Track and Trace

[sunglasses123]

So once T&T is up and running and you get a notification that you have been in close contact with someone with CV19. You could be bleeped all the time especially if you are meeting your family which I believe is one of the highest risks and one of them has it Passing someone within 2 metres in a supermarket has little risk.

If for example its the winter and you are due to go on holiday, get married, go to a funeral etc and you are told to isolate then why would some people even get the app if they thought they would be stopped from doing something pre booked/arranged.

I see the younger people even less likely to have the track and trace because even if they had it they are likely to have symptons.

Or do we think its likely that its only with severe cases with a huge viral load given to you that will result in you being asked to self isolate.

I work at home most of the time anyway so this wouldnt be a big issue for me (unless I was about to go on holiday - I suspect your travel insurance would not cover you for this scenario) but for others I can envisage huge concerns going forward.

[NELass]

roseandrose

If you get contacted, it will only be because you’ve came in close contact with someone. The app won’t have had anything to do with it. The person who has tested positive, will have gave your details. That’s it. It’s not a conspiracy.

[user1471448556]

Why can’t we use the Apple version which doesn’t hold data centrally and just facilitates communication between devices without sending data to Cummings and co? Germany are going with that and they seem to know what they’re doing.

[pfrench]

I'm not touching anything linked with this government.

[The80sweregreat]

Gosh, 'stay at home' caused enough havoc. This will be even more confusing I think.

[antisocialdistance]

@RoseAndRose

Because I'm be mightily pissed off if I was told to isolate because someone tested positive who worked for a totally different organisation, with whom we shared no common parts (other than a dividing wall, which happened to have a desk by it on both sides.

You wouldn't be told to isolate under those circumstances. Track-and-trace systems are based on trained human contact tracers working to identify realistic risks from known infections to other members of the public. An app with Bluetooth is a supplement to this process, but not the be-all and end-all. What would happen is that you would have a conversation with someone who would outline the circumstances of the infection that you may have been exposed to, so that the two of you can work out if you are at risk.

You can lie your head off to the contact tracer if you like, but the main people you will be harming by doing that will be yourself and the people you are in close contact with.

[ARudeTerriblePerson]

What enforcement powers do the contact tracers have?

[antisocialdistance]

Contact tracers don't have enforcement powers, departments of public health do.

[Laniakea]

there aren't going to be tens of thousands of people suddenly told to isolate.

Today there were 2000 (ish) cases identified - I assume tomorrow will be similar - the majority of those people will have been social distancing & the only people they've had close & prolonged contact with will be their households - that's the end of that infection path. The minority of people who due to their jobs or whatever have not been able to socially distance will then work with the T&T callers to identify the contacts they've had that pose a risk of infection ... not simply crossing someone's path.

This is what public health has done forever ... since we first figured out what causes infections. It's bread & butter & good practice and as numbers drop fewer people will be advised to isolate. It does require civic mindedness & honestly & there may well be cases where an infected person has neither but there's really not much alternative.

The app is a different thing altogether & not even in use!

It's ironic (depressing) that people have been screaming we need T&T for months - even before lockdown & now we have it ... as we do with all notifiable diseases (the only difference being that they are far less prevalent in part due to contact tracing!) ... and people are objecting because ... why? To prove a point? To be contrary? Because Tories are wankers?

It won't be them most damaged if this gets out of control & more people die & we're in & out of lockdown & the economy/NHS/social care fall over & none of our (state educated) children learn anything for 18 months. They will be okay. We won't.

[The80sweregreat]

People will just ignore it and carry on working.

[ARudeTerriblePerson]

Contact tracers must have the power to report people to whatever powers that be?

[QueenofmyPrinces]

Im a nurse and in the morning handover we all sit together in the same room, usually about 10 (but sometimes more) for 30 minutes. We also take our breaks together in two groups of five, in our staff room.

That’s potentially a lot of staff having to go off if one person gets a positive result.

