If schools aren’t back to normal sept?

[gingajewel]

If schools aren’t back to normal September and you are back to work what are you planning to do? Also do you think the key worker provision will stay for September or do you think it will only available to the summer holidays?

[cocktailoclock]

@Stuckforthefourthtime I think there is a massive difference between WFH with childcare / education and WFH trying to do both.
My issue is that the govt is potentially expecting companies to allow this for the foreseeable instead of either 1. Opening primary schools fully or 2. Setting out a roadmap which allowed companies and employees to make informed decisions about next steps. Eg - worse case scenario we think it's going to be disrupted TIL October but after that should be ok.
This current shit storm is going to slam working families and women for decades to come

[fia101]

I'm a lawyer wfh doesn't affect how I deal with confidential matters or gdpr. All the barristers I work with in cases we use encrypted email and electronic court bundling

[fia101]

Why can't blokes look after their own kids the same % as women. Why does it always fall to the woman to make the sacrifice.

Me and my husband split everything 50/50.

Men need to step up.

[Drivingdownthe101]

@fia101

Why can't blokes look after their own kids the same % as women. Why does it always fall to the woman to make the sacrifice.

Me and my husband split everything 50/50.

Men need to step up.

Mainly because in general, men earn more than women. The gender pay gap is real. Most people cannot afford to give up the breadwinners salary. DH and I met on a graduate scheme. For a few years I earned more than him. After three maternity leaves, he earns 5 x what I do. If anyone has to give up their job, despite him being a more natural parent than me, it’ll have to be me.

[fia101]

It goes back to men taking parental leave 50/50 so their career is hit the same as a womans'

Eventually if men took 6 months or so paternity it wouldn't be viewed as a bad thing or a liability. Change in culture

[Drivingdownthe101]

Agree entirely, but that doesn’t help the women who earn less than their partners now.

[fia101]

I agree it won't help now it's just so frustrating that I can see it will be women who lose out again due to insufficient support from the government for childcare. We're left to just pick up the pieces as always. Childcare is never given any real thought. Paternity leave is not invested in or pushed.

Again firms will have another excuse to get rid of women with children.

[Cremebrule]

FrenchSeal What are you planning to do for employees vulnerable to illness? I’ve got a friend who has had a transplant for example so is extremely vulnerable. There is no way her employer would risk saying she needed to be back in the office, using public transplant at an arbitrary date regardless of government guidelines.

If schools are not back to normal, I’ll have a major issue. I do have sympathy with employers as there are some real grey areas. Large corporations are in a better position than SMEs. The government needs to show some leadership and acknowledge some of the issues rather than brush over them.

[Tilly030705]

If schools are not back properly in September then people will start to break rules and will allow others in their house for childcare reasons etc. At the moment you can’t have friends/family in house but people will have to if this fiasco carries on.
I think it’s totally ridiculous that another school education year may be affected!
Just open in September properly for all children and year groups.
If people choose individually not to send their children then let them, but let the rest of us send our children back for a proper education.

[FrenchSeal]

There's no evidence that it will just be women 'losing out' @fia101.

If it comes to a point where schools are not open on a full-time basis and families do not have other childcare options, they will discuss as a family what the best option is for them.

I suspect this will come down to which parent earns more and whether their employer is willing to facilitate working from home with DC or changes to hours.

If the woman earns more, the man is more likely to resign- I don't see this an issue that will only affect women. We're expecting 20% of the workforce to resign for childcare reasons at my place and I suspect it will be roughly equal in terms of male and female.

[canigooutyet]

@fia101
I’m the same.
We talked about this before we had kids. Told the ex straight I’m not a 50s housewife. I have a life as well and why should we all suffer?

At times we took pay cuts, reduced hours etc. If he wanted to work full time up to him, however he still had to do life stuff like everyone else.

If one of us made plans and the other person wasn’t able to do it all, it would be down to the one who wanted to change things that sorted
Stuff out.

Equality starts at home.

[HepzibahGreen]

90+ % of single parents are women. Most of them work. So they are fucked (or, their mums are, because realistically that's who will be looking after their kids).
I agree men REALLY need to step up, and earning more money doesn't stop a man from telling his work that he needs leeway to look after his kids as well-women have to do this all the time.
Women in couples need to fight hard to get men to be equal parents (I know they shouldn't have make them but hey that's reality).
Single mothers are really going to be set back, and they are the ones who need their jobs the most.
It's so shit, and the government couldn't care less, because they don't care about women and they REALLY don't care about single mothers.

