So outbreaks are only in care homes and hospitals. What am I missing?

[mayoral]

In the governments press conference yesterday they said infection rates remain high because of outbreaks in two places: care homes and hospitals. They said transmission within the community was small and well below R1.

So why can't we contain care homes and hospitals and get on with our lives now??

[EricaNernie]

its a tough enough ask for care workers currently Anyway without this added suggestion.
and even if they do it for 2 weeks they can't do it forever.

[worldsworststepfordwife]

Don’t take this the wrong way not goady genuine question can health workers tell us how exactly does the infection spread?
I want to be more informed about what’s genuinely going wrong in those different settings from the horses mouth?
Or is it bullshit, I’m always aware that we’re told what they choose to tell us

[BeltaneBride]

In France care home costs have to be paid for by relatives when the person's own money runs out. That could never get thru Parliament here -just imagine the outry if it were suggested! But if it did a whole lot more families would accommodate their old relatives.

[DurhamDurham]

All the hotels in the country are empty, can't care home staff and hospital staff be housed there as an option? Test them everyday? Isolate them if they're showing symptoms? Can't be that difficult??

I'm sure my daughter would be delighted to stay in a hotel after her shift as a nurse, not sure what would happen to her two year old daughter when nursery closes. Or should nursery just keep her too so that you can get back to normal asap?

[quietheart]

Fucking hell your definitely missing something

You propose to virtually imprison a huge proportion of our society so that you can carry on as normal? Effectively sacrificing themselves for the greater good?

Is your name Donald?

What is your plan for their families? Would the hotel staff need to live in the hotel also?

Who is going to replace them as they die off?

[Klouise777]

You've definitely not thought this through. You're expecting staff that work in health care settings to completely give up their freedom, seeing loved one and children, help out at home with partners who are working from home and juggling childcare and so on for an extended period of time all you you can go about your day as normal? Back shopping and coffee drinking perhaps. Wow.

[Derbygerbil]

@PestymcPestFace

Statistics from virtually every country have shown significant outbreaks in care homes, with significant numbers of deaths - around half of all deaths in many places. This is a combination of the fact they are ideal places for the virus to spread, and residents being particularly vulnerable. I haven’t heard of any scientist say that all the stats on care homes coming from countries around the world are wrong.

[TwentyViginti]

All the hotels in the country are empty, can't care home staff and hospital staff be housed there as an option? Test them everyday? Isolate them if they're showing symptoms? Can't be that difficult??

Fucking hell. Are you being goady for a laugh, or are you genuinely a massive twat?

[Teacher12345]

@worldsworststepfordwife Surely you could figure that out? Resident is taken to hospital due to fall/illness etc. No covid tests in the first few weeks so arrives back at nursing home. No symptoms yet so life carries on - even if they isolate the patient in their room, the staff are still caring for them. Staff A gets virus but no symptoms and carries on working, infecting staff members B and C. Staff C is then asked to and work on a different household and infects people there. Staff are working with elderly who pick up the virus and it spreads.

[cushioncovers]

I think I get what you're trying to say op. Is it to let the vulnerable shield/isolate themselves and the rest of us get back to normal??

Sounds good in theory but in reality it just won't work for all the reasons other posters have said.
We've all got to just suck it up and follow the rules for the greater good I'm afraid.

[Lovemusic33]

A select few have had their staff stay on site but obviously it’s not possible for everyone, people have families at home, there’s not always room for people the stay on site. Your never going to get rid of the virus completely and as long as there are some cases there’s always going to be a risk of it spreading and a 2nd wave. All we can do is try and keep cases as low as possible until there is a vaccine, we can do this by staying at home (if we are not key workers) but it’s impossible to lock everyone down.

OP, I wonder how you would feel if you were working in a care home and were told you had to stay there for 10 weeks?