[Whatdidisay]

The whole thing is useless without an app. If someone from a packed commuter train tested positive there is no way to trace the passengers sharing the carriage!
Also the 15 minute thing is ridiculous! A simple one second cough can spread it, but under the track and trace even if I was sat next to a person coughing continually for 14 minutes i would not be contacted?

[B1rdbra1n]

If opinions on here are anything to go by it's just unworkable🙄 and yet other countries were able to make it work🤔
what are we missing🤔

[ARudeTerriblePerson]

You know what we're missing. 1. A truthful government 2. A Track and Trace App which is not crap

[B1rdbra1n]

why? To prove a point?
I hear you
but people feel insulted angry and scared, the behaviour of those at the top that makes it hard for us to trust them and it's a struggle to be at your most rational when you're gripped by strong emotions
Rocks and hard places surround us completely☹️

[HampsteadHeathen]

A lot of people seem to be trying to pick holes in the system but it doesn't need to be perfect in order to help reduce R. Every time a contact isolates early rather than only when symptoms start that has the potential to reduce the number of new infections.

[ARudeTerriblePerson]

"the behaviour of those at the top that makes it hard for us to trust them" - it would be insane to trust them.

[HampsteadHeathen]

@QueenofmyPrinces

Im a nurse and in the morning handover we all sit together in the same room, usually about 10 (but sometimes more) for 30 minutes. We also take our breaks together in two groups of five, in our staff room.

That’s potentially a lot of staff having to go off if one person gets a positive result.

Don't you mean that's a lot of people who will potentially catch covid-19 if one person is infected?

[milkysmum]

Queen- I'm a nurse too and this is my worry. In theory masks are now worn for the duration of a shift , in practice staff need to take them off regularly just to be able to breathe as it's impossible to make it through 12 hours in one. In the office, handovers, on breaks, there are so many times when the masks are off and you are still not able to be 2 m apart. Whole teams could easily be self isolating at a time?

[antisocialdistance]

People will just ignore it and carry on working.

So your friend Jim tests positive for coronavirus and identifies you as a close contact at the dinner you had together three days ago. A contact tracer calls you to inform that you are a close contact of Jim's and you are required to self-isolate or you may be fined.

You ignore this and keep working. Unfortunately you have contracted coronavirus and you pass it on to your colleague Jill.

Jill is tested and in the process of identifying her close contacts, it comes up that you sit in the cubicle next to her. It becomes obvious that you are not following your self-isolation requirement, and are therefore fined. You finally realise what a complete dickhead you have been when Jill's diabetic sister also contracts coronavirus and dies.

[B1rdbra1n]

Insane to trust them
in a general sense yes but in a more narrow sense it is in their interest and our interests to get rid of this pandemic as quickly and efficiently as possible, surely we can trust them in that narrow sense?
Can we not put aside other differences for now just to get the job done, it might not be a great option but it's better than the other one!

[B1rdbra1n]

I'm not saying we should blindly trust them, quite the opposite, we should watch them extremely closely monitor and track their every move. If they want to keep tabs on us we will keep tabs on them.

[QueenofmyPrinces]

Don't you mean that's a lot of people who will potentially catch covid-19 if one person is infected?

To be honest, I dread to think how many medical staff have it without showing any symptoms.

We test every patient/parent that is admitted to our unit, regardless of what they’ve been admitted for, and we are seeing a lot of positives in completely asymptomatic people.

These families will not have been isolated and will have been in lots of contact with other parents on the ward and many, many HCP.

I imagine it’s pretty asymptomatically rife amongst NHS staff.

[B1rdbra1n]

If there are high numbers of asymptomatic carriers surely it's going to be very hard to get rid of?
Except over countries have managed it so it must be possible 🤔

[spotlighton]

So would DC have to isolate (and his family) if he was in contact with someone who tested positive?
Or are we still doing the one rule the them, one rule for us?
If I tested positive I know all the people I have spoken to in the last 2 weeks, I would text them, but I'm not giving any more info to a gov department. My boss might still ask me to come to work anyway, and I need the money so I would go. (We SD at work and I drive there alone).
Sorry DC has blow the trust out of the water.