I'm really scared. Not allowed to wear a mask at work

[LavenderLilacTree]

It's just to vent really as I know there is no way round it.

I am really scared. I am a TA and when all the pupils are back in school we aren't allowed to wear face masks or any PPE. Social distancing is not going to happen.

The government have said only go back to work if it's safe and you can ensure social distancing, well it's not going to be safe for me. Government say to wear face coverings in enclosed spaces but teachers and TAs are not allowed to.

I am scared. I am in my 40s and have 3 children in Yr 8, Yr 7 and Yr 5 . I know it's a 3% chance of dying but to me that's not an insignificant risk. I would never take part in any activity that had a 3% chance of dying.

I just feel like the government doesn't value my life. This is a deadly virus that KILLS, i want to wear a mask. My life matters to me, my husband and my children.

It's scary at work at the moment but we only have 4- 7 kids in. When we have a full school it's going to be impossible to stay 2 meters apart so therefore you feel I should at least be able to wear a mask.

I love my job and the children at school but I don't want to give my life for it. I just think I should be able to have some form of protection. It's like my life doesn't matter.

Risk of death= v v v low

Risk of hospitalization =v low (especially in UK where not taking people to hospital unless very severely ill seems to have been the name of the game).

Risk of long-term effects= unknown but plausible

Risk of weeks off work/feeling terrible/having prolonged recovery period not feeling ok/unable to care for self or child= low but definitely higher than all of the above!

I have two friends who have had it, and lots of friends whose friends have had it, and everyone says more or less the same- (and they are all, by and large, slim white women under 50)- it floored them, they were out of action for several weeks, felt like nothing they'd had before, and all had post-viral type fatigue afterwards that went on weeks (and not all feel ok, even yet).

I do also know a couple of people who had it and were mildly affected, one was much younger (older teen) and a man that I know.

Obviously lots of people I know of might have had it asymptomatically as well, but this talk of death rates being so low is masking the fact that within my friendship circles, people have got sick, no-one has died of Covid yet but had they been trying to work/look after their children, it would have been massively difficult with Covid, and they may yet have ongoing issues just as with polio that come back years later.

I'm going to teach at university face to face in Sept if asked to, I want to keep my job in an uncertain universe and am prepared to risk the above. As a single parent, though, with no-one to look after the children, I have thought about how difficult it would be to have Covid-19. And unpleasant. And possibly longterm cause disability/fatigue which would really affect my employment prospects.

It's not all about dying!

@Bluntness100 there is increasing amounts of data about the diverse range of symptoms and the long recovery times. But as it's early in a pandemic of a novel virus, the data is largely anecdotal. If we have to wait a year to get longitudinal data we are overlooking the very real experiences of a large number of people, and putting people at risk of health problems in the interim.

It is VERY unreasonable that the OP reckons there is a 3% death rate. Because there isn't. So she isn't thinking of risk in a realistic way, is she?

But the answer isn't to be unkind to her about her anxiety and misconceptions that feed it. The answer is to reassure her with the facts without mocking her. As it is, she's probably left the thread and is very likely no less anxious about starting work again.

In reply to the hairdresser question, you must be able to see that this is low priority? Having nice looking hair has a negligible benefit to society versus the risk. Reopening schools would always take precedence and allowing fairly unnecessary contact in hairdressers/beauty salons will be last to be reintroduced.

Added to that, I would imagine a hairdresser would have close prolonged contact with say 10 different people (of widely varying vulnerability) per day so that is close contact with around 50 different people a week. A different scenario to a class of the same 15 children of the same age everyday.
A hairdresser would also have to consider their social responsibilities. Should they allow customers who are elderly, have health conditions? How would that be vetted or controlled?
The risks outweigh the benefits.

In my post on the previous page I said if you are a 39, slim white, female with no underlying conditions that increase risks your individual risk is very low. Age 39 is being conservative as risk regarding age really only goes up significantly above age 60, other variables aside.

• to clarify my comment above i am referring to risk of death. I do think the risk of long term health problems is a possible concern. Early days though on that front.

