How would the bubble work?

[onemorepringle]

Would you have to register details? If so, where and with whom? If not, how could they realistically police it?

Government guidance says they’re considering allowing two households to join. Is there any chance it could be more? Or do you just have to pick your favourite set of parents / grandparents?

Obviously I realise that not everyone has parents (and we have six between us due to DH’s step-parents) but I just think allowing three households would allow for more situations than two.

I expect I’ll get jumped on now but I just don’t get how it’s meant to work.

I’m in NZ. Bubble concept was great here, but I think it only worked because communication was clear and simple, answers to questions were found reasonably quickly and there was pretty good compliance (90% or so).

I’m not sure it will work in the UK as people seem to either be scared or really frustrated with the lockdown. No one seems to be on the same team, which was always part of the messaging in NZ. Both of those are valid reasons and are still present in NZ, but we’ve managed to loosen restrictions and cut down cases at the right point to mitigate I think.

This is how it worked for me. I share custody with my daughter, can work from home, am not a key worker and I have a condition that is classed as vulnerable (but wouldn’t be classed in the shielded group as I understand it in the UK).

My bubble for our strictest Alert Level 4 covered me, my daughter, my ex, his wife and their daughter. They were working from home too.

I either got shopping delivered or my brother or sister shopped for me.

When we moved to Alert Level 3 a couple of weeks ago, we were able to add a person. So I added my boyfriend who I hadn’t seen for quite a few weeks. He’d not had anyone in his bubble so I could be added in later.

I’ve been doing click and collect orders for food.

At Alert Level 2 on Monday my daughter will go to school, I’ll see some of my friends in their houses, we can only have 50% of people at work at a time etc. I’ll have dinner with my family. Basically they want to be able to contact trace people as quickly as possible.

Have we done the right thing. Who actually knows at this stage? No one does. We may have made the wrong decision and will have to go through the pain of 1000s of deaths, including me as a T1 diabetic, at some point, but for right now, we haven’t. Just over 8 weeks ago this was all unimaginable.

It’s a nightmare. Not really any local households I would want to add to a bubble and see, but both teens have said they want to be able to see their bf/gf if this happens. So who do I choose, or do we just accept that it’s about minimising risk and have both???

Oh and also, I’m assuming the whole idea of the bubble is that those people would be able to mix without having to be 2m apart? Is this correct?

I think they’ll just have to very clearly spell out what the bubble is for - i.e. vulnerable people to receive help, those living alone to spend time with others, one household to provide childcare for another. It’s shouldn’t be an excuse to try and shoehorn as many family members as possible into your bubble, but a practical step to help those currently struggling within their own households. Unfortunately “British common sense” won’t allow for that nuance so those struggling will miss out thanks to those who will be rushing to have a big family get together the minute any relaxation of rules is announced.

I know it’s rubbish not being able to socialise, but for those who haven’t had a face to face adult conversation for two months some blending of households would make lockdown somewhat manageable.

I think they’ll just have to very clearly spell out what the bubble is for - i.e. vulnerable people to receive help, those living alone to spend time with others, one household to provide childcare for another.

Yes, agree so much!! It should be a specific thing for people who are alone to join a household. Targets the people who need it most whilst keeping overall risk low.

I'm really worried they'll include shared custody of children as two households already linked though. Not fair on single parents desperate for adult company, or those of us who are totally alone and want to see them... Also means one person could come and help with childcare.

I do not believe that it can work. I think public discussion of that is a good thing, so the govt realise the issues.

There are so many problems with it that, while the problems themselves may not worry the govt, the fallout of non compliance will.

House shares and flatmates...will only be able to choose one household even though they may have no friends or family in common. They will end up choosing one each. So you might have a household of four or five flatmates becoming the centre of a web linking all their contacts. Elderly grandparents who live alone but not near family...will they be in the family bubble at several hours drive? Or will they have to pick a nearby friend, if they have one?

Will there be a limit on how many members of a household can be in work/school if they want to be in a bubble? Obviously the more contacts each household has in that way will extend the possible reach and damage of them seeing others. For example, if someone working from home and just doing shopping sees someone else in the same position, both living alone, then even if one gets it and passes it to the other it may stop there. But if a family with two key worker parents and children in school merge with a similar family, then the chain of contacts it could spread to is daunting.

That's not even to mention the arguments and emotional fallout. The failure to take precautions once mixing. It is much too fraught with difficulty to be properly applied, and pretty much impossible to police. So it will be a fast track to chaos.

Maybe it would be better to stick with seing people from several households, like now, but only in a socially distanced way. Right now it's outside at 2 m in a pair only, but that could be adapted. Or, people who live alone can have one person they can mix with. I don't know, but there has to be a better way.

The whole thing is

please stop wasting time and energy fretting ...this has NOT be announced as something that is happening

FOR THE LAST TIME. It is in the guidance that they are considering it. Don’t dismiss valid discussion as pointless ‘fretting’.

I'm 'fretting' as according to the guidance they are considering it as part of phase 2, which means at the absolute earliest it will be June 1st before we can see family members (meeting up for a socially distanced outdoor chat isnt possible for us for lots of reasons). This just seems so far away, even if it does happen on june 1st.

I can see how it might work for some people. For myself the bubble will be a nightmare. My parents will expect to be in my bubble. I can't plead the mother in law as she lives too far away.

