Social distancing in schools- mental health

[Myfriendanxiety]

Does anyone else feel that they would rather home school their children indefinitely than send them to a school where they have to social distance?

I really worry about the mental health of children if they are forced to sit alone at desks 2m apart from others without any proper play time or interaction. I just can’t see how this type of schooling is going to be beneficial to children and how it will create a positive learning environment.

My DS has another year before he starts school luckily- but if he were starting in September to a school system based on social distancing then I wouldn’t be sending him.

What happened to lockdown?

I think people are just slowly losing willpower - it's a long time, the weather's getting nicer, things that people had been putting off because it would "only be a few weeks" are gradually becoming more necessary... Given that they built in levels of non compliance I suspect they also built in decreasing compliance to the modelling as it seems pretty inevitable

We must protect our children and society at large and postpone the start of school until we have zero new transmission

I just can't see how that is possible. I know China have claimed that to be the case but really do we believe them.

We cannot cut ourselves of the way that say New Zealand can.

We need to get it as low as we possibly can and then test and contact trace and pray we can manage it.

Are out govt capable of achieving this - I very much doubt it

The whole idea of keeping children out of school until there is zero new transmission is ridiculous - apart from anything it assumes that being out of school for an indefinite period is a zero harm solution, which it isn't.

We must protect our children and society at large and postpone the start of school until we have zero new transmission

Impossible. Even with a vaccination.

Luxembourg
This is an article showing the on going discussion taking place on how the opening of Primary Schools in Luxembourg will be handled.
luxtimes.lu/luxembourg/40512-schools-to-scramble-for-space-if-pupils-return-in-groups
Quote
Primary schools will have to look at how to maximise space as classes could be split into two groups when children return to school at the end of next month.

During a meeting on Friday, education minister Claude Meisch put forward proposals to Syvicol, the organisation in charge of coordinating work with towns and communes.

Meisch suggested that primary school children return in the same way as secondary pupils – by splitting each class into two groups, the body's chairman Emile Eicher said following the meeting.

Half of the class would sit in a classroom with their teacher and the other half would be supervised by education ministry staff in a separate room, rotating on a weekly basis.

Syvicol will now discuss how these measures can be implemented and will meet Meisch again on Tuesday to talk about whether the proposals are feasible.

"If we multiply the classes by two, there will be a need for more rooms so we are now looking into finding rooms and a way of arranging them so that they are secure as a top priority," Eicher said.

He said Meisch suggested primary schools start by opening only in the mornings, from 8am until 1pm. Schools have already been cleaned and the health ministry is expected to put forward recommendations on how often they should be cleaned once pupils return.

Extra-curricular music classes should open only for those aged 15 and above while younger pupils will only be able to start again in September, Eicher said.

Primary schools are due to open their doors from 25 May and each pupil will receive two face masks and hand sanitising gel will be available.

Eicher will now consult mayors in different communes to discuss the proposals
end quote

I work in a nursery, social distancing from anyone is impossible. Small children need to play - and will do so whatever the grown ups say - and they need cuddles and personal care. I can’t see it being much different for children of any age group. Older ones may understand logically the rules but it’s unlikely they will remember them through the whole day just because it’s not the kind of thing you remember when with familiar people.

Tumbleweed101

It's the remembering bit that's hard when you're in that environment. The children all know about it - as do staff who are all observing it strictly otherwise. But get into a school and group environment and it goes out of the window for the reasons you say.

I've been thinking about this a fair bit as a result of this thread and, as much as anything, I think that once the schools go back, it'll be pretty much over because parents/children just won't have it at the forefront of their minds. And I do think that parents will arrange to meet up reasoning that, if the children have been together all day, what's the difference?

And I do think that parents will arrange to meet up reasoning that, if the children have been together all day, what's the difference?

Absolutely it sets out the narrative that all is ok. It really does.

Lots of people who are talking about how social distancing could be done in school - only having a third of the class in at a time, having them at desks 2m apart etc., seem to be forgetting that they are supposed to be there to be educated.
If we have only ten children each day do you think we will be repeating the same lessons for three days in a row and then moving on to the next lesson three days later and repeating three times? How much of the curriculum do you think will get covered in those two months - probably about 2 or 3 weeks worth.
Not to mention if we can't walk around looking at the work children are producing or going over to help them, the quality of the work is likely to be below standard. I actually think our year 6s who are being set daily work on Google Classroom would probably achieve less than they currently are doing.

Of course they are they to be educated. But in terms of staff, children and public health having a third of a class may have to happen.

Meh my child is 6. I can teach him the knowledge he needs. What he’s missing is social interaction. Interaction with other children and adults who aren’t his two parents. It’s very a unnatural situation - humans are tribal.

It will never happen. They don’t have the teachers and I doubt government would agree to this idea as it would be costing x3 as much for all the kids to be taught the same thing. How would parents manage to pick up and drop off at all different days and times for the kids. In reality it’s not practical @TheEmoji

Opening schools 30+ to a class will not happen either any time soon, with the number of deaths we are have been seeing here.

Info from another thread, but this is what’s happening in other countries...

When are your schools returning?