All the teachers on here who say they won't go back , have you not been working for key workers . Every teacher I know has , even if just a few days every couple weeks on a Rota .
It doesn't say you can't wear one it says not recommended so why not speak to your head teacher to ask if you are allowed

Long term health risks are definitely an unknown. I do feel concerned about that. But not enough to paralyse me with fear.

Also in other European countries they have started their schools back gradually so we can monitor it then
All o see is people saying they don't want to go back until September as though it's going to magically disappear by then ? It's a maybe for June it's not a definite

Easily anxious, I reckon you need a new name. You sound optimistically cautious!

If we have to wait a year to get longitudinal data we are overlooking the very real experiences of a large number of people, and putting people at risk of health problems in the interim

You need to qualify a large number of people. Because a tiny minority get very ill most have no to low symptoms, most even with hospitalisation make a full recovery.

There is no way round that fact. None what’s so ever. There is no way round the fact healthy people below 65 tend to have minor to no symptoms.

Now I’m fully aware that apparantly there is a whole host of mumsnetters scaring the shit out of each other and claiming to have had it and will have long term consequences, and there are a few scare stories in the media. However in terms of factual data it seems there are no such reliable findings for large numbers of people with long term complications..

Right now we can only deal in facts. And the fact is very few healthy people get seriously ill with this. And if people do get longer term health implications, as they do with flu or pneumonia or any other respiratory illness it will be a very small percentage. That is fact.

And as for hair dressers versus schools, I am also unsure why with the correct Ppe and social distancing this can’t occur like in other countries. I suspect it’s like a pp said, low priority for the government. Not that it’s particularly a risk.

The big issue with this disease that people really really need to grasp is it’s called a silent killer for a very, very good reason.

Nearly everyone who has it, below 65 and with no underlying health conditions will not even know they have it. They will be contagious.

They will go see their friends, their families, go to work, go to the shops. The hairdressers thinking they don’t have it and don’t know anyone who does. Because the person they got it from also had no symptoms. And the person that person got it from had no symptoms. And the person they got it from thought they had a minor cold or hay fever.

And they will pass it on. And the more people who have it the more people will infect others. And the more it spreads the more vulnerable or elderly people will get infected and get seriously ill or die. And the more the nhs gets overwhelmed and then gets breached.

It is a logistical nightmare dealing with a disease that kills the elderly or vulnerable when the vast majority of people don’t even know they have it and are contagious

You need to slowly release society and watch people’s behaviour. Watch the infection rate. Because it’s a silent killer

How many threads are on here for people saying why can’t I go see my mum if I can go to work. They can’t grasp it. They also think the risk is they will die. They don’t understand the risk is they will get it, not know and pass it on to someone who will get very ill or die.

So if you’re below 65 and healthy and you have it,,,you will be contagious and not know you have it and give it to your mum if you go see her. Who might also be fine but she will get it and then give it to her elderly diabetic neighbour, who may actually die after spending a month in hospital. Or give it to her obese friend, who may also die, laying in the bed next ti the elderly neighbour.

That’s the fundamental issue. Not everyone is going to die or get long term sick.

The issue is it’s a silent killer and people spread it not knowing they are doing so because they feel fine and the people they know feel fine.

@Daffodil101 no just on top of reading all that's out there . Of course I'm worried but I also don't think it's going to magically disappear so we have to learn to live along side it unfortunately

@nearlyalmost50, though it is early days I hear you about concerns of possible long term as in chronic health problems. I have had ME for 22 years, severely last 16 years following a viral infection. I am not saying people with CoVid will get M.E, but I appreciate that there are a small number of people who have long term health problems post virus.

Still reckon you should change your name! I get a bit anxious too. I’ve had to dig deep these last couple of months to find my big girl pants ❤️

Even though we have good reason to be cautious, I know that my DDs need to be back in school. The consequences for them of a prolonged lockdown far outweigh the risks to our health, which can be mitigated against. They're already struggling. DD1 about not going to her out of school activities or seeing either Grandma, and DD2 because she's really missing her school friends.

You can wear a mask if you want.

When it comes to schools I think as a staff member you will have to do have to do much as you can to reduce risks. I am not relying upon anyone else and so will be armed with masks, wipes, hand gel and gloves when I go in.

