Coming off furlough with no childcare/school available?

[trulyconfuseddotcom]

Hello - did I miss something in the speech or press briefing tonight? I don't understand what happens if you and any partner have jobs where you can't WFH and you have kids whose years won't be going back to school by 1 June. So if you are on furlough but your employer now expects you to return to work after tonight's announcement - then what? Is there any guidance??? They obviously can't be expecting parents to leave kids at home alone all day! But also not really fair to expect child-free people to go back and those with children not? Thanks.

That was the just yes. If you can’t work from home back to work and nobody knows who’s having the kids

• jist

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/mumsnet_campaigns/3904046-Campaign-to-highlight-how-mad-WFH-with-kids-is-during-lockdown?

One of the reasons an employer can give for furlough is due to childcare commitments - you'd have to decide who goes back and who stay on furlough presumably until the end of May or end of June when the scheme is due to close

I’d expect the furlough arrangements for childcare commitments to remain - Realistically it has to!

I'm sorry you are in such a difficult situation.

The legislation already allows for people to travel to work, even where it is not 'essential' work. Many workplaces (not including certain industries like clothing retail, hospitality and leisure) never had to close. Travel to and from 'unessential' workplaces, where those workplaces were allowed to be open, was never prohibited.

There is obviously a broader and very important question about safe workplaces, and whether or not people can be compelled to attend what they might consider to be an unsafe workplace. I understand this is a really important issue that many people rightly feel very strongly about, but I wont go into that here.

The general impression I've taken from the media is that many employers seem to have taken the the 'stay at home' message to mean that none of their employees could come to work. They therefore furloughed everyone.

I think the government are now trying to clarify the original position about how they never intended for so many people to be kept off work (rightly or wrongly).

People who cannot work from home, but cannot attend their workplace because of childcare responsibilities, are still allowed to be furloughed. Hopefully employers will continue to use this option for people in your situation.

If your employer insists that you attend work, and you cannot as you do not have childcare, then yes you are in a very difficult situation.

You obviously cannot leave your children alone. If you refuse to attend work, and your employer refuses to furlough you, you may be able to take unpaid parental leave. You may be able to take annual leave, which would be paid but is obviously limited. Your employer may offer some other kind of unpaid leave.

Your employer may threaten disciplinary action if you do not return to work. They would (so long as you have 2 years service) have to go through a fair process before terminating your employment for your refusal to attend work. It would depend on all of the circumstances as to whether refusing to furlough an employee rather than dismissing them could be fair.

I really hope your employer is understanding, and makes use of the furlough scheme.

Schools are still open to look after the children of parents who have to work.

@Zombiefan
Schools are only open for parents of key workers. The government's message today was that all workers, key or not, so long as they are not in a closed industry, should be doing their best to go to work. Schools aren't open for the children of non-key workers.

Schools are only open for parents of key workers
Not true
a) They are also open for vulnerable children and a few other categories.
b) Key workers is a verrrrry broad category.
c) Head teachers have the discretion to look after any child they deem needs it.

@zombiefan

Yes,fair enough, but they are not open for everyone. And although key workers is a broad category, it does not include all workers.

BlueRaincoat1
I agree with you but I know my DCs school has said it will look after any child of parents who really have no alternative. They were originally expecting and had planned for about 25% of children to be in but only 1% turned up.

So OP should really contact school and explain situation, I imagine they will have space and be understanding (as long as everyone doesn't do it).

ZombieFan that really won't be the case. If the govmt is sending back just one or two year groups so that they can assess the impact of this on the R rate, then the school will not be able to say 'oh of course we will take the children of anyone who has to go to work'.

I imagine things will change with schools as uptakes increase. They will need more staff in, social distancing becomes harder and setting online work suffers. However some schools will have space so it is worth contacting them, they may only be able to offer 1 or 2 days but it might help. My children aren't entitled to use our hub because i teach in the hub school, so when I am in its my parents, who is over 70 that has them. 😂😂

Thanks for all replies. It's not myself specifically I'm asking about - it's more that there will be many employees who work in professions unable to WFH, and may now be expected to return to workplaces by employers and government, who will have no childcare as most primary and early secondary school years will not be able to go back to school. Friends/relatives helping out also not an option, with social distancing still in place. What are these people all supposed to do? Take unpaid/annual leave? It just doesn't seem like the announcement this eve has taken that into account, but perhaps I've missed something crucial? It feels like quite a big omission if not.

Head teachers have the discretion to look after any child they deem needs it

And in my DC's school, it has been made really clear that they will NOT be taking in children who they deem able to be looked after at home i.e. if 1 parent is a key worker and 1 is not, the kids have to stay at home with the non-keyworker parent.

If the non-keyworker parent needs to go out to work, they can't. Because our school can't/won't take them.

At the discretion of head teachers isn't a sure thing at all.

But also not really fair to expect child-free people to go back and those with children not? Thanks.

not fair?? its not childless peoples fault!! christ.....if you cant work then thats something for you and your kids dad to sort out.....nothing to do with everyone else who can fulfil work commitments

What are these people all supposed to do? Take unpaid/annual leave? It just doesn't seem like the announcement this eve has taken that into account, but perhaps I've missed something crucial? It feels like quite a big omission if not.

I don't think you've missed anything.

It's a Tory government. They believe in a capitalist system where business sets its own rules. They're just going to say "Speak to your employer" and let the market fight it out.

I mean, hopefully there will be some legal guidance around due process at offering alternatives/flexibility around people's circumstances but at the end of the day they won't force business or continue compensating/paying furlough for much longer.

Childminders should be open on 1st June.

Childminders should be open on 1st June

Childminders and nurseries are fine for pre-school children. If your DC are primary school age, that's no help at all!

Good point, at the time schools start to reopen then lots of childcare options will also be reopening.

Where I work, you would be offered unpaid dependents/parental leave in this situation probably for as long as necessary.

The fact that you have to earn a living to pay bills etc would be tough! (Not my view, but the directors would say this)

@NoSquirrels Childminders care for all ages?

I think you should wait and see what Sunak says on Tuesday about the furlough scheme as he will be delivering an update then

Hi @DahliaDay - not sure if I wasn't very clear, what I meant was that it wouldn't seem very fair if child-free people were expected to return to work while those with primary aged children were staying at home on furlough, if you see what I mean. But it's not the fault of parents if the schools are closed so they need to look after children at home and are therefore unable to attend their workplace, surely?

What about people who don't have kids but rely on public transport?

DHs firm & many others in the city have said they will be wfh for a considerable number of months as public transport is a huge problem & the companies cannot "force" people to commute incase they catch Covid.