Has the government got paid posters here to quash any dissenting voices?

[ssd]

There's always been robust discussions on politics on mn, but I've noticed lately when ever someone questions the government's track record on covid, certain posters pop up with very similar agendas, defending them to the hilt and trying to throw the discussion round to something else.

I'd like to see when posters actually joined mn, some newer posters must spend all their time on here defending the indefensible.

[ITonyah]

My god I think some of you think a little too much about yourself

Absolutely.

[TheHoneyBadger]

For example who in reality would want their young children to go back into a filthy environment that hadn't been deep cleaned for years without any explanation as to when they were going to be cleaned, to what level, by who, with what materials etc. Yet somehow questions about these issues get steered into 'those lazy fucking bastards are still getting paid you know, they're not doing anything, they're sat on their fat arses watching telly and seem to think they're special.

Either that implies serious steering of focus or people really are that bizarre and petty that they'd rather slag off a group they don't like than ask questions about the basic safety of their children.

[Utterlydespairing]

itonyah

Very well said.

[myangelalex]

Just like multiple posts criticising the government with no acknowledgement this is a global issue with unprecedented difficulties faced by most governments?

The most critical post clearly have a political bias, and party politics are not helpful at this time

The time for critical analysis is when a more normal life returns, and then we can learn lessons, and plan better for the next time.

[BaileysforBreakfast]

itonya It stands to reason there are going to be many posters supportive of the government.

Sufficient numbers of people supported Johnson & Co to get them elected, but does that mean they then have to support every bit of confused and confusing nonsense that comes out of the PM's mouth, or support every single policy he pursues even if it leads to deaths? Is that what you mean by 'supportive'? Because to me that smacks of partisanship and a lack of critical thinking.

[Nameofchanges]

I don’t think was supposed to be about party politics. It isn’t about party politics or the government’s popularity.

It is about wanting to influence the public to agree to certain steps they want to take during the pandemic.

[TheHoneyBadger]

Are you serious myangelalex? The time for critical thinking is after tens of thousands have died and normal life resumes? I could not disagree more.

[ITonyah]

I don't know which posters you are talking about specifically, but probably lots of people aren't hugely confused about anything really. I'm not. Schools don't apply to me, I run a business which has been successfully socially distancing for weeks. The furlough scheme has been absolutely amazing for us, I almost cried when the Chancellor announced it.

I do think lockdown should have happened a bit earlier, Cheltenham shouldn't have happened and BJ was an arse saying he was going to carry on shaking hands.

Testing would be good but apart from that it all seems like common sense.

If you don't understand what you can or can't do then it's safest to stay at home.

[Bluntness100]

Totally op 🤣

[TheHoneyBadger]

A massive building has a fire starting on the ground floor - should we think critically about it now to tackle it and prevent it taking out the whole building and potentially neighbouring buildings? Nah. The time for critical thinking is after the street has burnt down and the fire has gone out. COAB

[ssd]

I take it back, they're coming out the woodwork...

[TheHoneyBadger]

lots of people aren't hugely confused about anything really. I'm not. Schools don't apply to me

This is issue - it's clear for everyone except schools because the advice is consistent for all workplaces except schools. Saying, it's clear other than the bit on schools is like saying the building is wonderful except for the foundation having no structural integrity.

malesh! mafishmishkela!

[FiveFootTwoEyesOfBlue]

Hello - who won the election? 14 million people voted Tory in December! You think none of those people read or post on MN, and anyone who disagrees with you must be paid by the government? I've heard some ridiculous paranoid conspiracy theories, but that takes the biscuit.

[LazyFace]

I haven't. But I'm jobless at the moment.... just sayin'

[TheCanterburyWhales]

Ssd - aren't they just.

Chardonnay- I was thinking about Claig when I opened this thread. Claig was many things, and very definitely a Tory voter. The difference between Claig and the shills hanging around these days is that Claig could argue a point and was consistent. And posted on lots of topics, not just politics. She also admired Tony Benn. I remember discussing him with her more than once.

You can be from two completely opposing sides of the political divide and still have a civilised conversation. And then you have the shills scattergunning the boards at election time, at Brexit and then now.