Haven't read the full thread but could you not wear a full face visor which would be better as it will offer you protection and the children will still be able to see your face. Don't these offer more protection than masks? I know some nurses wear them and I have seen some shop staff wearing them.

I would never take part in any activity that had a 3% chance of dying.

Firstly, it's less than 3%. Secondly, have you never been on a plane, in a car, crossed the road, socialized with people? CV is not the only virus around that can kill people you know.

When I have to see patients face to face, I’m going in with a kit I’ve assembled myself. I’m not relying on anyone!

Face visor for me!

@Bluntness100

Scare stories?? Excuse me, but it's actually my day to day experience now, as it is for several other people, on here and on the news. Calling them 'scare stories' is very dismissive of other people's experiences.

I've been careful to emphasise that I already had Chronic Fatigue Syndrome following the pneumonia last year. It started as flu, and it was a shock to be diagnosed as having pneumonia. Just because I forgot to have the flu jab the previous November (something I'd only just started to have). But the other two on the news had been healthy beforehand, from what they said. It might be unlikely for most healthy people under 60, but it sadly happens to some of us.

I admit that it's probably also a case of my chickens having come home to roost, as I have been an on/off secret drinker due to my PTSD and I'm overweight. (A lot of younger people are overweight, which does explain why some have been badly impacted, I suspect.)

A lot more people have underlying health conditions than people think. My DH is 54 and has asthma, yet he hasn't had a day of sick leave in over 5 years, so no one would think of him as having an underlying health condition.

People are right to be scared. But they are focusing on the wrong thing to fear.

If fifty percent of people have no symptoms and are conatagious. Think about that, think about what that means for society. Think about how deadly this makes this virus. How easy it is to spread.

No symptoms does not mean not conatagious. This is not chicken pox where you and everyone else can see you have it.

This is if you have it you won’t know and you will spread it, it can run rampant through your population, and then the elderly and vulnerable will get very ill and have a high chance of death. And your health care symptom becomes overwhelmed.

Why do people think it is still spreading so much? It’s not because people are sick and ignoring it. It’s because people have it and don’t know and are spreading it, and then people who are vulnerable get sick and die, or people who aren’t get high viral loads, and also get sick and die, because they spent a prolonged time with someone they didn’t know had it.

Healthy children and working adults should not fear it for themselves. They should fear it because it spreads silently and fast. From what appears to be healthy people.

That I do agree with you on. It's the reason why the prospect of our DDs going to school is a scary one, because we won't know if someone has it. But that can happen in Tescos when my DH is shopping. It's the reason why I'm not going to let myself be dictated to by fear.

it might be unlikely for most healthy people under 60, but it sadly happens to some of us

No one is saying there is no risk, and I would personally classify you as having a higher risk. But we need to be honest and say only 150 deaths of healthy people under 65. Possibly some more longer term health implications as there are for things like pneumonia or flu. We can’t under estimate how many healthy adults and children there are in the Uk below 65.

And people can categorise themselves and behave accordingly. Your risk is you get ill and potentially die or have longer term health issues. The ops risk is she gets it and passes it on to someone who is vulnerable and doesn’t know it. That’s her risk

It’s not she will die. It’s she will pass it on, and that person may pass it on and someone will get sick, be hospitalised, die. Because they were elderly, obese, or chronically ill.

That’s her big risk. Your big risk is different. The two risks do not have to be the same.

@Guylan

The 0.1% death rate for flu is a very rough and ready figure that’s potentially misleading when comparing to Covid-19.

Take the 2017-18 flu season in the USA, reckoned to be the worst in 40 years. 80,000 died with 49m people estimated to have been sick. Given up to 3/4s of people have flu asymptomatically, 200m or so were infected.... probably enough with seasonal variability to give herd immunity to the 330m population. 80,000 out of 330m is a death rate of 0.02%, and that’s for a bad season.

Even if we take some of the very low bound estimates for Covid mortality, they are a lot higher than this. However, they are still well below 3% and massively lower for a fit 40-something.

No symptoms does not mean not conatagious. This is not chicken pox where you and everyone else can see you have it.

I believe chickenpox is contagious for up to 3 days before the onset of the spots.