This protective ‘bubble’ of small groups in schools. How will it work in secondary schools?

[Reastie]

I just don’t get it. I understand the logic of primary schools where children can spend their whole school day with one teacher for all lessons. I see the government are using language like ‘bubble’ and ‘family’ to build confidence with parents to encourage their children to go back to school when they reopen.

What I don’t get is how their main protective mechanism of keeping small groups of school children separate from each other to stop spread could possibly work at secondary where they have a different teacher for each subject and move around school for each subject. I see that they could reduce spread by each group staying in the same classroom and having teachers come to them to teach rather than they go to the teachers in their rooms, but logistically this will be impossible with different children in different sets and different options for different GCSE subjects meaning they have many different groups of students for different subjects.

So is the school bubble thing at secondary just a load of air to help parents feel better? Will students have core lessons in school in September in the same groups and option subjects taught at home online? Will they just continue to move around schools and narrow school corridors to different subjects but it’s ok because they know they need to wash their hands? Genuinely wondering how this protective bubble mechanism they are so keen to sell will work at secondary.

Not sure in Primary schools how it will work with toilets. We will walk down in a bubble, but then I am supposed to clean them afterwards. 6 toilets and a urinal in two rooms (boys and girls). Who will be watching my bubble children while that happens?

In my school we're looking at just getting the Yr 10s back from 1st June and finishing at 1pm or 1.30pm so we don't have to manage a lunchbreak. Our cooks are currently furloughed and that is unlikely to change. We're also looking at having children on some kind of rota and moving staff rather than children, but we still need to look at the issue of moving/cleaning resources and protecting teachers who will all be using the same computers etc. It really is a minefield. If only the Government had consulted teachers before deciding on June 1st.

The Govt, right from the start, put a protective arm/bubble around Care homes, so really, we have nothing to worry about.

It seems ridiculous, my Dd is year 10, she’s doing a full school day from home everyday. What is the point of going in to school & actually doing less than she is at home or sitting in a class with the wrong teacher?
Why are we putting teachers & kids at risk for something that shows no gain at all?

In my school we're looking at just getting the Yr 10s back from 1st June and finishing at 1pm or 1.30pm so we don't have to manage a lunchbreak. Our cooks are currently furloughed and that is unlikely to change. We're also looking at having children on some kind of rota and moving staff rather than children, but we still need to look at the issue of moving/cleaning resources and protecting teachers who will all be using the same computers etc. It really is a minefield. If only the Government had consulted teachers before deciding on June 1st.

And that is fantastic until you begin to consider how it will work for the different options children take.

Our school has said that focus will be on core, but then comes the next issue...I’m not a maths, English or science teacher. I don’t know the curriculum and it’s been 24 years since I studied those subjects myself.
I teach DT, woods, metals and plastics. I would have no idea what to teach for GCSE core, or how to teach it. I could probably get away with covering this for KS3, but GCSE, no chance.

I think the 'bubble' only refers to primary.

If you have a secondary school which only goes up to Y11, and you only have Y10s in, as per the guidance, then that is only a fifth of the school population. Then, you could split them into two halves and have them come in alternate weeks so that class sizes are smaller. There is nothing in the guidance that says Y10s have to be in full time.

So each cohort could have three weeks of lessons before summer.

That's just off the top of my head. No doubt the unions will try to sabotage that though.

Fivefoot so are you saying that the year 10a have normal sets and lessons just smaller class sizes?
So, if inevitably, a student or teacher tests positive, then every set and teacher that has been in contact with them in a lesson (hour long in an enclosed poorly ventilated room so some risk of infection) has to self isolate? Or just carry on?
Students will be in a different set for English, than for maths, than for science plus different options - so potentially 8 different classes and teachers they will have had contact with?

It’s not supposed to work. Government has given up. We’re all just expected to get it and hope for the best now.

The bubble thing is fine if you have one child

Add in a family of 7 kids and the whole thing falls apart.

Year 10s are not going to be in normal sets and classes. That isn’t practical and is why the government have phrased it very carefully as some “face to face contact” to supplement continued online learning. They have not once used the word “teach” when referring to those year groups. The unions aren’t sabotaging anything... the government is not asking secondary schools to teach a normal timetable to year 10 and 12, or even teach them at all. That isn’t what the time in school is meant to be for. It’s to assess what needs to be in place to support them learning from home.
The bubbles are needed to prevent everything having to shut down if someone tests positive once contact tracing is in place.

We're planning core subjects only. About 10 or so to a group. Its unlikely to be normal teachers for the classes due to all the time timetabling issues highlighted above. We're going to be essentially supporting students with the home learning we intend to continue to set.

So more supporting their independent work rather than teaching. If your child is doing well/accessing the work from home and is able/happy emailing/remotely to their current teacher with questions etc. then I wouldn't personally send them in.

However, it will provide a supportive space for students struggling more with the home learning...of course assuming those ones turn up!

It is extraordinary foolish and premature of secondary heads to plan anything when there has been NO guidance yet for older pupils. You would think they had learnt from primary that any plans they make would have to be ripped up and redone multiple times....

