Why not secondary schools?

[barbites]

I get that getting primary kids to school will help some parents get back to work. But as a parent of a year 10 child I'm confused why it's only a hope that they might return before September. Theories on this?

We have been explicitly advised by unions that zoom meetings should not be held for a number of reasons.

Interesting to hear you say that. Our Trust have decided against it too and have given the parents numerous (very valid in my opinion) reasons. I hadn't realised the Union stance.

@bookishtartlet I try every day to motivate my children! I'm also running a community mental health team from home, so I'm quite busy as well.
If any of their work was marked (my kids) perhaps there would be more motivation...

@barbites I agree if ds knew that teachers were going to mark his work he would put more than likely put more effort in. He's doing what's been given (not a teacher dig- I'm sure there are valid reasons they have decided not to do this)

^^Sorry for the badly written post
I agree if ds knew that teachers were going to mark his work he would more than likely put more effort in (not a teacher dig- I'm sure there are valid reasons they have decided not to do this)

"I'm not teacher bashing....I'm just saying teachers have done nothing since March." Well I'm not parent bashing but since there is a multitude of resources available online alongside anything schools have made available, why haven't you ensured your child is keeping on top of things? Hm? And don't give me that WFH crap. That's only a few hours a day. What about evenings? Weekends? Lunch breaks? Come on. Fewer excuses. Just get on with it! (And yes I KNOW that's unreasonable but that's exactly how you are treating teachers who have been told they are not allowed to go into school and teach your kids and many of whom have also been told they are not to do zoom lessons/videos/contact parents unless contacted first, as has been pointed out a million times on these teacher bashing threads).

My DP is a secondary school teacher. They are not doing Zoom lessons but they are creating/adapting resources and setting work daily (already had an online platform for this in place), as well as communicating via Google Classroom, calling tutees once a week, monitoring and responding to work being done (and not done), plus Zoom staff meetings.
The SLT decided early on that any work set during this period should either be revision or something that will be revisited upon return to school. They won't be tested on this material without going through it thoroughly. I'm sure there will be much discussion to be had about next year's exams though.

I know in my daughters secondary school they have 8 different sets in each year.
That means these sets depending on what set you are for different subjects will be a lot of children mixing.
The only reason why I think the younget children is going first is for childcare,year 6 for transition and to end there primary school days properly.
I do think year 10 should get priority most definitely for secondary school.

The latest Ofqual document does say they will look at 2021 exams once 2020 is sorted.

The statement from Boris sort of implied that Y10 and Y12 might have some face to face contact with their teachers in July, but didn’t sound as if they were going to have lessons. I wonder if that will be when they find out what is going to happen about exams next year.

One reason for Reception and Y1 is the low risk for this age children and also their parents I think. The parents will normally be in their 30s or earlier 40s, they are at low risks as well. But for secondary school children, their parents are generally in 40s and earlier 50, the risks for them are greater.

@theclangersbigplan that sounds great, I'd be really happy with that input.

I think its about transport systems mostly.
Then about disadvantaged children and the language gap as an after thought.

Flowerpeaceful what about the risk for all the staff in a school? Many of who are well over 40!

They accept reception kids cant social distance, but there is scientific evidence that years years are less likely to die of covid that older children

One reason for Reception and Y1 is the low risk for this age children and also their parents I think. The parents will normally be in their 30s or earlier 40s, they are at low risks as well

But they can still spread it?

Because with a y10 child you can still go to work and pay your taxes even if they are at home.

Probably childcare but also...

Secondary:
Including form will be in 6 different classrooms with 5 different changeover periods in corridors that aren't 2m wide
Will not be in the same group of students all day
(Any change to the above two will be ineffective educationally due to setting and/or supply teacher effect (ask your children how much work gets down when there's a supply teacher, even if it's internal))
Transport to school
Behaviour
Parents will be older, more likely to be at risk
More male teachers, who are more likely to be at risk

Also, age group 10+ themselves more at risk

@Beawillalwaysbetopdog they children could stay put and teachers move? Won't work for all lessons but must be ways around this...

There are not enough teachers or classrooms to do this as per the social distancing guidelines. Classes of 30 will have to be split into 3, and there are neither the rooms nor the teachers to do this. Plus, public transport as others have said.

My Year 2 son has been much more compliant with social distancing than some of the Year 10 have been/will be. As soon as secondary schools are back, in any capacity, we are ending social distancing, by default.

@barbites if your kids are not getting work to do then speak to your school as a matter of urgency.

I am giving my Year 10s three pieces of work to complete every week which they then share/uploa/ Granted one piece may be a quiz but I teach 60 Year 10 students otherwise I would drown in the volume that is uploaded. The quiz needs some work to read & watch before they complete it.

I think the CV debacle shows that students have to work so that we can have evidence of working towards/working at/working beyond levels

Strange how yesterday there was uproar on here about any schools opening as all dc we’re apparently super spreaders and children were dying too and there was no way any child could socially isolate. Today the general consensus is that under 10s don’t die from or spread CV. It’s now just secondary school pupils who are the super spreaders and dying apparently and apparently their behaviour suddenly deteriorates meaning they go around licking things all the time and will not follow rules. It’s frightening.

It’s insulting to say year 2s are better at socially isolating than year 10s.

Barbites - no, that's what I mean by if we change it then it becomes educationally ineffective. Not every y10 has the same subjects (options). They have different sets, different classes, different options so will be in 5 different sets of children. If students stayed in their form groups they wouldn't have their normal teachers (hence the supply teacher effect) and you'd have all the abilities being taught at once, making differentiation really difficult. For science some will be doing triple, some core higher, some core foundation - that would be like trying to teach 3 lessons at once.
The only way to stop lots of movement of students would be to say right today you have maths all day, tomorrow you have English all day etc. Or to copy the existing keyworker child model and make it one teacher supervising work that's been set remotely. But we don't have enough textbooks, laptops etc for this?

Primary is logistically simpler because one teacher does everything. This isn't possible at secondary school so movement is built in to the system.

Banana, I wouldn't say that but the system for teaching y2 allows much better social distancing than y10 (see my earlier post).

Strange isn't it, almost as if millions of people use MN and different people have different opinions. The news about under 10s is not new, Switzerland allowed interaction with under 10s weeks ago. It's why primary schools have been the first to open in many countries and was always going to be how England unlocked schools first of all. Unfortunately I live in Wales where Drakeford is refusing to engage.

@bigbananafeet12 I agree if ds knew that teachers were going to mark his work he would more than likely put more effort in (not a teacher dig- I'm sure there are valid reasons they have decided not to do this)

I'm sitting at my desk (actually my dressing table) every day, on timetable, pouncing at all the work submitted so it gets marked with feedback pretty much instantly.

I still only have around a quarter of my assigned classes "showing up" and far fewer of them actually completing the work. (Last week about 5% of them completed the work I set.)

I know that this could be for a huge variety of reasons, including access to technology, caring responsibilities, etc, but to say that they would turn up if work was marked is not my experience.