Should masks be mandatory on public transport for the time being?

[jobhunter7]

Discuss.

They have done this in France, Italy, Germany, Spain, Netherlands, Belgium, Austria...

Yes.

No mask, no ride...unless you have a medical exemption.

Only if they are supplied at the station on production of a valid ticket. They should be mass produced and built into the ticket price.

Absolutely.

It would seem rather silly on my local trains & buses which are completely empty

If we accept that wearing a mask protects others more than the mask wearer, then you should still be wearing a mask even on an empty train. Because the mask prevents moisture from your mouth and nose settling on surfaces that later passengers will touch.

I'm not convinced that a mask protects only other people. When I tried going shopping in a mask I found that I touched my mouth and nose much less than normal - the mask stopped me and made me aware of what I was doing. So my mask could protect me from other people's virus-laden exhalations settled on surfaces that I had touched.

The thing is, how do you enforce it?

How do you prevent people who can't wear a mask (for example patients with asthma - 1 in 12 adults - have been advised they don't have to wear one if they find it impedes their breathing) from being refused services, or being subjected to being policed by members of the public?

Only a small minority of asthma patients will have severe asthma which makes them extremely vulnerable and are therefore shielding. Those with mild or moderate asthma may well be made to go to work, which in many cases, involves public transport.

Other people will struggle with masks for other reasons - PTSD, learning disabilities, sensory issues etc.

If they are made mandatory then there needs to be a good public campaign which also highlights that not everyone can wear a mask.

Otherwise the type of people who challenge blue badge holders they don't think look disabled enough, or who refuse to admit guide dogs into shops, cafes or taxis, will have a field day challenging people who don't wear a mask on public transport.

I should like to point out that I actually said:

"People whose breathing is so bad that they cannot wear a mask should perhaps not be on public transport for the time being anyhow"

The for the time being anyhow is important. We all have our choices curtailed at the moment, and those in the shielded group - who might also be no more likely to catch it - have to stay off public transport for the general good (not just their own benefit)

Yes it sucks when you have a medical conditions which means you have to have a greater amount of restriction than the majority, but for the time being anyhow people have to do this, and millions already are. Those who cannot wear masks need to realise that exceptions are not being made on medical grounds to public health measures. People are already having to forego activities until it is safe for both the public at large and the individual.

This isn't a case of being unaware or unsympathetic. I have every sympathy for those who find their lives have one more limited the come good. I's all too easy, as some are literally out of sight for the time being, but as the numbers have been growing, not decreasing, as we move through the pandemic; the contribution that public health measures require off them (in forfeiting of life open to others) needs more recognition

@FeedMeSantiago

The thing is, how do you enforce it?

I guess you look at how other countries have handled things.

Without public transport many people would struggle to get to work

If some people can’t use a mask they should Still be Able to access public transport

If masks are the way forward then i would prefer that allowances are made for those unable to wear them

@RufustheLanglovingreindeer

Without public transport many people would struggle to get to work

I think this is a good argument for masks. If people don't want to wear masks in many other circumstances, you can simply avoid each other.

If some people can’t use a mask they should Still be Able to access public transport. If masks are the way forward then i would prefer that allowances are made for those unable to wear them

They have medical exemptions in many countries.

People aren’t taking public transport for fun. I’m sure if someone with breathing issues had the choice to wfh or be furloughed, they’d take that choice.

Unfortunately the “choice” for many is go to work even if it means using public transport, or lose your job and go hungry and at risk of eviction.

People aren’t taking public transport for fun.

Thats what i thought when boris said dont use it to get to work if you dont need to. Who catches a bus to work if they dont need to?!

Yes of course they should. It was only our government saying they shouldn't that causes the confusion as they didn't have supplies for NHS.

Non surgical grade are not going to prevent you from getting it but it will REDUCE the chances of it spreading. So definitely should be worn

job

Just want to clarify (cos I’m paranoid)

I think its a good idea that face masks are used on public transport...but i do worry that if someone is UNABLE to wear a mask that there would be a risk (if mandatory) that they wouldn’t be allowed on, or would have people having a pop at them

I appreciate that exemptions would be made for medical reasons...but that wouldn’t stop people having a pop

Yes, I think they should be mandatory on crowded public transport. Not necessary if there is one person in the carriage. I don't use public transport, but would wear one if I did.