To answer the OP ; I have no clue. It baffles me.

fivefoot you ideas are based on an unusual thing there, though , or the smallest imaginable.

Some areas have upper schools. Year 10 and 13 there is 2/5 of the school population. A typical upper school year 10 could be 350- 420 kids!

There is nothing so far that suggest the government expect them all in being taught.

I am a secondary teacher and have a child in year 10. I think the idea of getting yr 10 /12 in sounds good on paper until you unpick it and realise they won’t be getting any proper lessons for all the reasons already discussed. For my own child who is working well at home, going into school and having the online provision reduced as teachers are back in the school building, is educationally worse than the current situation. In my view it would be more sensible to get yr 7 and 8 in - children of an age parents might be more reluctant to leave home alone when they go back to work. It is easier to find things to keep younger year groups busy and less pressure to hurtle through content . Our current provision for key worker’s kids is mind numbingly dull because we just supervise them doing the online work. It also brought home to me that social distancing just won’t work with kids - even with less than 10 to supervise- and that it is disingenuous to suggest it is a realistic option. I think our school will be targeting the 20 or so year 10s who have refused for engage with the online content and then students from the most disadvantaged or troubled homes. That will be a tricky cohort of kids to manage , particularly through a very dull school day.

My son for example year 10, has a grade estimate for a F in RE

Do you think he’s engaged in that as an online learning subject? Is he likely to pass without knowledgable fully qualified teachers?

Seems pointless

They need to look at predicated grades and reduce the lessons

I’m guessing secondary won’t need bubbles because they’re old enough to stay 2 m apart

@Cathpot I couldn't agree more, so nice to hear from a teacher and parent. I see no benefit in sending DS in if he can't do normal lessons and can't socialise with his friends. We're doing ok at home, it's extremely stressful (for me, not him) but I'd rather just continue as we are.

It won’t

This social distancing crap is over when schools go back.

was that irony daisy or said in earnest??

Dd's school teach GCSEs over 3 years so they will need to think about their Y9s too. I can't imagine how it can be done safely or usefully.

I agree with cathpot too.

I think the answer is that it won't be normal school or teaching or anything close to it.

It won't be possible to run the usual classes with them having their usual teacher and socially distance. Therefore, as their usual teacher can only teach a smaller number socially distanced, that will probably go out of the window. As they are with different students for each lesson it won't be possible to do more than possibly 1 lesson with usual classmates in a day.

What might happen is large numbers in something like the hall (socially distanced) receiving info about 1 subject per day before going home - probably just getting 1 meeting per subject before the summer. This isn't teaching - it's information giving.

So school might specify 1 or possibly 2 subjects per day which will be covered and they would come in just for those and then go home.

The idea that it will be lots of lessons for each subject per week just won't be possible.

I'd suggest that educationally it might achieve less than remote learning, especially in areas where schools have provided decent remote learning, but now might be less able to if lots of staff are in school.

I think we have to resign ourselves to the reality that actual, useful teaching in person, as we know it,mis not going to be happening. It's a bit of a filler until the summer.

Currently there's a lot of moaning about provision from parents. I'd think the moaning will grow hugely when the reality of what can actually be provided becomes clear and lots of people might become more positive about remote learning rather than making the journey into school for a short period of something which really might not be very valuable.

Some independents are looking at 2 weeks of remote exams for the 2 weeks after half term, followed by 2 weeks in school for feedback (couple of subjects per day to reduce mixing) and then they will be breaking up as they finish early July. But they've been teaching live lessons and completed the curriculum they would have covered if in school anyway. The only things missed out on really will weeks of trips or enrichment type stuff which often come at the end of term.

@daisymay133

I wish that was true, but actually year 10’s are notorious for thinking they know best and that they are invincible. Nothing is more important than their friends and the latest gossip/drama, that’s cooked up over Snapchat whilst they’ve been off.
The reality is that they will find it as difficult to socially distance than younger children.

I’m guessing secondary won’t need bubbles because they’re old enough to stay 2 m apar

Thanks I needed a laugh after this last week.

Secondary heads have been told to start planning and there is guidance that applies to all settings, not just primary schools. Including advice that says “ensure that children and young people (so colleges and sixth forms too, where some year 12s who are repeating could be 18) are in small groups at all times and different groups are not mixing during the day or on subsequent days.”

We’ve planned for a very limited programme (each year 10 or 12 child will only come to school for a few days between now and July) with a social bubble model in place. They will do some study skills and wellbeing activities and UCAS prep for year 12. They will have set seats in a set room with a set teacher for the duration of the programme and we’ll be checking what additional support they need to support their home learning. All of the staff will be volunteers with nobody asked to come in unless they are 100% comfortable.

I’m really glad my HT isn’t waiting for the government advice. So far it’s always been issued too late and has been too vague. We didn’t wait for the government to tell us to close and have been planning for our return programme since well before the government announced schools would reopen in June. We’ll obviously adapt it, or scrap it altogether if advice changes, but waiting for the government to issue clear and reasonable guidelines seems very optimistic to me.