[TheHoneyBadger]

Claig was here for YEARS and totally consistent in her posting and to be fair to her raised some interesting points especially, if i'm not mixing her up with someone else, in challenging left wing feminists in their assumption that left wing parties supported them and the right was automatically the nemesis to feminist issues. She made me question my assumptions and in recent times, seeing labour fall all over themselves to say there's no such thing as being female and women have no right to single sex spaces, her words might seem prophetic.

Comparing her or Xenia (again totally consistent since at least 2008) to incoming trolls is silly.

Has Claig left then? Been banned? I've been away for a long time and haven't posted under my original and most established username for even longer.

[FliesandPies]

If they're being paid the Govt is getting ripped off - the ones I see are so utterly predictable and tedious they aren't helping matters at all.

[TheHoneyBadger]

It's bizarre actually - in the last couple of years watching the left betray women and finding myself in the bizarre position of my interests in terms of single sex spaces for example being better represented by the right and finding myself no longer believing in left and right as valid categories let alone being able to cast them in black/white good/bad categories I've found myself remembering posters like that back in the heyday of fwr.

I've found myself thinking god I wish I could have a conversation with them now. AND realising that they weren't wrong when they said that people on the right tended to be more open and willing to discuss and debate their viewpoints than the left (I thought that was bollocks at the time). Having since witnessed no platforming of feminist scholars or in fact anyone who didn't 100% conform to dominant left views and seeing the complete absence of reason debate across the aisle, or perspectives or whatever you want to call it, I've really missed those discussions and the posters who were willing to be the counterweight and challenge despite being vastly outnumbered.

[TheHoneyBadger]

anyone else from fwr here? That was claig wasn't it who used to challenge the idea that you couldn't be feminist and right wing?

We all knew that all political parties were basically male led and male centred etc but I don't think we'd grasped at that point that actually leftist men were in some ways more misogynistic than men on the right.

Sure men on the right in the US want to control women's reproductive rights (I don't think they're fussed here so long as they don't have to pay for the abortions), but the labour party has basically told all women who don't wholeheartedly support the eradication of sex based rights are heretics, bigots and fascists who should be expelled from the party.

Aware this is a tangent but it's also NOT because we are kind of talking about worthwhile disagreement and debate versus trolling and disingenuous derailing.

[ITonyah]

Yes that was claig.

[Piggywaspushed]

It's not a complete tangent (although I think we would disagree on aspects of feminism!) because what do many many teachers have in common, especially primary teachers?

And what dot he majority of school leaders, both within schools and organisationally have in common??

Hmmm

And what are most careworkers and nurses?

It is true that death rates are highest amongst largely male bus drivers, security guards etc. : but I wonder if death rates weren't higher in the make sex anyway whether that would be still the case.

[Piggywaspushed]

I am sure there was a point to that post but I did think I was on a different board!

[TheCanterburyWhales]

I haven't seen Claig for ages. Maybe namechanged, maybe moved on.
We discussed once how we'd like to lock Tony Benn and Ann Widdecomb in a room and watch.

[TheHoneyBadger]

Ahh yes - it might have been you earlier who used the term, 'pregnant people'? It bothered me but I took a deep breath and moved on because shared interests of women are in my opinion bigger than disagreements. If that wasn't you and I've misinterpreted your, 'we would disagree on aspects of feminism' comment I apologise.

Yes - funnily enough nurses, primary school teachers, carers are predominated by one particular biological marker. The one job outside of that has been badly hard hit - bus drivers - happens to male dominated and surprise surprise way more outrage and concern and shock about them being hard hit.

Carers, teachers, nurses are expected to get on with it because they are expected to be more caring, more self sacrificing, more conforming than everyone else. If they demand basic workers rights they are uppity, aggressive, heartless, selfish.

No wider theme playing out here at all is there?

Cantebury I'm wondering about your previous usernames....

[TheCanterburyWhales]

Me using the term "pregnant people"? Nope.

I was Bucharest for about ten years. Then DrankSangriaInThePark (there is a DrinkSangria now and I always go "woahhhhh did I write that?"