I'm finding the reaction to covid utterly bizarre

[TheDailyCarbuncle]

If anyone had told me that healthy, fit people would willingly put their livelihoods at risk and deny their children an education for months on end, that they would send the country into recession putting healthcare, education and public services at risk for years and years to come to avoid getting a disease that had a very very small chance of killing them I wouldn't have believed it. If you'd said people would be afraid to talk to their healthy siblings I wouldn't have believed it.

I had measles in the 1980s as small child - the vaccination programme where I lived was slow to get off the ground - and it nearly killed me. In 1980 2.6 million people worldwide died of measles, a very large proportion of them children. No one ever considered a lockdown, it was never even suggested.

I think all the analysis of this situation in the coming years won't be about the pandemic, but about the contagion of fear that made people so terrified of something that wasn't a real threat to them that they created huge, long-lasting, in some cases devastating problems for themselves, problems that were nothing to do with their virus and everything to do with their reaction to the virus.

@bumbleymummy, as far as my employer is concerned I'm not at any increased risk, so yes I have to behave as if that's true bit I don't believe it.

I don't believe the deep recession is caused by lockdown

I do believe there will be s deep recession, but if anything the controlled supported lockdown is likely to make it less severe than it would have been without lockdown

Yes it’s beyond ridiculous that we should have listened to health experts who have studied for years and lead their field. Let’s just turn to the mumsnet experts instead

Indeed. TheDailyCarbuncle says it's safe, so we should just ignore it, lift all restrictions and go back to normal.

What are we waiting for! TheDailyCarbuncle said so!

I think that in order to get the adhere to the lockdown, the fear had to be put out there.

or common sense which was, and still is, enough for most people...

Agree with @EarringsandLipstick

@OneOfTheHerd I think it’s far lower. I think the antibody tests will find a large section of the population have had the disease very mildly with limited/ no symptoms and this will bring the mortality rate down.

@mathanxiety you presumed my family is healthy. They are not. My mother is 72, lives alone and has various health conditions. She is very weak.

I haven't been able to see her for three months.

aside from supposed hysteria, we need to comply with lockdown and gradual release from lockdown, it is a new virus, i am most concerned about september.

@OneOfTheHerd all of the evidence suggests a death rate of well below 1%

In New York, they estimate the 2.7 million people have been infected - and that's probably a low estimate.

The have 22,000 deaths, which is a death rate of about 0.8%. That includes elderly people and people with serious conditions.

I’ve noticed that for the people who declare their commitment to lockdown is because they care about others, there is no engagement with regards to the real and awful problems people are experiencing because of it.
These problems are simply dismissed as inconveniences or minimised as not as important as potential COVID deaths.
It’s the opposite of caring for others.

Get back to school though. the teachers are not at a high risk, they are not exactly on the front line, working in critical care or in nursing homes

I don't think we agree with the point of lockdown op. It's not about the young, fit and healthy doing all that stuff you said to avoid getting it - it's about trying to avoid a situation where many, many old / vulnerable people are all needing treatment at the same time

One of the consequences of medical advances - an aging population and numerous treatment options for a myriad of diseases that we would otherwise not have survived but which now make us very vulnerable to new illnesses such as this.

@starfro Do you have a link to the study those figures came from please?

@MyHipsDontLieUnfortunately but she wasn’t saying that you should go back to work. She was saying the very very low risk people should be able to.

^I don't believe the deep recession is caused by lockdown

I do believe there will be s deep recession, but if anything the controlled supported lockdown is likely to make it less severe than it would have been without lockdown^

@feetfreckles why do you believe this? That's a genuine question.

Lockdown meant that businesses had to close even if none of the staff were sick. So instead of the virus causing the shutdown of businesses, the lockdown did. Even if the virus would never have caused the economy to collapse, lockdown has done it anyway. So instead of the risk of economic collapse from a virus, we have definite economic collapse from a lockdown. Do you see how completely mad that is? To create the situation you're afraid of, even if you don't know whether it'll happen or not?

I know someone who died of Covid. She was 84 and totally ignored all the advice choosing to carry on as normal. Some may say she was stupid but maybe she just refused to waste what may have been a very large period of her remaining life being lonely and isolated.
Life is for living and is always full of risk. Our nanny state and snowflake mentality has meant that we have lost the plot over this situation.
Watching the back to school debate I am seriously worried about the younger generation as we go forward. They are going to be very damaged by the social distancing measures. Health anxiety will have far reaching problems for this generation.