[ilovebagpuss]

@worldsworststepfordwife in our medium sized care home we have done our best but infection gets in. Be it our staff agency staff the catering cleaning or admin staff. Or it could be a hospital return who are not routinely tested unless symptomatic.
Once in unfortunately it is very hard to isolate especially with residents living with dementia or even those with very mild dementia. Just one example is a gentleman who had a new cough we asked him to stay in his room and he came out to cough in the lounge about 20 times a day asking if it was lunch/coffee/had the papers come etc despite being attended to regularly. We don’t have resource to make him sit in his room 24/7. Also we cannot force this not that we would wish to. He tested positive and some staff from that area then tested positive etc etc.
There is no government “plan” to reduce infections in care homes it’s just something they keep saying. We will do our best until we can lock it down ourselves with infection control measures and isolating where possible. That’s it.

[mayoral]

Fuck sake. So there's NOTHING we can do to contain the outbreaks? Nothing? Just mock me? And lockdown the entire country instead. Well done everyone 👏🏼

[thunderthighsohwoe]

So everyone who works in a hospital or care home should leave their young children or caring responsibilities and stay locked up for weeks? Nurses and carers have been underpaid for years, I doubt very much they’d be willing to do that.

[Derbygerbil]

@mayoral

OK, so let’s lock up all hospital and care home workers in hotels, presumably with hotel workers too, and the bus drivers who are presumably needed to ferry those without cars to their hospitals/care homes....

I take it you’ll be volunteering to be a foster carer to the thousands upon thousands of children whose parents have been locked up?... Or will that get in the way of getting your life back to normal.

[cushioncovers]

What do you suggest we do op?

[fascinated]

Ok, don’t flame me, just trying out ideas. What if people who worked in care homes and hospitals (and the teachers and staff their kids come into contact with at school) were allowed to go home but were then given special deliveries of food etc and financial compensation in return for agreeing to continue in lockdown - so that their households would effectively be “self isolating” on a precautionary basis? Would this allow other households to have restrictions relaxed?

I realise this seems unfair which is why I mentioned the financial compensation.

Happy to have flaws pointed out. Just thinking if there are any compromises possible.

[EricaNernie]

hospital staff can stay in hotels, paid for by the NHS, if they want, simply to be safe away from their family
but I am not sure how many have taken up the offer.

[SouthernComforts]

Expecting care home workers to be able to arrange weeks of round the clock childcare whilst they move into work and put themselves at massive risk.. for minimum wage? Even if they could, for what they earn they shouldn't. Unless the care home owners are willing to at least double their pay.

This is not ignoring the fact that residents deserve to be cared for as safely as possible and with care and compassion, but all those things + the carers abandoning their personal lives and family for £8.72 per hour? It's horrible from all sides.

[Inkpaperstars]

It doesn't seem feasible. NHS is the biggest UK employer and staff have family responsibilities.Also, do you cease all outpatient and A and E services? How would anyone ever be discharged? The very nature of the NHS means it has branches throughout society. What does it mean for the rest of us to 'get on with our lives' in a way that would prevent the R outside hospitals and care homes rising above one fast?

[Peapod29]

But if all the hospitals are empty then why are there still high infection rates? Who is being infected in these empty hospitals? They (government/nhs planning) have caused the outbreak in care homes. They can hardly act surprised. They prepared for the peak by clearing all the ‘bed blockers’, by getting them into care homes. Fair enough, but they then took the virus with them to care homes from hospitals. Care homes were completely unprepared, no PPE for staff etc. Thus major outbreak occurs. It’s a bit of a scandal really.

[midgebabe]

Once the numbers being infected is lower then it is much easier to contain infection breakouts

Test trace contact isolate repeat

But it's very hard to do when numbers are high, which they still are.

[ilovebagpuss]

@mayoral I think it’s really helpful you started the conversation as people genuinely don’t know why we can’t contain infection and it’s helpful to share the struggle.
I’m not saying there is no hope of course but it’s just very hard to lockdown. We seem to be over the peak in our particular home if that counts as a bit of optimism. I wish there was some amazing plan and new ideas but for now it’s treat the same as any outbreak such as the winter vomiting bug isolate where possible and full PPE etc.

[midgebabe]

Hospitals are not all empty. Only none essential and high risk procedures are stopped

[Peapod29]

Oh sorry I misread. You said hotels, not hospitals. Yea I can really see that working.