I don't get on with my mother and every visit to her fills me with dread. So any socialising I will get to do will be worse than not doing any.

I’m worried about choosing between grandparents do you think this will actually happen? I have a baby and I want to see both I don’t think I could choose I just want both grandmothers to be able to hug my baby.

People will just have to choose one household. It will be difficult for some, but helps prevent the spread. For people who’ve spent months completely alone this is going to be brilliant! Meeting up in a park at a distance with a friend is something, but to be able to sit at home with another human will be amazing.

Exactly. I never though I would be so excited at the thought of seeing someone from 2 metres away in a park, but to actually have someone come into my flat and give me a hug would be absolutely brilliant.

I think they’ll just have to very clearly spell out what the bubble is for - i.e. vulnerable people to receive help, those living alone to spend time with others, one household to provide childcare for another.

Yes, agree so much!! It should be a specific thing for people who are alone to join a household. Targets the people who need it most whilst keeping overall risk low.

I agree completely. It isn't intended to give people back their normal social life and allow them to see all the people they used to see pre-lockdown, if it was they might as well just end lockdown. It's targeted at the people who really need it. If some of the general public complaining that it won't work and demanding more than one household, influences the government to decide against doing this, I will be so upset.

People already have allowed multiple household bubbles... I live with my 2 children, my partner lives with his. We could have moved in together. His children could see their mum. My children could see their dad who lives with his partner and her 3 children who have 3 different dads who they could be seeing who might live with whoever else (they don’t).

People already have allowed multiple household bubbles... I live with my 2 children, my partner lives with his. We could have moved in together. His children could see their mum. My children could see their dad who lives with his partner and her 3 children who have 3 different dads who they could be seeing who might live with whoever else (they don’t).**

Exactly so why can’t my baby see both grandparents it’s not fair, I can’t choose between them.

Exactly so why can’t my baby see both grandparents it’s not fair, I can’t choose between them.

Then you'd have to choose neither and count yourself lucky you get to have a baby and a partner, whilst some of us have our family-less status rubbed in our faces by being isolated for the past 7 weeks.

Or if I were you I'd wait a week/two after having the baby (ie. after having contact with others) and assuming both sets of grandparents have been isolating, just see them both. Obviously it'd have to be a bit of a one-off or wait a while until next visit whilst isolating in the meantime.

nex18 I live with my 2 children, my partner lives with his. We could have moved in together.

Then you'd be one household.

His children could see their mum. My children could see their dad who lives with his partner and her 3 children who have 3 different dads who they could be seeing who might live with whoever else (they don’t).

Yes, it sucks and it's really unfair that some people put the overall risk up whilst others who would be less risk can't see anyone. But they obviously decided the damage caused by splitting up children from parents was too great to not allow it. The social bubble idea needs to be targetted in the same way - aim it at those who most need adult company, ie. people living alone, lone parents and carers.

Is only me that thought the 1 household is with phase 2 so June? Struggle to read it on my phone

There isn’t a date yet

I’d rather have done the family bubble before schools going back which will inevitably make things more dangerous for everyone and no doubt raise the R rate above 1. Absolutely ridiculous for the government to send schools back before allowing loved ones to meet up.

For people who’ve spent months completely alone this is going to be brilliant!

Yes, assuming that whoever you want to see is of the same mind. I have close friends but they all have commitments to other family members so I wouldn’t dream of expecting them to make me first on the list to join their “bubbles”. So I’ll just soldier on by myself for even longer (I should point out that really I’m doing ok, but the prospect of this situation has made me feel a little bit sorry for myself).

I have close friends but they all have commitments to other family members so I wouldn’t dream of expecting them to make me first on the list to join their “bubbles”.

This is why they should be making it for peole who live alone only. So if families want to see someone, they have to pick someone on their own.

Never has it ben so cruelly demonstrated how little society cares about people if they don't have partner/children.

@TurtleTortoise

I am sorry you don’t have children and feel lonely but I do count myself lucky to have a baby I have had multiple misscarriages and my baby nearly died at birth. You should try not to feel people are rubbing it in your face you don’t know everyone’s story’s.

I don't think it will make any difference to us. No family for hundreds of miles, would find it impossible to choose between my parents and MIL even if they were closer, and I don't think we'll be the priority for anyone locally who all seem to have family local to them.
Of course, if I got really desperate I could post on the local FB community group to ask if anyone is in the same position!

I don't think it will help us. Family aren't local, friends will choose family over us. It will probably work OK for others though.

@TurtleTortoise someone who lives alone might not want to be forced into a bubble with someone’s children!

@TurtleTortoise I know where you are coming from. I saw the proposal about the bubble and as a lone parent who has no family nearby (4 hour drive away) then who would pick me? Nobody. I lost my relationship in month 1 or otherwise I'd have been desperate to see my boyfriend but things won't change for me.

Lone parent already in a bubble with selfish useless ex who is now too busy for contact and was still shagging his gf in lockdown before he dumped her.

I already see grandkids visiting opposite, sons and daughters saying hello to next door and lots of happy families already in their units. I've not seen another adult who I have any feelings about for 2 months and it's going to stay that way.

I can't even meet friend for social distance walk because I now have d's 24/7 since ex flaked out on me. So fed up.

Maybe I should start ignoring it like most people around here seem to be.