@mrpumblechook how many young people have been seriously ill from Covid in hospital? Do you have any facts and data on this?

www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.04.23.20076042v1

Page 15 shows ages of people hospitalised. I don't think the proportion of younger people is negligible at all. Most have survived but that doesn't mean they won't have long-term health complications.

One of the consequences of medical advances

Another is premature babies living.

^I’ve noticed that for the people who declare their commitment to lockdown is because they care about others, there is no engagement with regards to the real and awful problems people are experiencing because of it.
These problems are simply dismissed as inconveniences or minimised as not as important as potential COVID deaths.
It’s the opposite of caring for others.^

Can you say this louder for the people in the back @HelloMissus.

The 'I care about others' brigade only care about others when covid is involved. If the others are losing their jobs, or being abused, or dying from a lack of treatment for other illnesses or are seeing their mental health destroyed from lockdown, fuck them. They are just collateral damage, totally necessary casualties.

I am working through this virus, at my place of work. I take the precautions that are mandated where I live - I wear a mask, and I wear gloves when doing my essential shopping. No other shopping is permitted. Some shops have stopped taking cash. The entire point of a lockdown is to reduce risk. Some people haven't grasped that the risk is real - risk to yourself and risk to others to whom you could transmit the virus despite being asymptomatic or experiencing only mild symptoms.

The idea that anyone should laugh in the face of this virus or toughen up and face our fears for the sake of this or that industry in a country that voted for Brexit would be laughable if it weren't so tragically lacking in self awareness and awareness of how cutting yourself off from a massive trading bloc next door will affect the economy for generations to come, and sorry, but the idea that governments are manipulating populations, that governments are groups of people ruling over us, and that there are ulterior motives behind lockdowns is pure comedy gold.

What is bullshit of the highest quality though is the concern for the financial burden on future generations if the nervous nellies don't get over themselves, send the future generations to school so that they can get infected by their classmates, the children of hcps, etc can free up the parents to go to work and save other people's industries, pensions, etc.

Yeah, cos for people with limited empathy it is difficult to care for more than one group of people at the same time.

And for people with limited common sense it is difficult to look at a complex problem space and choose a solution that aims to provide the least harm to the greatest number of people

And I would add that while very small numbers of children are killed by covid, much larger numbers will be killed by lockdown. Children will be the ones who'll pay the price of unemployment and lack of education and healthcare, lack of opportunities and lack of money for services.

They are the ones that are going to have to learn in schools that have no funding. They are the ones who are going to have a healthcare system that is decimated due to lack of funds.

Op:
If you are generally healthy, especially if you are under 45, you should not be afraid of covid.

Also op:
You are unlikely to be affected by the virus - you may not get it, but if you do you may have no symptoms

So, as per your thinking, a 35 year old gets it, they're fine and have no symptoms so have no idea there even got it.
They trot off too work in a bank, an office, a care home. They don't know they've got it after all so why shouldn't they?
Unfortunately they pass it on, their colleagues have an undoagnosed lung disorder.
Unfortunately they pass it on, their colleague lives with elderly parents.
Unfortunately they pass it on, their colleague has a child that's just gone back to school with 14 other kids, a teacher and a TA.

It's seems this is what people forget.
If OP got it, a healthy person, not know and unknowingly give it others that aren't healthy, those people could end up seriously ill and dead. So? fuck the unhealthy ones that OP may come into contact with? Is that the solution?

A virus doesn't miraculously appear in towns, cities, care homes. It's taken there by carriers. So every single person that has died has caught it, often unknowingly, from someone else. That's why stay at home was to stop the spread.

You can't just say healthy people will be fine so fuck the unhealthy they come into contact with or are connected too.

@CaliforniaMountainSnake I was reading a couple of articles. They said that after Coronavirus, people will be less willing to have a government (a small group of elite people ruling over them), and that more people will want the power devolved to the counties in the UK. And that it will be a more humanitarian and caring approach. So for example, everyone in Devon will take care of everyone in Devon.

The old styleof government was corrupt and was hurting everyone. Remember the government were just human beings like ourselves, and they have been making uncaring and bad decisions for a long time. we gave them way too much power

The economic problems caused by Brexit can now handily be hidden behind coronavirus though...