Schooling - do you think there will be a choice?

[Missmummy88]

I know school threads have been done and no one really has any answers just speculation and guesses.

My question though is do you think we will have a choice whether to send our kids to school should they reopen in June?

In my personal situation dh is a shielder ( cancer and autoimmune and history of stroke) I am currently pregnant on furlough but 90% sure I’m being made redundant should furlough not be extended. If not I can work from home as only work part time online.

My kids have been so happy at homeschool. My 8yo maths has come very far with 1-1 learning (although I appreciate I have focused much more on maths and English than the full range of subjects)

My 5 yo is happy and engaged in the different activities we do, is doing well with handwriting, number formations, counting and reading.

Technically my 8yo falls under pupil premium as the pp stays with the child for 7 years as we claimed benefits while dh was ill when he was in foundation. Stats would say he is disadvantaged by virtue of this, but technically he’s not we are degree educated, no mortgage, financially stable.

I don’t want to send my kids back to school in June, to me it seems too early. The risk for us as a family, I believe, outweighs the benefits. Do you think there will be an element of choice? Particularly for those with shielders in the family?

When schools reopen fully teachers will be teaching there is no point pretending otherwise, in the hope that some parents don’t need to properly home educate.

If you keep your kids home when schools are fully open, for what ever reason then folks need to get serious about home educating and do it properly, no watching telly, messing on the x box, or whatever else. Even six weeks is a lot to lose for kids. And yes it impacts friendship groups if there group is back.

Just because folks on mumsnet are egging each other on. Doesn’t mean the wider population or even a strong percentage of it will keep their kids off school. Not even a large percentage of mumsnetters. Some folks will fight and scream but when it comes to it will be first in line to put their kids back in, whilst whinging about it.

The bottom line is if schools are back you need to properly educate your child at the same time and you need to think of their socialisation and make a balanced judgement call.

The bottom line is if schools are back you need to properly educate your child at the same time and you need to think of their socialisation and make a balanced judgement call.

Yes, you said. What provisions do you think could or should be made so that shielding families can achieve that?

In my opinion, sending kids back in June (for half a term) is just going to cause unnecessary worry and stress for a lot of families.

And how much learning is actually going to happen anyway if kids are only in part time?
If social distancing is to be observed, they will have to stagger / limit numbers by year group. it could mean maybe two year groups in on any one day. So kids in school maybe two days a week at best.
Is it worth the hassle and stress?
Waiting till September would give the virus more time to naturally reduce it’s ‘R’ value surely?

I can’t imagine anyone would mind or penalise you for keeping yours at home with a good reason like your partners helath.

But they will want to make attendance a ‘rule’ to make sure vulnerable kids go in and are not kept at home unsafely, which has been happening very worryingly

Noworries It never being safe applies to everything not just Covid, there is element of risk in most things we can't cocoon our children so they never face any risk as parents we weigh up the risk and make the best choice we can.

Hippo A huge amount of learning can happen! Seriously if they go back 1/6, that is 7 weeks till the summer holiday where I am, everyone who thinks kids piss around for the last term and do nothing are wrong.

I know that a lot of people on here seem to think that September will hold all of the answers but my concern would be that if we wait until September and all start going back to work and school then surely we risk another peak that will coincide with the start of the flu season.

So, you think should send children in to school now to serve as a second wave catalyst?

I suspect a lot of people may end up deregistering if its done too hastily.

I think they'll be staggered returns, the same as jobs.
But when it actually comes down to them all going back, I think if you want to keep your place, not deregister and H.ed then they'll have to return.
i can't see there being a choice because then teachers would have to do online and classroom teaching, and they won't have the time for both.

For those saying that teachers won’t have time to do online learning and offline learning. I totally understand. But we have no online learning anyway? I have fully read and downloaded the expected curriculum for each year group and have been accessing the online resources myself. I don’t know if other schools are doing online learning, but not mine!

My school is doing a full timetable of online lessons. We would not be able to operate a dual system. In the few weeks before school closed some parents are withdrawing their children and asking for work to be provided. We refused to do that, but gave a summary of work covered in the lesson for children to research independently if they wanted to.

I think it may be a staged return, but once they're all expected in, I think it will be send them, or de-register. As PP said, there can't be a full timetable taught online as well as in school.

There will obviously have to be support for shielding families and their children, as they will have to stay at home (at least until we know more about the spread).

*@Missmummy88

I think I get what you are saying. We are in a similar position. Have an extremely vulnerable close household family member only in their 60s. Even if we didn't, I do not want DC to go back until much more is known and treatments/vaccine.

Their education is of great importance to us, they follow all work set plus extra, have a home timetable, we've bought textbooks, they play musical instruments and paint etc. home

However, we are also in pupil premium like you and we are on benefits (me ill but not a covid vulnerable illness, DP a full time carer for said household member). We are in Scotland where you have to seek 'permission' from the local authority to home school. I'm concerned that our socio-economic factors may (wrongly) influence their 'decision'.