[fia101]

Look at how many men take up parental leave - it is incredibly low. Pay and conditions may not be good for parental leave but men haven't made a song and dance about it to get it changed.

I simply don't believe that it will be a 50/50 split between men and women [leaving jobs due to childcare issues]

[HepzibahGreen]

Of course it won't. You can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink.This situation will impact women long term. It's a disaster that keeps on giving.

[Qasd]

I do wonder about a safeguarding issue, will more children younger than they should be just left alone, it is a phenomenon in the school holidays and I think the assumption parents will give up work forgets a significant minority will not and leave children home alone since they need the money.

[canigooutyet]

Is the disaster the industry fault or parents fault?

I’ve done the relationship stuff. I’ve been the sole parent for several years. I’m sure I’m not the only one who has been told more than once, tough shit get a job and loads of suggestions why and how 🤣 Think of your life, you’re their only role model, they are already disadvantaged enough blah blah blah 🤣 🤣

I don’t know how anyone can complain that the company they work for won’t bend to their will, when they haven’t got equality at home sorted first. I know in my life it won’t happen, my kids lifetime hopefully enough parents will be thinking the same so changes can be made.

[justkeepmovingon]

@Stuckforthefourthtime I fully understand your post but unpicking the whole women in the workplace and economic differences covid has highlighted and appointing the blame to the employers isn't going to change anything here.

The only thing that will change this dynamic is a massive shift change in society and equal maternity/paternity leave for men and women that is enforced, So men have to take 6 months as do women.

The amount that needs to change is beyond COVID but I think COVID is actually doing a great job of highlighting the gap and differences between men and women's roles and hopefully in itself will result in a shift change for the better.

[alittlerespectgoesalongway]

If the woman earns more, the man is more likely to resign- I don't see this an issue that will only affect women. We're expecting 20% of the workforce to resign for childcare reasons at my place and I suspect it will be roughly equal in terms of male and female.

But unless you're walking around with your head in the clouds you ca surely see that regardless of what happens at your work, in general, this will disproportionately affect women? A single case study is neither here nor there.

[Drivingdownthe101]

If the woman earns more, the man is more likely to resign- I don't see this an issue that will only affect women

No one said it will only affect women. Just that it will disproportionately affect women. And obviously we’re not just talking about your work place, but in general.
In general, women earn less. So they will be the ones to resign.
I have just got back to my career. I’ve worked damn hard to get back into what is mainly a young persons/male dominated industry after suffering severe PND. I am happy for the first time in ages. But DH earns 5 x what I do, so I will resign. We can’t pay the bills on my earnings.

[HepzibahGreen]

Or you could both reduce hours?

[Drivingdownthe101]

We could, but as he earns 5 times more than I do per day then him dropping a day would have a significantly higher impact than me dropping a day. The only way to keep me at work (if I have to homeschool for a significant period) would be to sell the house. Which we may do, who knows? And that’s the trouble, we have no idea what will happen.

[Drivingdownthe101]

Plus his role is a full time role and I doubt in iOS industry they would allow a reduction in days. But we will of course consider all options.

[Drivingdownthe101]

*his

[alittlerespectgoesalongway]

Drivingdown. You have explained this well. I also worry that many of the poorer paid people who will end up giving up their work if schools remain shut are the keyworkers we have been relying on. If their more highly paid OH's come out of furlough and go back to work and there is still no childcare available, I think we could all be in trouble.

[DisneyMillie]

It’s generally the case too that businesses are run by men (obviously not all but in my job I see a lot of companies in a lot of sectors and nearly all directors are men). They are generally not as agreeable to men taking time off to look after children compared to women. It’s ingrained sexism in our society.

My dh asked to leave ONE hour early once or twice a week in his old job to help with pickups from nursery. He offered to cut his pay - despite already working more than contracted hours. (Construction industry). He got told it just wasn’t the done thing to ask for such things and maybe he should have a word with his wife about whose job was important. And this was from a nationwide firm who brag about their staff wellbeing initiatives.

I absolutely think it will impact women more than men.