I can't understand why wearing one to help minimise the risk is called into question all the time. And yes, I've read research about the effectiveness and take from this:

"The evidence on the use of face coverings is limited, however they may be of some benefit when worn in enclosed public places where it's more difficult to follow social distancing rules.

The European Centre for Disease Prevention and Control(ECDC) has said that the use of face coverings in public places may reduce the spread of infection in the community when worn by people who might not realise they’re infected. This is why some countries are encouraging people to wear them in public places.

So, face coverings don't protect you; they protect others you may come into contact with, if you have the virus and don't realise it yet."

Discuss

No

@RufustheLanglovingreindeer

Disabled have badges for cards. I am not sure if it would be easy to prove or not you were exempt? I am not sure if people would have a pop or not. One would hope not. Again I guess you could look at how things have been done in other countries.

Should read 'for cars'

There is some research out today that surgical masks (the cheap ones) cut transmission rates by 75%. Not yet peer reviewed but looks promising. I’m pretty sure our pathetic ‘follow the science’ will catch up in a month or so when our R rate is back up

Actively encouraged? Definitely. Legally mandated? Absolutely not.

Sadly this situation has shown that there are quite a number of people who like to report their neighbours or make nasty comments on social media without knowing the full facts of a situation.

Mask wearing would give them a further opportunity.

I'm not saying I'm against masks being used especially on public transport. I suppose it's more a comment on how disillusioned I feel that there are so many people in this country who seem to have the "I'm telling" mindset.

For those who can’t wear them where they are mandated in stores, on public transport or in the workplace here in California, you simply carry a medical exemption letter or card. But there’ll always be those who have to make things as unnecessarily difficult as possible because being an asshole about it makes them feel better or some such. Let’s face it no one likes wearing them. No one. We do it though because it’s a necessary evil right now and, you know what, come cold and flu season I for one will continue to do it as will many others who formerly rolled their eyes.

Yes. People with medical or psychological etc reasons why they cannot wear one, should be excused and should get a card for their wallets and display if they are challenged. Quite easy to make s digital card form that people can print and cut out.

I know some people will not like the idea of feeling conspicuous, but the evidence that mask-wearing cuts transmission of the virus is now very strong. We need to do this because we need a way out of lockdown, and there is no way out of lockdown that does not involve widespread masking. I am afraid that this needs to take priority right now.

"Those who cannot wear masks need to realise that exceptions are not being made on medical grounds to public health measures."

They are being made.

Sadly this situation has shown that there are quite a number of people who like to report their neighbours or make nasty comments on social media without knowing the full facts of a situation. Mask wearing would give them a further opportunity.

Look, you could use that kind of logic to argue against having any rules, ever.

"You can't have social distancing because someone might get the wrong end of the stick and report someone who is actually a nurse in plain clothes!!!"

"You can't ask people to stay in the house when they develop a suspicious cough, because someone might get the wrong end of the stick and report someone who is coughing for a legitimate reason, like long-term asthma!!!"

Well.... yes, they might do, and there were a few cases of this actually happening. But we still have to have the social distancing rules and no-going-out-when-you-are-showing COVID19-symptoms rules, for goodness' sake. They are important rules that save lives.

When the government issues instructions to wear masks (which they will do, believe me, at some point), this needs to be accompanied by clear instructions that there are a few people who cannot wear them for genuine reasons.

People are more sensible than you think. We did have some thread a while back, where a poster was moaning about "OMG there was this coughing man in the supermarket, how dare he go out??" Her post was followed by about 3,528 replies all pointing out that "actually, some people have long-term coughs that have nothing to do with COVID19, they do have the right to go out, you know. Don't jump to conclusions." Most people are sensible and understand the situation.

Yes. Anywhere you’re within 2m of someone else. If the bus is empty, take it off once you’re past the driver, replace it if someone else gets on near you. My Mask Protects You, Your Mask Protects Me.