Hard to say - if families say they are still self-isolating the dreaded unauthorised attendance rates will be rigged to snow day type code.
Vulnerable pupils would hopefully be monitored further.
Some schools I would imagine will take Business as usual/yay we are back! approach to the pupils and expect parents to back them to get pupils back in routine asap.
Nothing to stop you deregistering from LEA and home educating as long as you are sure there'll be places should you want them to return at a later date/plus social side of it of course. My own teachers would probably be aghast if I chose that for mine as I suspect and they're not wrong they think my home edding is crap which might raise a red flag somewhere.

Dont worry op.
I suspect with a shielded you may be ok.
It is unfortunately the vulnerable who will get f#### over.
Teachers and parents.
However i think the gov need to prepare themselves for a legal challenge if forcing kids in or to deregister.
I for 1 would be on that and support it.
You CANNOT tell people they are vulnerable then say you need to send your kids in. But we will not social distance them.
Not wear masks.
Not reduce class size.
Not clean between sessions.
Health and safety legislation they are putting staff and parents at risk.
Also why the heck should we realistically give a crap about how the gov get the 'vulnerable to abuse/neglect' kids in that is not the problem for people with health issues.
Why are we all being asked to give up our lives for this gov shitshow!
If they go down this route i will be back with #getborisout. (In fact tbh i think we should not have stopped with that).
Why should any parent trust the gov who have led us into herd immunity and never checked anyone coming in from airports.
It is completely possible they itend on getting the second wave out the way and increasing herd immynity by using the children and the parents

I wouldn't think it would be officially optional but given the household isolation rules are expected to apply, it will probably be optional in practice as parents can just say someone in the household is showing symptoms and keep them off for two weeks.

@Keepdistance

You are absolutely right that is isnt your problem and there is no reason you should "give a crap" about the vulnerable kids or the widening disadvantage gap, but the government is legally responsible and it is their problem.

Whatever actions the government take there are inevitably always people that it was right for and people that it wasnt. The government has to prepare for legal challenges resulting from every option and need to do the best they can to try to limit harm and maximise the collective good for as many people as possible. There is no magic answer that is best for everyone.

I think it should be optional until kids are offered full-time education and people who are shielding/over 70 are no longer confined to home

Personally I have a child in y12 doing A-levels next year so I'd like her to go back but if she was as young as yours and living with a shielding parent then I'd keep her at home

Logically June is going to be much safer than it was in Feb and March. We had no idea what was going on, the symptoms etc. Part time school for some years in June, when most adults and kids have been self isolating will surely mean we will never get a peak like this again. Let’s hope so

There might be an exception for children who are immunocomprised themselves but I doubt family members as the numbers would be too high

What is it you think that families who have someone who needs to be shielded should do?

We can see if there’s a second wave by September, or if children start dying in countries where they are going back to school

Just children? You don’t think there is potential for school staff to,start dying en masse?

(It's the vulnerable group below them. Many more children and staff are in those groups. The group who are those vague 'underlying health conditions' we've heard about, rather than just the most vulnerable. We've been told from the start that we are at greater risk and to,take extra care especially with social distancing. What protection will they get?*

My concerns as an at risk teacher who has an at risk child. I hope the Unions will really with it adequately. I minimally want to see some reassurances regarding availability of things like hand sanitiser, PPE (which I personally would happily pay for if it were sourced and offered at cost), funds to pay cleaners to deep clean continually, funds to pay for the supply teachers that are going to be needed to manage people going in and out of quarantine, guidelines around expectations on covering for ill colleagues when it comes to planning and marking..,,but most of all, I want a clear decision on how GCSE and A Level exams will look next year because that is massive and we need to hit the ground running whenever we get back in.

Are there any teachers here who can confirm whether or not parents choosing to keep children at hone would be penalised please?

There are not yet plans to return, much less any guidance as to what schools should/shouldn’t accept.

The schools local to me are assuming there will be social distancing and are currently trying to work out the configurations for this. They are not assuming it will be business as usual.

I'm expecting it to be optional as it may help the social distancing in schools if numbers are lower. Some countries have made it optional and certainly our school could not open at full capacity before lockdown due to numbers of staff off - one year was sent home. With class numbers of 10 or so that issue will treble. Online work may not be provided though. It could be compulsory though - obviously the option to deregister is always there but you may not get a place later in a popular school.

Niece is French and it's voluntary there and they have similar class numbers / cases.

Our village primary is at capacity (big house building drive over the last few years which has pushed numbers up fast). It's classrooms are small in size and quantity. They are already trying to cope with going from one small class in each year group to two large ones over the space of the last 4 years.

There's pretty much zero chance of having social distancing going on if all the kids were in at once because of the issue of lack of space. (even if it was possible to keep a bunch of 6 year olds from hugging each other, fighting each other and licking the equipment while not sellotaped to a desk)

Half days would be a terrible idea. Apart from session length difference, youngsters are much more alert and receptive in the morning - 'afternoon' children wouldn't be taking in much of any of the core subjects.

If they are going back for a childcare reason (and not educational) i would hope it will be optional

No way my workplace would keep paying people if they had a childcare option and did not use it!