculated risk... which is what we’re all going to have to start doing unless we want to live in lockdown until there’s a vaccine

Or, you know, until we get the current number of cases under control, which won't happen when multiple play dates a week are going on. But hey, you do you!