Dates of Returning To School Buildings

Attempted to return face-to-face, then went back online
Northern Japan (they had mandatory masks, temperature checks, and parent choice)

Currently face-to-face
Jiangsu, China (no confirmed transmission for 2 months before they went back, still mandatory masks, 2 temp. checks/day, desks apart)

Tianjin, China (Grades 9 and 12 only, temp. 2x/day, desks apart, classrooms disinfected between each class, assigned seating in cafeteria, students leave campus immediately after school, parents fill out online health form every morning, parent choice)

Denmark (International School of Billund Facebook page includes a 5th grader’s video of a typical school day)

Returning April 26
Norway (Grades 1-4 only, 15 students/class, desks apart, shuffling some children into other classes to make 15/class)

Guangzhou, China (Only 8th & 12th, see how this goes, then stagger rest)

Returning May 4
Berlin, Germany (12 kids/class, students alternate face-to-face days, on home days they do PE, music, art, German, parent choice) (Another teacher reported Grades 12, 11, 10, and 5 only)

Taiwan (mandatory masks and temp. checks, government providing masks affordably to families)

Switzerland (ages 3-4, 7:1 student teacher ratio, if this goes well K-5 will return, no parents in building) (Another teacher reported K-9 returns mid-May, other grades June 9, school year ends June 19)

Shenzhen, China (Grade 9 May 4, everyone else May 11, no Kindergarten, mandatory COVID testing for staff and students before returning, desks and dining apart, temp. checks at entrance, only staff and students on campus)

Queensland, Australia (only for children of essential workers, all others online)

Shanghai (9th & 12th May 4, 11th & 8th May 6, 4, 5, 6, 7, & 10 May 18, body scan equipment at entrance for temp., each class includes infrared thermometer, hand sanitizer, tissues, extra masks, to enter campus scan code to show you have completed quarantine and not been in contact, must have at least 2 masks (school provides for teachers), entire school disinfected 2x/day)

Sweden (Staggered day and hour, only staff & students on campus, parent choice)

Tasmania (only students of essential workers, temp, extra hygiene, no parents)

Returning May 5
Seoul, Korea

Returning May 11
France (max 15/class, parent choice, mandatory masks)
Netherlands
Sydney, Australia (students stagger in-person learning 1 day/week, full capacity by July, online learning other 4 days) (Multiple teachers have confirmed government requires social distancing ONLY for adults (teachers), no social distancing for children)

May 17
Mexico (May 17 regions with no cases, June 1 for regions with cases)

May 18
Belgium (Only a few grades, 10 students/class, kids 12 & up mandatory masks, shortened school day, limited days per/week)

May 25
Luxembourg (one group taught in person, other group online for first week, then switch, no PE or cafeteria, International school, so many diplomats’ children)

June
South India (New school year starts in June)

July 1
Thailand

August
New Delhi
Philippines

No Date Yet
Ecuador
Hong King
Cambodia
Argentina
Quebec, Canada
South Africa
Indonesia
Italy
Abu Dhabi (teacher plans for next fall must include online units)
Hyderabad, India
Spain
Sao Paulo, Brazil
Scotland
Qatar (projecting online in fall)
Cayman Islands, Caribbean
Turkey

@appuskidu
The information above about Luxembourg is so incomplete and just plain wrong that it casts doubt on all the information about every country.
Where did you find this.

I would love to know what difference any of this makes. Retrospective studies will be fascinating.

Haven't had time to read the full thread, but I was hoping we might do something like the ideas outlined in this article ..www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/world/2020/apr/21/lockdown-eased-netherlands-and-france-plan-to-re-open-primary-schools

The information is from a teachers’ group. The replies are based on information about what’s happening for the teachers who have answered. The teacher answering about Luxembourg is talking about their experience in their independent school as is clearly stated.

Nobody is saying it’s what is happening in every state school in the country-it’s just an interesting post with personal experiences.

Of course they are they to be educated. But in terms of staff, children and public health having a third of a class may have to happen.

Meh my child is 6. I can teach him the knowledge he needs. What he’s missing is social interaction. Interaction with other children and adults who aren’t his two parents. It’s very a unnatural situation - humans are tribal.

I suppose my point is, by doing this what are we hoping to achieve? They won't really learn anything, they can't socialise properly and it can't even be said to allow parents back into the workforce because the children would only be in school one or two days a week. At least at the moment the children of key workers and vulnerable children can be in every day if needed.

It might not be practical, but the unions will support it. And as they are protecting their members we will listen to them rather than Boris

And they don’t have the teachers now. Some are ill, some isolating and some shielded.

@gingganggooleywotsit I not sure how that could work here. It says they are sending half the pupils in the morning and half in afternoon with classes of less than 10. We have 30 pupils in each primary class so would need three shifts. Then most kids at our school receive school transport will they do all these extra school run. I can't see the council paying for that.

Many teachers are also parents and so if they stagger school opening then there will be lots more key worker children needing full time care.

What union would support such a idea??? You might as well not bother at all. I’m sure it won’t be the union that has the final say.... that would put us in a worse situation than we already in for all those who need to work. Hopefully 5 months from now things will have improved.
Teachers only isolate for 2 weeks max and they would be able to resume teaching and as for shielding maybe some will have to reconsider their career until a successful vaccination appears.

I would love to know the Ro value of countries opening schools bet they are lower than ours.

I would love to know the Ro value of countries opening schools

Ours are open to all workers who can't have their kids at home, and a staggered return starts in two weeks.

Our RO as of yesterday was 1.11 (an increase after being consistenly under 1).